If you have a friend who is a narcissist, should you take any of their actions personally?

I think there comes a time when you just have to accept people as who they are. You can’t really expect much from a narcissistic person and there’s a good chance they aren’t going to change.

Of course – the point is can you change how you react to them so that you are not being hurt by them?

@janbb That would come with acceptance. If you know a person is going to react (or not react) in a certain way you need to remember that and realize that they’re not doing it to hurt you, they just don’t think about it.

Narcissists are emotional vacuums and I do my best to keep my distance from them. They can only hurt you if you let them so I give them as little time as I can or try to engage them in situations or environments that provide me a safe out or back up so as to minimize Mr. or Mrs’s “Me” less opportunity to monopolize the moment.

I have a narcissist friend named “Small Dose Denise” ;)

I would ignore it. Let him/her be full of herself. People will be people at the end of the end of the day and they usually don’t change. So, accept it and move on.

From experience, the options for dealing with these situations boil down to personal choice really. If the person you believe to be a narcissist is so close that you know you cannot keep a ‘safe distance’, then you need to find a way to look after yourself. If they are someone that you could imagine seeing less of, or relying on less, then finding strategies to do so is absolutely necessary.

For a very close relationship, @mrentropy‘s response is simple and to the point. It takes work, but can be done. For the less close, then the more distance the better, for your own wellbeing. It is simplistic to label all narcissistic people as ‘emotional vacuums’, they are not necessarily that – more likely they are terrified of being exposed as tiny, vulnerable and weak. As I write I just saw @lucillelucillelucille‘s response…Hoho, I have a sister by that name…!!! She’s only slightly narcy… Small doses is it though!

Never, ever beat yourself up over how you feel or respond to this person. They won’t care any the more for your pain. Empathy is simply not in their capability, any sense that they are ‘feeling sorry for you’, will be based in what emotional pay off they believe they can get for themselves. It is a truly unpleasant situation to be in.

Just a back reference to my earlier comment about weakness and vulnerability, I believe that true narcissism is considered to be rooted in childhood at two specific points. The 2 year old (terrible 2s) and at age 6. A 2 year old can take charge of a whole room with a horrible tantrum… a 6 year old loves playing ‘king of the castle’. If useful, healthy responses are not given to each, then either may remain emotionally entrenched at these unhelpful stages in development.

It may help in dealing with your narcissist to imagine them as a small child… And behave gently, but appropriately. As long as you can avoid patronising, they may well be grateful.

Good luck.

You said this has happened several time. So it has me wondering if you meant with the same person or with several different people?
I can’t say that I have ever met a truly narcissist person and made them my friend.
Friendship implies a give and take relationship. If the person is always just taking than you don’t have a friendship in the first place. They just see you as a door mat.
If this has happened in several relationships you have had, than its time to ask yourself, why do I seek people who are emotionally unavailable and why do I accept being a door mat.
I’ve never seeked the friendship of someone who is a narcissist. They already have all the company they need.

Just a further comment, in support of @janbb‘s realisation of the situation: it is not a simple thing to be able to spot a narcissist! It is profoundly arrogant to assume such. If we enter into normal engagement with people, behave in a friendly fashion and chat or socialise, we can easily get sucked in by the narcissist. They can be and often are, extremely friendly, charming, interesting, attractive or even magnetic. It helps to have strong boundaries, it helps to have been through the mill with one. Those who say they are immune, or who have ‘never had’ such relationships are actually speaking narcissistically… really not sure of that spelling! Sorry!

Limit your emotional investment. You may not need to cut them out completely if you are able to modify your expectations and not get sucked into the manipulative games. It’s really tough when it’s family.

One more bit of info, if one is drawn into a relationship like this, the likelihood is that co-dependency is at the root. In its’ simplest form, this means that we take actions to control situations which give short term relief… So, our narcissist gets stuck, they need a lift/drink/a bit of cash/company/health advice… (the list is literally endless) and ‘just this once’ we oblige. They are grateful, we forget about it. Then it happens again, and we feel that a friendship is growing, they ‘need’ us a bit. It gets more difficult… We need company, they provide it, at cost.

When that cost starts to feel too big, is probably when realisation sets in. It can be really difficult to get out from under.

So sayeth the choppersangel, I’m off for a break!

First, you must realize that you are not at fault for being hurt by these people. You have normal expectations of responses that they are incapable of giving.

You need to limit contact with the ones that you can limit contact with.

For the others, you need to remind yourself before seeing them that they are likely to hurt you if you let them. Try to rehearse the kinds of things that could happen. Then, when it plays out as you imagined, you can feel a little satisfaction rather than hurt.

Take care. It is very painful.

Hi, I’m Picante and I’m co-dependent! Oh boy, choppersangel, you certainly know whereof you speak. I’ve discovered that I am drawn to narcissists (yes, they have a magnetism that is unbelievable). Over time, I’ve learned some coping skills to distance myself, but I also engage at times because I “enjoy” the magnetic part of the relationship.

Janbb, you’ve already got all the good advice here—it is tough.

To answer your question, you should place no value on their opinions and actions, just as they place no value on yours. A little mind game I developed over time is to envision their words as “bubbles” that carry no meaning—only a sound—and they evaporate quickly.

Take care of your heart.

There is a little narcissist in all of us. I’ve found, over time, the biggest word in the English language is tolerance. We love each other despite our imperfections.

Yes, nothing is EVER ‘personal.’

If someone is not treating you with respect and reciprocity in any type of relationship you need to take a look at yourself first and foremost.

Narcissists are infamous for intrapersonal exploitation, in other words they will ‘use’ you as much as YOU allow.

I was married to a pathological N. for years and have the psychic equivilent of a bloodhound when it comes to sniffing out these types. lol

You will NEVER change them.

You can have compassion but keep your distance, they are, indeed, very damaging personalities.

The only narcissist I can not distance myself from is my mother. One is enough. I would never voluntarily choose one as a friend or even acquaintance.

@choppersangel

Yes, co-dependant types are a good ‘fit’ for the N. but…the other most likely psychic ‘match’ is the Borderline ( emotionally unstable ) personality.

The Borderline type has a deep neediness for love and reassurance, the N. has the same need for admiration, same rope, different ends.

Most co-dependants will ‘settle’ more for being ‘needed’ rather than wanted, and are people pleasers which blends right into the N.‘s need for constant ego propping.

I always like the saying that ’ a neurotic blames themselves, a personality disorderd person blames others. ) A good measuring stick of ones own mental orientation.

I fell into the co-dependant pattern and boy, have I had my education from my experience. lol

I am pleased to say that I now feel my experience with my N. ex was the single most growth producing experience of my lifetime to date.

The truth will set you free! haha

Can only agree with @Coloma, and have been deeply entrenched myself, through family connection with (pathological) Narcissism and (very sadly) BPD also. It is certainly an education!

Great answers all! Will weigh in more later – on a plane.

@choppersangel

I just recently let go of a 15 yr. ‘friendship’ and biz. alliance with a woman whom I now believe has BPD.

Yep, the healthier one gets the more glaringly obvious and unacceptable these situations become.

Sad but….S.Y.S. Save yourself! lol

Most people aren’t reacting to you, most of the time. Narcissists more so. Only take it personally if you want to suffer or feel sorry for yourself. Narcissists won’t really care, either, or they’ll use it to fuel more drama for themselves.

However, go ahead and have your reaction, and then choose in what way you want to relate to people. If someone selfish makes you feel offended, then it’s a sign of you being violated. Of course, you’re also probably not just reacting to them, but to times you were violated in the past and are still sensitive to. Otherwise, you might just think, “oh, I think I’ll avoid that person” and get on with your life.

I think this could be useful:

http://www.psytalk.info/articles/narcissist.html#getwhatwant

“How To Get What You Want From A Narcissist: Persuade the narcissist that he or she will derive something significant from doing what you want.”

The key word is “friend”.

Otherwise, narcissist bore me.

I don’t know how you can have a “close relationship” with a narcissist. No matter how you look at it, it is pretty much one-sided. The other does not invest real emotion into it other than to calculate what they can get from you.
Distance yourself. You are in a relationship/friendship. They are not.

I would be hurt, but I would also take it with a grain of salt. I don’t condone the action, but would understand it better because of who the person is. Bottom line is if their narcissism bothers you to a certain extent (and only you know that extent), you shouldn’t be friends with them.

Lots of good answers. I have to agree with @Trillian. Friendship with narcissists often equates to being a doormat for them, unless they abritrarily choose to be nice to you. They are in a relationship with you – you are fulfilling an emotional need for them. It will not occur to them that just being able to fulfill their emotional needs does not fulfill an emotional need for you.

@Coloma -You are so right. :)

@lucillelucillelucille
No wonder I like you so much, you’re good friend material I can tell! ;-)

You don’t have to excuse their bad behaviors but you can be honest if they ask why you limit your time with them or avoid them. I’ve a relative like this, she loves us all and would probably do anything if we were in need and called on her but the rest of the time she’s near unbearable so we actively try not to respond to imtimidation, criticism or tantrums. It’s really hard if you care about that person.

If you have a narcissist for a friend, lots of advice here about knowing it and learning how to deal or not—and that you can’t change them. However, such a person in a family is different, since there are other important ties for a family and staying in touch might have value beyond the relationship itself. I would recommend, as others have done, simply to be aware that the callous response is not about you, but about them. The lack of interest in you, if expected, will hurt less or not at all. It is the expectation of a normal relationship that might hurt you, but with full knowledge, you change what you know you will be receiving from them, and can help arm yourself against their behavior toward you.

@skfinkel: This part is so true! …It is the expectation of a normal relationship that might hurt you….

This is the ultimate narcissist, any yes, I took it very personal for so many reasons.

http://i40.tinypic.com/qzr6no.jpg

Thanks for all the interesting comments, and the points about limiting contact and expectations are well-taken. I have intuited much of this but outside reinforcement and suggestions are always useful.

My mother is a narcissist of the first degree so I was exposed to it from an early age; it took me many years, but I succeeded in establishing boundaries with her. @Pandora – She was the primary one and of course, I did not choose her. In terms of a friend, unfortunately, people do not usually come with labels and you can establish a seemingly positive friendship based on other qualities before seeing some of the narcissistic ones. Luckily, I have many good friends and a husband who are able to give and take The longer I live, the more I learn about myself and others; it just takes time sometimes to sort things out.

Thanks for the input thus far and any continued input you have.

Footnote to my answer: You will find that people born in the 20’s and 30’s will tend to be more narcissistic. When you go through a depression and two World Wars, life will make you narcissistic. My mother is totally about her….but, knowing her History allows me to understand and love her. Not going to bore you with her past, but she had it tough.

@BoBo1946 – Narcissistic or cynical?

I can see hard times make people hard individuals. More so then narcissistic.

either Chaz….or, sometimes both!

I don’t have many friends like that. People like that tend to anger me so I stay away from them. They are too full of themselves. They usually don’t like me anyways because I tell them that they aren’t really that special at all.

Yep, the worst thing you can do is confront them, look out!

If it is a boyfriend or a friend, drop them the second you finally come to the conclusion that they are narcicisstic, or else you will just get hurt over and over again (and at that point, some of it will be your own fault). Most narcicisstic people can be very charming in the first place, that’s how they get you do do what they want. If it’s a relative, then just start limiting your time with them. Even if you have to visit certain relatives at other times besides during holiday gatherings, which is where the narcicissts like to be, then just make other plans with Aunt Beth, your Mom and your cousins. If you can’t avoid seeing them at family functions, the same advice is true, just limit your time (and conversation) with them.

There are plenty of great people who are charming and nice without being a narcicisst. Seek them out, and learn to quickly know the difference. It will save you a lot of grief.

@Kardamom

Good advice, just what I told my daughter recently after she is being pressured to spend the holidays with her dads side of the family, all raging narcissists.

They are affluent and it is all about appearances, gathering everyone for the screen play holiday and by God, you better be there to complete the simulated ‘perfect’ scene. lol

I am grateful that I can help her understand this dynamic as a young ( 23 ) yr. old woman…took me 25 years to quit being an extra in that scene. lol

CUT! It’s a wrap! hahaha

@Coloma I love your advice to your daughter and your cheeky way of putting it. Plus I love the Himalayan kitty in your profile picture. I have one just like that : )

@Kardamom Awww…love those Himmys, they are such sweethearts!

I think you have only three choices. Accept these people for who they are and deal with their shit because I don’t think they will change or that you can change them, keep them in your life and keep your interaction and involvement with them to minimum as best you can, or, if they cause more harm than good in your life, are draining your time and psychological and emotional energy, then move on. I don’t think there is any shame in any of those choices and I don’t think any of those choices is necessarily right or wrong. I think we all have a right to expect that our friends and family stick by us, even thought we flawed or sometimes make mistakes; that’s what family and real friends do. But, that being said, no one has the right to expect that you will allow them to, over and over, time and time again, and without consequence, completely suck the life out of you. No one has the right to expect, let alone demand that from anyone, I don’t think.

I usually don’t bother with them so a narcissist probally wouldn’t be one of my friends to begin with. Unfortunately when it’s family this becomes a different situation. One of my sisters is as hardcore a narcissist as you can get and I will admit (and with many good reasons I don’t feel like talking about) I have pretty much eliminated her from my life.

@lamerdumbmod Is that you?

I’d better jsut leave it at that. If it is, it is and if not – welcome to Fluther!

Don’t take their actions personally because they don’t take you personally! You are just a means to and end. I work with a true narcissist.. She is a total joy some days and impossible the next. She will never change. I generally stay as far away from her as possible and recommend others do the same. One thing about a narcissist is that you can never really trust them. As soon as a better deal (friend, job, relationship, opportunity, etc.) comes along she is on that bandwagon like stripes on a tiger. That lasts for awhile and then she moves on to her next victim. Narcissists tend to follow the same cycle…. IDEALIZE someone or something…. DEVALUE someone or something… and then DISCARD someone or something. If you know a narcissist I am sure you have seen this pattern. It is best to keep your distance!

Very sound advice @Mutable !

@Mutable Wow! You just really opened my eyes up to some of the people I’ve known in the past. I thought they were just run of the mill jerks, but that passage of yours IDEALIZE someone or something*…. *DEVALUE someone or something… and then DISCARD someone or something. That really hits the mark for a narcissist. They’re just really sickening people because they leave a great deal of damage and a trail of tears in their wake. And they don’t care. Once they’ve hit and run, it matters not to them the damage or the hurt that they’ve caused. They’re already onto the next thing.