Should beauty pageants be banned?

I don’t think they serve any good purpose, but I also don’t believe in banning things just because I personally dislike them.

Maybe the people who participate in them enjoy the sense of camaraderie and competition they get; maybe they appreciate the aesthetic; maybe they just think it’s fun. Who knows. Who cares. If you don’t like ‘em, don’t do ‘em.

I was thinking more of the effect they could have on other people (especially kids) who woudn’t qualify to be in them and this effect it could have on their self esteem.

I am fine with the pageants, but not for little children. Probably I would draw the line at 14, but not sure. I think competition can be a good thing, a good lesson in determination, focus, and hard work. I think the pageants emphasize confidence in one’s self, posture, grace, all ok with me. I guess there is a concern that it focuses too much on the external, but in society we are judged to some extent on how we present ourselves. Most pageants, especially the teen ones, from what I can tell, have a question and answer element, so the girls need to be a little up on current events, and be able to speak well, articulate an answer when put on the spot; that can be good practice for interviewing, and public speaking in general. To be honest I almost wish the question and answer part was earlier in the competitions.

First, the disclaimer: I am not now, nor have I ever been a fan of beauty pageants of any kind.

That being said, I don’t think banning them is going to help with anyone’s self-esteem. There are all kinds of competitions in which some people win and some people lose. Sports, spelling bees, the SAT’s (although that’s not necessarily a win/lose competition), jobs, girlfriends or boyfriends are all examples. Do we ban all of those, too? Doesn’t ones self-esteem suffer a blow no matter what competition we lose? Or instead, do we teach our children how to lose gracefully and how to learn from the loss?

@JLeslie Many children and even young adults will not qualify to be in them regardless. I’m aware of the extras you’ve added as positives but in the end it all comes down to the better looking kid being considered more important than the other kids or teenagers. There are other ways to emphasis on those other qualities you’ve mentioned rather than in a beauty pageant.

Personally if I had my own kids and even if they were great looking I would never enter them in any type of beauty pageant. What about beautiful people on the inside?

@Paradox – It’s still a competition based on something, whether it’s beauty or natural sports skills. People need to learn how to compete to the best of their abilities. And while you have to be good looking to get into the pageant, you still have to have some skills to win.

@Paradox I don’t have a problem with someone having their beauty acknowledged. Some kids are naturally beautiful, some are amazing dancers, some are great at sports, some are math wizards, some are amazing musicians. I don’t value beauty less than other gifts and talents. These women don’t just roll out of bed and walk onto the stage and win, they work at their craft also. Maybe working out in the gym, posture, etiquette, etc. I don’t like that it might encourage women being perceived as objects, but that one concern does not mean to me we should dump the whole competition.

Let’s say someone is on a debate team, very smart girl, participates in debate competitions. Of course she will be evaluated on her debate, but she still has to show up presentable, hair groomed, appropriate clothing. These things are not all mutually exclusive, it is a realty of our society.

I recently saw an episode of Made the girl was a tomboy but wanted to fit in with the other girls and be in a beauty pageant. Her transformation was amazing. Her confidence, attitude, and how she carried herself changed drastically. Overall I think it was very positive for her. Some of the girly girl BS is annoying, I agree, and was not really her gig, but I think it made her so much more confident when meeting new people, and now she can feel comfortable in both worlds. To me she just expanded her horizons.

Don’t feel like you have to watch the show, I just provided it if you are interested.

@tedibear Yes it is a competition based on something but as far as children and teenagers go they should be banned in my opinion. I have no problems with other types of competitions because unlike “beauty” you can always upgrade your skill level in other areas. This emphasis on being beautiful is having devestating consequences on children and teenagers. This plants seeds for many other problems.

@JLeslie Beauty isn’t a skill or a talent. These are kids not adults. There are more positive ways to build a child or teenagers self esteem then through beauty pageants. Again what I said above this is planting so many bad seeds when we start focusing on kids physical beauty. These labels and categories society keeps putting on kids is having horrible consequences. If you are beautiful and smart you are more important then the kid who is not physically beautiful but smart. We should be encouraging kids to be proud of themselves no matter how they look and we should be encouraging kids to be proud of being themselves, their own talents, skills and for just being themselves. Not throwing hints to kids that “hey, you need to be more like that person and not be yourself” whether a girl is a tomboy, nerdy or whatever.

Do you think all beauty pageants should be banned or just the pageants for kids?

I don’t see the legal grounds for banning either of them. I think that the kid ones are really distasteful – but hell, then we have to ban child actors too.

If you think beauty pageants should be banned then why do you think this way?

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If you don’t believe beauty pageants should be banned then what good purpose do you think they serve?

Pageants are very different depending on who is promoting it. The Miss America Pageant has a pretty significant talent section, and these women are incredibly poised and successful, and have shown a great deal of determination to get to this point.

As to what purpose they serve – well, the Miss America pageant provides the winners with cash and scholarship awards. One of my good friends used the money that she won doing pageants to help defray education costs for her ivy-league education after her family had been rocked by the sudden death of her father, and the debt associated with it.

What I think does need to happen, is more Handsome pageants, though…

@paradox So are you saying you are ok with the pageants for adults? When I was growing up I had no idea there was a such thing as miss teen USA, or miss high school, or any of that. The only pageants I knew were Miss USA, Miss Universe, the big ones, and those women seemed much older to me, grown up, when I was just 15 years old. I still wanted to be pretty, and curled my hair, and wore make-up. I don’t see how getting rid of pageants really helps your basic concern for young women and the emphasis in society on looks.

And, of course we should be encouraging children to be proud of themselves no matter what. Parents and relatives are the best at being proud of their children just because they exist. But, then the star quarterback of the winning team also gets reinforcement in pride when his team wins and everyone congratulates him. When a child gets accepted into Julliard for their dancing they can feel proud. I understand why being born with a pretty face is different than playing a musical instrument, but it is still something a person can use to help them in life.

@iamthemob What about a much less attractive girl who would suffer under these same circumstances? I guess she’s not getting any money for a scholarship now is she?

@to everyone else, you should get in life what you’ve worked hard for, not because of how you look. I have no problem with kids earning an award because they’ve worked for it but I do have a problem with people getting a free pass in life because of how they look over the women who really worked hard at going to school, getting good grades and helping and being compassionate to others.

@JLeslie If adults want them let them have their pageants. This is ridiculous for both young children and teenagers in my opinion however.

My point is each child has things they excell at, things that are valued in society, things they can exploit. The nerd might feel bad he cannot throw a ball 20 yards, and the jock might feel some stress over not doing well in Algebra. That is how it is. Some people are good in both areas.

Well, I agreed I am not ok with young children being in them.

@JLeslie Yes but “beauty” is different. Teenagers are just as vulnerable and emotionally sensitive as children.

@Paradox – Does this mean that you also want to get rid of advertising, television, movies and all other media that uses images of beautiful people? I’m not being snotty, I’m looking for your opinion on this.

@Paradox – Being beautiful is a genetic benefit that we celebrate much like any other. We privilege it as a society, and will continue to do so, regardless of whether these pageants will exist or not.

These pageants aren’t solely based on beauty, but beauty plays a part. My friend was also incredibly intelligent and a gifted musician, which is why she was competing on the national level.

It’s a little disturbing, though, that you suggest that because she’s beautiful, she doesn’t deserve to get this particular benefit, and other young women should have the opportunity taken away from her.

We celebrate all kinds of gifts that people display. I’ll tell you that my friend was more interesting looking than she was classically beautiful. She also was of an average size (she had curves for sure). But she carried herself with grace, she definitely was very attractive, and she wore a gown like it was her job. She was successful, however, because she worked. ;-)

@tedibear I’m talking about kids and teenagers here being in beauty pageants. As far as the others you’ve mentioned I would say no.

@iamthemob Why are you putting words in my mouth, I find that disturbing. I’m not saying that someone shouldn’t get a benefit because they are considered beautiful or ugly by society. Where did I say this at? I’m saying that what someone does should be considered more important then how they look physically whether they are considered attractive by society or not. This is especially true when it comes to children and teenagers because they are at an age where they should be taught to be compassionate to others and emphasising what they are good at or are interested in doing not how they look.

Here’s a simple answer for you: Absolutely.

Do you think all beauty pageants should be banned or just the pageants for kids? – Banned for everyone.

If you think beauty pageants should be banned then why do you think this way? – It’s superficiality x a million. Then, we wonder why we prioritize sex, looks and so called beauty so much in this country (assuming we’re talking about the U.S.). Then, women wonder why they’re so objectified in our culture. Then, we wonder why diseases exist such as anorexia and bulimia.

If you don’t believe beauty pageants should be banned then what good purpose do you think they serve? – I believe they should be banned because they don’t serve any good purpose, if any purpose beyond sickening the population.

Just one more call for the government to take over where parents fail. NO

@Paradox – you stated: What about a much less attractive girl who would suffer under these same circumstances? I guess she’s not getting any money for a scholarship now is she?

I’m sorry – but that was very pointed, and rhetorical, and one could say that you were attributing that argument to me. The only thing that can suggest, regardless, is that it’s unfair for her to get the benefit because she was attractive.

There are plenty of scholarships available to people regardless of how they look. This isn’t one of them. Anyone with intelligence and talent can compete for grants, scholarships, etc….and, arguably, by taking herself out of the running for those scholarships, she increased the chances that any one member of the pool would get it.

When you claim that someone isn’t getting the scholarship just because they’re ugly, in the form of a pointed and rhetorical question, you have to admit that this will likely come off as if you’re suggesting that it’s wrong, especially when you end the sentence with “now is she?” Because these pageants are based on looks and presentation, and in the case of Miss America intelligence and talent, they are not being judged only on their physical attractiveness. Therefore, girls and women in these pageants don’t by necessity attribute whether they win or not on how they look, but more often of the ones that I’ve known on how they preformed.

So I understand what you’re trying to say, but in the case of pageants as a whole your concerns aren’t clearly relevant in terms of how they are practically prepared for and judged.

With or without beauty pageants there is bias in favor of better looking people. I don’t think beauty pageants add to this particularly. I don’t care for them, but I can’t see any reason for banning them. If people derive pleasure from watching and participating in them, so be it.

@Disc2021 The best response on here by far, thank you for agreeing with me. I would give you a thousand lurve if I could.

I don’t know. I feel like providing an additional opportunity for these girls and women to fund their education is a perfectly and objectively excellent benefit.

The costs involved for pageant participation far outweigh the “scholarship” benefits of winning. It’s an industry, and a cattle call. A woman I work with has two stepdaughters that are in pageants, and, at their mother’s insistence, their father pays part of the fees, which means my co-worker ends up financing part of it out of her check, to seem like a team player. This year, the cost for travel, clothing, hair, make-up, photographs, etc. was $6,000 per girl. And they didn’t get to enter every pageant they wanted to. They’ve been doing this since they were 5. College could have been paid for by now.

That definitely happens a lot. However, much of the time it also pays off.

@Paradox Certainly. Generally, if this is what people want to do with themselves I suppose they have that right. I just think it’s horrifying to watch as an outsider.

@Disc2021 Yeah I was speaking in terms of decency more than anything else because my arguments were in response to the pageants involving kids of all ages. Acheivements based on practice, hard work or actions with the full intention of emphasising doing these things with humility and good sportsmanship rather than the main focus being on succeeding itself should be of the utmost importance.

What I can’t seem to understand is why humility, decency and just being yourself is always under attack in society. We have books out to “train” introverts to be extroverts. We have books out that emphasise “faking it until you make it” rather than just being yourself.

I especially agree with your third paragraph. We have all these types of problems in our society and create an uproar about them but in the end people keep planting these seeds that lead to these types of problems while complaining these issues do not get enough attention. Especially when alot of these problems can be so easily eliminated by the way we bring up our children.

It’s superficiality x a million. Then, we wonder why we prioritize sex, looks and so called beauty so much in this country (assuming we’re talking about the U.S.). Then, women wonder why they’re so objectified in our culture. Then, we wonder why diseases exist such as anorexia and bulimia.

I find that the younger the participants, the more problematic it is. But beauty pageants, in this day and age, are in many if not most parts of the country considered…well…kind of lame. Considering that we get blasted with imagery through our televisions, computers, and cell phones near constantly, the idea that pageants contribute in a significant way to public perceptions of an impossible body type is a major stretch.

There are people who participate in an unhealthy way, surely. And there are certainly crazy parents. None of this pertains to pageants, particularly well known one’s like Miss America. Consider this:

“the primary prizes for the winner and her runners-up are scholarships to the institution of her choice. The Miss America Scholarship program, along with its local and state affiliates, is the largest provider of scholarship money to young women in the world, and in 2006 made available more than $45 million in cash and scholarship assistance. Since most of the contestants are college graduates already, or on the verge of graduating, most of their prize money is devoted to graduate school or professional school, or to pay off student loans for courses already taken. The Miss America Scholarship Program, along with its State and Local affiliates, is the largest provider of college scholarships for women in the United States.”

The success is based on proven past intellectual as well as social grace. In the end, any image issues can’t possibly line up to the pressure placed on models…who are only judged by their looks…and in fact, the more inanimate they are, the better.

@Paradox I had to leave my computer for a while. I really do understand why you do not want children including teens in beauty pageants. I actually like uniforms in schools and strict codes, because generally I do not want a girls looks, fashion sense, or family money to give her more attention in school.

But, let’s take the case of the girl in the show I referenced above. She was born with her looks. She was not one of the girls in school thought to be pretty or feminine. When she did her hair, put on make-up, and carried herself differently, all of a sudden her peers thought she was sooo different, so much prettier. We could say that they should not have been judging her on her exterior, but my point is she always had the same God given looks, now she did what she could to enhance them and in a way conform to what society says is attractive, but she did not get plastic surgery or anything like that. Which is why I say there is some work into looking beautiful to the world. Teens, especially teens, rarely have a real concept of what is beautiful in my opinion, especially boys. It is more in the packaging. The woman who came to train her, knew from her photos she was a pretty girl, because adults have a different perspective; well at least women do, they look at specific features beyond the packaging. So, for teens, all of this garbage already exists. Who is pretty, who isn’t, and I don’t think teen pageants really affect what is happening in the average high school, because I think few teens are even aware of the teen pageants.

If we made teen pageants illegal, it would not bother me a bit, but I don’t think having them is that much of a negative considering everything else.

NO…Why? Because of the creepy pageant moms living vicariously through their daughters? I was in a couple pageants when I was little. It was so much fun. My parents weren’t nuts like some of those parents. I wanted to do it. One year I sang Somewhere over the Rainbow (I was seven). That was a happy memory.

How about this, we ban every single contest that favors one person over another – no more Baseball/football/tennis or car racing, because athletes are pushed into it by their overbearing parents and it makes geeks feel bad, no more horse races because it is demeaning and dangerous to the horse, no more movie stars, because they are singled out for being different from the rest of us.

@YARNLADY All those things you mentioned involve actual talent. Wearing fancy clothes and make up (plus the genetics your parents gave you) does not involve talent in any way, shape or form.

Beauty pageants should be banned, until they start busing the contestants from one pageant to another for racial equality. we have a miss black america, but not a miss white america. see what i mean?

@john65pennington Considering white people are the majority, that makes all non-specific contests the “white” version by default, despite it being unsaid.

Of course not. The distinction between physical attractiveness, on the one hand, and athletic ability, intelligence, or any other genetically acquired trait is devoid of meaningful content.

@john65pennington: I think I see what you mean, but I’ll refrain from naming it for fear of being modded.

Here is some of the relevant history. The emphasis is mine.

The pageant’s long history of excluding women of color dates from its beginnings. At some point in the 1930s, it was formalized in the notorious rule number seven of the Miss America rule book. Instituted under the directorship of Lenora Slaughter, rule number seven stated that “contestants must be of good health and of the white race.” As late as 1940, all contestants were required to list, on their formal biological data sheet, how far back they could trace their ancestry. In the pageant’s continual crusade for respectability, ancestral connections to the Revolutionary War or perhaps the Mayflower would have been seen as a plus.

…

By the 1960s there still had not been a black contestant. Following the advances of the civil rights movement, black Americans set up their own contest in 1968. Black communities had sponsored segregated black beauty contests for years, dating farther back than the Miss America contest. However, the 1968 Miss Black America Contest, held in Atlantic City on the same day as the Miss America Pageant, was organized as a direct protest of the pageant. On that same day, feminists staged a boardwalk demonstration protesting the pageant. The 1968 Miss America Pageant was confronted with its shortcomings on several fronts.

@Paradox – I asked: Does this mean that you also want to get rid of advertising, television, movies and all other media that uses images of beautiful people?
You answered: I’m talking about kids and teenagers here being in beauty pageants. As far as the others you’ve mentioned I would say no. I assume that means you don’t think that those images should be banned, and what I’m about to say is based on that assumption. If I’m incorrect in thinking that was your meaning, please let me know.

We are all inundated with advertising, movies and television shows far more often than we are with knowing who won a beauty pageant. I think that those images to which we are constantly exposed are more problematic regarding poor body image than any beauty pageant may be. They show women (in particular, but not solely women) in an unrealistic light. The hours spent staying that thin and that made up are beyond the potential time allowed for an everyday person to achieve. This means that it is an unrealistic goal for me to look like Kate Bosworth, even if it’s what I would want. Unfortunately, children and teens don’t know that. (Along with many adults who battle with already screwed up self-esteem.) They see someone who is feted and celebrated for being beautiful, and they see it a whole lot more in magazines, TV and movies than they see a pageant queen. I’d even bet that if Little Miss Artichoke wore her winner’s sash to school, she would get teased and not feted. So why not get rid of that, too, since it’s more pervasive than any pageant? My answer to that question is, as much as it would be nice to see ordinary people in those roles, it’s not going to happen. Or at least not overnight.

Maybe, instead of banning things and dragging unnecessary regulation into our lives, we start encouraging responsible parenting. Help parents understand that pageants for the younger set (say 14 and under) might not be the best idea. Or find ways to tell Hollywood that we would like to see more average people in the media. Or teach people how to work past their biases towards those who are better looking than average and to learn about all of the assets that an individual brings.

Now how we do those things, that’s for brighter minds than mine. If someone figures it out, let me know how to help because as the plainest Jane you’ll ever meet, I’d like to see some changes.

I think there are plenty of average looking kids in the media. Many sitcoms have kids on them that are what I would consider average looking.

Advertising, especially ads targeted towards adults is more slanted I would say, and false.

No, but a minimum BMI for the participants should be defined.

Beauty pageants should not be banned; because we want to see and have some fun, it enables us men to see the most beautiful women in the world.

lol

At least @qq is honest!

It’s important to remember though that honest doesn’t necessarily mean correct.

Never