Where do you draw the line, when does it become cheating?

I have an open marriage and we communicate freely about our interests and actions outside our partnership. However, I would consider it cheating if he had feelings for or sex with another person without telling me about it. In that sense, an open marriage is just like a closed marriage, because this has to do with trust.

My line and your line (or anyone else’s line) will be totally different. How well do you trust your partner? If your partner is talking to someone and you think it crosses the line, then maybe you need counseling. And I’m using you as in a universal you. Open and honest communication is always the key. I think the line might be crossed if they see each other without telling me and on several occasions. Definitely if they are having sex! Having lunch together is no big thing. I ate lunch with the same four or five people, 3 of them married men everyday. I often had lunch with their wives, too.

I concur; relationships are like contracts (in some sense) and if the terms are ambiguously defined, someone might ‘cross the line’ and not even know they’re doing it. People’s relationships have radically different terms and goals, but dialogue is always key.

I am not a jealous person. For me it has very little to do with what my husband is doing (and with whom) and everything to do with how honest he is being about it.

If you are lying, sneaking around, neglecting our relationship to nurture another… that is where my line is drawn.

I agree with @TheOnlyNeffie

If you or your spouse are not openly communicating the details of your lives and relatonships with others, or, hiding anything from each other, well..that’s a path to the destruction of trust.

If you have nothing to hide you hide nothing.

Not being honest with your partner about an emotional connection that you may have with someone else; that’s not a good thing. You need to be open and honest with your partner and not hide anything. You are both aware of what consitutes cheating (it’s not always the same for every couple), and you don’t dare cross that line.

I would draw the line at sharing my passwords with another dude otherwise I don’t sweat the small stuff. ;)

Anything you wouldn’t do in front of your partner or want your partner to know about = cheating.

When I find out! Theoretically speaking of course.

I draw the line at my SO engaging another in a way they’d not want someone observing to tell me about. This means cyber relationships, sex texting, work attractions that turn into meals together, cocktails or “hanging out” just to talk.

Just because we’re human and by nature will have attractions and even admiration of others doesn’t mean we have to act on every flirtation or seemingly irresistible intelligent being. That’s if you believe in having exclusive relationships to begin with.

If my guy did the Vulcan mind meld with another, woe be to his memory!

When the SO’s thoughts are all bound up with another person, it is cheating. It does not matter whether there is physical touching or not.

It really varies, depending on the relationship and the person. I’ve dated one that I trusted implicitly, so her going to lunch or chatting or whatever with someone else, I didn’t have a single thought of anything untoward. On the other hand, I dated one whose MO was to immaturely lash out, coupled with her poor impulse control and her ego being tied into how many chicks she could bag, which left me always just a teeny bit suspicious because I could see one thing leading to the other. (and she proved me right on one occasion)

There are a lot of activities, even flirting, that I couldn’t care less about—and this is important—as long as there is no intent there. The intent is what counts to me, like if you really mean the flirting, or if a little part of you wants to take it further, especially if you’re doing things that you feel the need to hide and to lie about.

Post bail? Lol. How does that even enter your mind?

Ok, for me it would bother me if they spend a lot of consistent time together. A lunch here and there, and they are both very aware my husband is married, no big deal. Lunch every week, drinks after work, communication outside of work, not ok. I mean that stuff might happen every so often, but if it is a regular thing, not good. The worst thing woud be if he enjoyed his time with her more than his time with me, if he looked forward to seeing her more than coming home to me. He would not have to be doing anything really that is wrong or crossing the line, except that he would be emotionally removed from our relationship at that point. That to me is the beginning of a bigger problem.

I saw this divorce expert on TV once, and he said men who are cheating, and men who are about to cheat behave the same, the signs are the same for the SO. I believe it is because they are emotionally moving away from their SO already, and they don’t even realize their own change in behavior. This begins to affect the whole relationship.

When a little bastard is born.

@marinelife “thoughts bound up”? Seems like an unattainable standard to have them thinking exclusively of you.

How about if they have a fixation with Sean Connery or Jennifer Tilly? Are you going to say that’s cheating because they think about someone – perhaps in graphic ways – but they never will act out?

I see the point that alienation of affections begins with the thought process. But I think it’s naive to expect someone not to think thoughts about someone else they know or even someone they just see.

@6rant6: Try this one on… cheating is when whatever you’re doing that you think is “harmless” takes away from your partner expects you’d be sharing with them.

@Neizvestnaya I wonder how often people react to a sense of guilt about a relationship by making sure that they are better partners for their SO.

Obviously if another relationship detracts from your primary one, then there’s a problem, although the solution is not necessarily clear. Suppose, for example, someone is mentoring a foster child – likely to detract? Of course! Is the answer to cut it off? That’s hardly clear. Does the SO know all that is going on in that relationship? No. Is it cheating? Probably not to most. What if one party or the other sees it as romantic? Is it cheating then? (just to relieve the squick factor, this is hypothetical.) What if the mentoring is to someone who is in your professional field?

It seems to me that it’s one way up to a point, and then another way. That is, while harmless flirtation is all that it’s about, then “Make sure to fan the home fires first” is the rule we would all want to make. But at some point, paying extra attention at home does not make right the SOO.

@6rant6: Hmmn, what came to mind immediately was teacher/student “accidental” relationships.

What you wrote about treating your SO better because you have guilt over an infatuation you’ve got going on elsewhere, I don’t get that, not sure I understand. That would be a bunch of BS, not fair to the SO at all because it’s pretending and not genuine attention or affection. I work with a bunch of men who cheat on their SO’s and no matter what they buy or what they do at home, if the SO has gotten wind of the cheating then nothing works to restore the trust. In the cases where they have shared debts, young children and financial dependence then hurt gets overshadowed by contempt and often retaliation, usually of the cyber originating sort.

@Neizvestnaya “Has gotten wind of the cheating” I assumes means they were having sex. Yes, that is over the line, I agree.

More hypotheticals…

Since you thought of teachers, let’s say that Darlene has a student who frankly admits he’s attracted to her, and takes all her classes. She likes the student, and is flattered about the attention. She makes it quite clear to the student that she’s married and going to behave that way. He agrees to respect that.

She recognizes that she’s made somewhat happier by seeing him where professors and students would meet appropriately. Nothing is going to happen.

Still, she compensates by making sure that things are going well at home. She is more willing to attend to her husband’s wants. She doesn’t want this innocent relationship to get confused in her mind as a substitute for what she already has.

Okay, so is Darlene cheating?

(I realize that defining “Cheating” so precisely is not really the be all and end all. But I am finding the discussion illuminating.)

@6rant6: Darlene isn’t cheating but she’s infatuated enough to where she is consciously changing/noting her behavior at home with her SO. She’s toeing the waters. Not the smartest thing to challenge yourself to but to each his own.

As for cheating, it’s more than just a physical sex act. Cyber sexting is cheating. Ignoring your SO to rush home and get online with you “pals” to where your SO feels something amiss is cheating. Becoming engrossed in porn to where you have less sex with your SO is cheating. Spending upmteen hours gaming when your SO wants to share doing something else and they start to feel neglected, that’s cheating.

People not strongly invested in their relationships like to throw out how it takes a physical sexual shared encounter to mean cheating as an excuse to cover up all their shenanigans and try to excuse themselves from the hurt and betrayal they deliver their SO’s.

@Neizvestnaya

I agree.

Also, I think more often than not the cheating partner is picking more fights, distancing more and not being nicer because of guilt.

Guilt usually comes out in anger over fawning solicitation.

The solicitation starts AFTER they are found out and you leave them! lol

@Neizvestnaya Actually, I wasn’t saying that cheating is synonymous with sex. When your coworkers’ wives ”[got] wind of cheating” were you not saying they’d had sex?

Relationships are complicated animals. I see that you list classic negative male past times as the ones to fault (gaming & porn). Will you be as quick to judge if the behavior that he maintains that is attenuating the relationship is hers: watching TV, volunteering to oversee kids’ activities, sewing, shopping…

Whenever deceit is involved.

@Coloma: I totally agree, the solicitations start AFTER the deed is discovered.

@6rant6: I used my co workers in only one example, nothing to do with the gaming and porn which I’ve seen both males and females guilty of ostrasizing their partners over.

@Neizvestnaya ”“which I seen both men guilty of ostrasizing their partners””
How true, how true…

what the hell?

When you do or say something you wouldn’t do or say in your SO’s presence, or knowing that your SO would be hurt if they saw you do it.

Lunch, hugs and movies are ok. Secret rendezvous are not. I trust her, and even if she was doing secret stuff, if it didn’t affect me and I never noticed anything different, then I don’t think it would affect my life.

It would be extremely painful if I ever found out, though. I’m told they always find out. I wonder. Maybe you find out if the other person wants you to, probably because they are desperately unhappy, and it’s the only way they know to bring the problem to light.

There are people who don’t find out. Some men manage to have two or three families and they only find out about each other at the funeral. That must be very weird.

I think if you are at the point where you are questioning your behavior it has already gone to far. I think cheating is defined by how your actions would make your partner feel. If your partner wouldn’t mind you going to a movie with another, then go ahead. If you know your partner would be uncomfortable with a private conversation of someone of the opposite sex then you would be crossing the line by doing so. I also believe in avoiding temptation. If I am aware that a friendship may be getting too close, and I shouldnt be so attracted but I continue it anyway, I am risking overstepping boundaries.

@Baddreamer27 I think the “Uncomfortable partner” is a poor standard (although a very popular one). First, that means that the most mean-spirited, controlling partner is always right. Bad medicine.

On the other end, our partner might condone behavior which we know in our own minds is just looking for a road off the reservation.

Finally, it’s easy to quote that standard – imagining ourselves as the other partner makes it seem like all decisions would be proper (aka “we get our way.”). But in reality it’s undoable. You can’t know what your partner will think in every situation.