Where is the new pope from?

Does it matter?

I suppose there is some ‘glory’ to South America, and to the Western hemisphere in general, to have a pope who is not European. Some publicity or prestige, I imagine.

But this guy – no matter what his national origin—seems to just as wedded to the conservative Catholic doctrines on homosexuality and abortion and celibacy as anyone that would have been chosen from Rome (or for that matter, Europe).

So this isn’t a step forward for the Church – it’s more of the same, or perhaps a step backwards. They had a chance to become more relevant to the younger generation of catholics, and chose to elect the “more of the same old crap” candidate. They could have chosen someone in his 50s or 60s; they chose someone who is 76 years old.

This was a vote for stasis.

The good news is that this guy is getting old and will probably not be around for too much longer.

Argentina..

He. must be an Itailan Argentinian then. So what shall I call my daughter-in-law?

If the parents were Argentinians residing in Italy then he is fully Argentinian.

@filmfann Well, that explains a lot… I thought (without having seen anything but the headline) that this was quite a progressive move on their part, to choose a non-European. Oh well.

To answer your question, I think he must be considered to be “from Argentina” and “the first pope from the Americas”. These phrases describe his nationality, but not his race, or culture, or ethnicity. If they had chosen a pope with Argentinian heritage, I think that the wording might have been different.

The next question is, is it an exciting thing that this pope is non-European? No, I don’t think so. Not under these circumstances. They are still maintaining a kind of cultural uniformity with this choice.

Argentina has an enormous Italian immigrant population. As in the US, it would be very difficult to define what it means to be a “real” Argentinian. The culture is so suffused with European elements that someone from an Italian background would be no more alien than would a son of Irish immigrants in Chicago or Boston.

Before and during WWII, many Jews fled from Europe, Eastern Europe, Russia and the Ukraine and settled in Argentina. i have distant cousins who still live there.

Unfortunately, the new ‘Pope’ has past associations with one of the worst Dictators in Latin American history. Many people were killed & their children were adopted by those who were willing to look the other way in reference to this Dictator. I have no idea if he could have actually made a difference in dealing with this dictator. It is possible that he simply kept a very low profile in order to keep from bringing himself to the attention of this dictator. Since so many Catholics follow the Pope & the Vatican, I was hoping that they would choose a younger man, with a more ‘liberal’ attitude. His condemnation of homosexuals & his condemnation of birth control are flags that any liberal will have to confront. This choice by the Bishops indicates a great deal of Politics went into the selection of this man. Do I believe that this man is ‘God’s Anointed’, no I don’t – but I do believe that he will confuse the Catholics who do believe he is & it will lead to a great deal of difficulty for the people who are LGBT.

He’s Argentinian, of Italian descent, and he’s the first pope from Latin America. I have no hope that he will be any better than the last one. Still, he’s old so with luck he might die soon.

The new pope is from Argentina and is of Italian descent. Another guy that’s conservative and authoritarian. Will they never learn? I know many more ex-Catholics than practicing ones. I would guess that he didn’t have anything to do with child molesting or molesters. I suspect that it was hard to find a cardinal not tainted and suspect that is his only useful point though I understand that he was a friend of the dictator Pinochet. You just can’t find an honest decent “prince of the church” these days. I suspect that the is a long history of that also.

I wish someone would ask a General question, worded properly and concisely, regarding why atheists are concerned about the Pope and the Catholic Church and how the Pope and the Church affects you personally if you are a nonbeliever. I just thought of it because of all of the responses from self-proclaimed atheists regarding their wishes that the Pope was more liberal.

@bkcunningham although I’m an atheist, I still have ties to the catholic church through all of the friends and family still in the church. It is hard to ignore a society in which you were born and raised. My hope is that the pope would be liberal. If he was some of the priest that I know and like would be free to have a normal life with a life and family. The whole celebrate law was a way to insure that the church inherited from its clergy. It was simply an economic move to insure that the church remained rich and gained further riches. There is no real religious reason for a priest to be and unmarried man.

Further, priests are supposed to be advisers; how could they advise a married couple if they only thing they know about married life and sex is theory read from books sanctioned by a church full of eunuchs?

@bkcunningham It’s a good question – don’t be afraid to be the one to ask it. Personally, I’m interested for several reasons. First, as a former religious person myself, I am still fascinated by the many sects of Christianity and how they differ from each other, and how different people take parts of their own religion to adhere to strictly while basically ignoring others. In short, I’m interested in most of the Christian faiths, period.

Also, I’ve read a lot of books, fiction and non-fiction about Catholicism. From Clavell’s Shogun to Karen Armstrong’s memoirs. This event is effectively a continuation of those stories for me.

I have a close relative who converted to Catholicism. This is going to come up in conversation.

I have gay friends. They (and I by extension) care about how the Catholic church evolves on the issue of gay marriage and homosexuality in general. Not because any of us is Catholic, and not because gay marriage is illegal in their region, but because if Catholics become more tolerant of homosexuality, it means that there is a huge population of people who will shift their views with it. Not all at once, but it would have to happen. It would be a huge step forward.

Very good answer, @glacial. Very insightful for me. Thank you. Thank you too, @Ron_C. Sometimes something that is obvious to you isn’t obvious to another person. I appreciate your answers.

@bkcunningham the Catholic Church has huge global influence. So their actions are of interest to anyone who cares about world affairs.

I was talking to someone about the new Pope and his age yesterday. She recommended a book by Geoffrey Robertson, The Case of the Pope and said the choice to appoint old men is deliberate because they are less likely to have either the capacity or desire to shake things up and be serious agents of change. I haven’t read the book yet but I think I will buy it.

Celibate… not celebrate

I suspect he came from the union of a man and woman.

he’s not jesus for christ’s sake