In which competitions is it fair to use performance enhancing drugs?

In the one’s where cheating is allowed.

“When is it fair?” and “when should it be illegal?” are two very different questions. Fairness is about a level playing field. Whether or not the drugs should be against the rules is a determination that governing boards make when deciding what exactly they want their competition to be about. There doesn’t need to be consistency with regard to the latter because such determinations are not judgments about anyone or anything else. They are simply declarations that the contest with which they are concerned will have a particular set of rules. It’s ultimately no different than deciding whether or not to use the infield fly rule in baseball.

@Self_Consuming_Cannibal So cheating is allowed in music?

@SavoirFaire So the common principle is the governing bodies get to make up their own rules for their own organizations? Humor me for a moment because that is not satisfying at all, even if it is the reality.

Is there a guiding principle you would choose to apply across all these issues? Of would you just think out loud about it for a moment, even if you can’t decide on what it would be?

No, there is no guiding principle. Illegality isn’t about principles. Murder isn’t illegal because it’s immoral, it’s illegal because it is contrary to the goals of our society to allow it. Steroids aren’t illegal in professional biking because there is something wrong with using them, they are illegal because the regulatory boards have decided that they don’t want that sort of competition. It is contrary to the goals they have in putting on the competition. If they had different goals, there might be nothing wrong with allowing steroid use. Groups have certain goals, and they decide what they will allow and disallow on the basis of them. I don’t think there’s anything more to it than that.

@wundayatta I don’t know. I guess you should ask the judges.

@Self_Consuming_Cannibal Except that it’s not cheating if it’s allowed by the rules. That’s how cheating is defined.

In the ones in which there are no rules against doping, period.

Capital markets.
Foreign Exchange traders work in a 24×7 market highly fueled by coffee at the baseline.
Equity markets, corporate paper, derivatives.
These are ‘whatever it takes’ competitions. The bottom line is the finish line.

Does the little blue pill count?
As long as it doesn’t last longer than FOUR hours.

@Tropical_Willie is that a competition ? Performance…granted.

At the risk of coming off as too serious I would like to offer the following thoughts on this matter.

The health and welfare of the seasoned professional athlete who makes a personal choice to use illegal performance enhancing substances (IPES) are not the most important aspect of this matter (in my opinion). I mean so what if those fools destroys their health in a greedy effort for fame and fortune? Well we all should care because that is just the tip of the iceberg. The health and welfare of the young athletes who look up to their idles is what is at stake. Many may be pressured to take IPES as part of their progressive training in order to compete with their peers who may also be taking IPES.

I’m a 62 year old man and have been a competitive athlete for all of my adult life. I usually came away from running events of any distance including triathlons with age class awards. Many times I have seen my competitors finish with fantastics times and privately wondered if they had some sort of pharmaceutical help? Why shouldn’t they “cheat”? No one ever checks age class winners for drugs. At least I have never been tested in over 30 years of competition for dugs of abuse.Today it is very easy to find a medical doctor who will be happy to inject testosterone as well as other hormones into an old man like me. Such treatments are done with the medical intent to make old men feel better but actually may also result in the unethical performance enhancing of older athletes. This is also unnatural and unhealthy. And in my opinion does far more harm than good.

‘Tis true. Testosterone is a common fertility treatment. Yet it may also enhance physical performance in other areas, as well. In most competitions, it isn’t considered cheating. But in certain competitions, it is cheating. As people have said, it’s cheating if the competition says so, and there is no obligation to have the same rules in all competitions. It’s pretty arbitrary, I guess.

The arbitrariness disturbs me greatly. The only reason Lance is in deep trouble is because the ruling body of his sport says so, and their decision is not principled. It merely has to do with their peculiar bent. But as a result of this bent, a lot of otherwise good young men’s lives have been ruined and nothing, as far as I can tell, has been made better.

@SavoirFaire Yes I know that if the rules allow it, it’s not cheating. It was a joke. I thought that would be obvious.

@Self_Consuming_Cannibal It wasn’t. I think the tilde convention may prove of great use to you.

@SavoirFaire Once again you are wrong. Those two threads were of no use to me. Do you have anything else for me to waste my time on?

@Self_Consuming_Cannibal What an odd response. If you’re having trouble conveying sarcasm, it seems to me that knowing our convention for conveying sarcasm would be useful. If you are uninterested in that, then it would seem irrational to complain when your sarcasm is missed. Have you simply been in a bad mood? That would explain why you responded to a genuine attempt at help with rudeness. In any case, I hope you feel better soon.

@SavoirFaire I don’t feel as though I’m having a problem conveying sarcasm, I felt as though you were having a hard time noticing it. I’m not complaining about my sarcasm being missed, I merely stated that I thought that it should’ve been obvious that my comment wasn’t serious. I was stating, not complaining.

I didn’t feel as though your post was an attempt at being helpful, I thought you was just trying to be sarcastic yourself. That’s the problem with the internet, there is no tone to what one is saying. If you genuinely was attempting to be helpful as opposed to being a smart-ass then I apologize for my rudeness.

I’m not in a bad mood, nor do I feel bad, but if you genuinely meant it when you said you hoped I will feel better soon, then, thank you and have a nice day.

@Self_Consuming_Cannibal If I had been trying to be sarcastic, I would have used the tilde. I find it very useful—so much so that I’ve been trying to get people outside of Fluther to use it (e.g., on Facebook). In any case, I’m glad we cleared things up.

In that case I’m glad we cleared things up as well and I’m sorry.

I didn’t take the time to read the entire “tilde” thread. What exactly is the tilde?

I mean I know it’s a way to let people know you’re being sarcastic. I just want to know how to use it.

@Self_Consuming_Cannibal The tilde goes at the end of your sentence if you’re joking or being sarcastic. Let’s say you were responding to a joke someone made. You might say:

Wow, that was really funny.

or

Wow, that was really funny. ~

The first would indicate sincerity, the second would indicate sarcasm. Not everyone uses the tilde, and some people who use it leave it off when they think it’s blindingly obvious that they aren’t being sincere. I personally find it to be useful, though.

Well in that case, I will do my best to use it. Thanks.

By the way, your shoe’s untied.~