Maybe Fluther is not the place for me?

Stay. Do you answer many questions? I don’t recall seeing many responses from you. I’ll follow you and then perhaps I’ll see you more often.

Get outside and away from the internet. It will do you good.

I don’t believe that Fluther is about been accepted but rather one about giving their thoughfull answers that may help another gain another perspective from that of an anonymous observer.
It is about expressing things that one could be passionate about,inspiring others,been heard out, and feeling that one has contributed to the cause.
As for popularity, there are some who use this site to chat it up with others internationally as a social site.
Define “why” you joined and what your expectations were.
Are these needs been met?
If not then start a new website to address these unexpressed feelings.(ex:writing sites,poems etc)
Why worry about what an unknown person says about you or your character?
We here do not know you as a person,but merely as another observer addressing a question in an honest effort to help.

Maybe you should stop seeking attention and decide one way or the other. Either you can hack it or you can’t. What anyone else says or thinks doesn’t matter.

I write this while bawling my eyes out. That does not sound healthy to me. For whatever reasons, this kind of emotional reaction to an anonymous Q & A site can’t be good for you. If you feel no benefits, why not take a holiday and see how you feel then?

Hanging around and feeling miserable seems a very bad idea to me.

Sorry to hear you’re feeling so negatively about Fluther. With honesty I haven’t noticed you around a whole lot but I certainly don’t remember having any negative feelings about you.

Yes if it is making you cry then do what you need in order to feel better. We’d be sad to see you go but it’s not worth your mental health to stay. It might not be your cup of tea if it makes you this upset.

That said, in my four years here I have shed tears over Fluther once, when someone I considered a friend said some nasty words to me, but I am still glad overall to be here.

I don’t see any reason that you should leave. Maybe I missed something. I do recall that you are Christian, however, and it’s difficult to be a Christian here on Fluther. You’re the minority in this sense and people here do not want anything to do with it, so you may get shunned. You have to come to accept that your opinions about religion will most likely never get accepted, and neither will mine (and I don’t even think I’m a Christian!). That really goes for anything right-wing. Fluther is full of liberals.
Some people here on Fluther also tend to lack emotion, which is rightfully their own personality, but you must also consider that, too. If this is such an annoyance to you, then only interact with the people who you want to and only discuss things you know won’t end with adamance. After all, it’s just a Q & A site, so balling your eyes out about it is a bit much. And please don’t get bent out of shape over lurve, either. I’m not sure how people lurve, but I like it because it makes me appreciate myself when I get it. Like a pat on the back.
So, I don’t think you should leave. Don’t take things people say too seriously if you decide to stay.

Lurve is a fun gimmick (much like the points on Who’s Line). It should not be taken seriously. At best it is a general indicator of how long a person has been on Fluther. The question of how people give out lurve has been asked several times here; it turns out it’s often pretty arbitrary.

Only you can answer that question @nofurbelowsbatgirl. Given the feelings you describe it doesn’t seem to be a positive experience for you right now. Unless you can find a way to take things less seriously, perhaps you do need to at least consider a break.

Who cares what others think?

@uberbatman
Exactly.
What is important is what everyone thinks of themselves.
Fluther site assists us to see anothers viewpoint and then decide for ourselves.

I was taking it to personally and left for a few months. Things were better when I came back.

Never answer any contentious answers in a fashion that is opposed to the clique majority who will attack you when you do. Join in the inane exchanges and tell yourself it is fun. Learn how to toe the fine line between a personal attack and just rude and insulting. Learn how to argue properly and only with outcasts like yourself, don’t engage with the clique. Dire circumstances can occur when you do.

Follow these few rules and you will be fine! This is not your family or friends, it is just a time killer. Sometimes it is interesting and sometimes so predictable. I can almost always guess just by looking at a question, who will answer it, how they will answer it and who will tell you if you don’t like it to get the hell out.

Taking a break may be a good idea, if it’s upsetting you so much. That’s just not good for you. :(

As to staying or leaving, only you can really decide that. It does take a bit of a thick skin to be able to participate in strenuous debate, especially if you are in a minority position, and sometimes people just aren’t up for that. Sometimes people develop a thicker skin by hanging around here, but many don’t.

Some jellies handle it by not entering into certain types of threads, instead sticking with the more lighthearted topics. Some take regular breaks to recharge their batteries, coming back refreshed. And, sadly, some people leave. Whatever you decide, we wish you all the best.

Stay

@nofurbelowsbatgirl Only you can decide what is best for you. Whether or not you and I have similar opinions, I respect you for expressing yourself and helping me to understand why you may see things differently from me. I always try to be respectful in my answers. I never like to see someone leave us because they feel disrespected or ignored. Lurve is a silly and relatively meaningly aspect of Fluther. Getting your questions answered thoughtfully is one benefit of being here. Expressing your viewpoints is validating for you whether one person agrees with you or one hundred people do. I think we all have to live our lives authenticly and most of the time, that happens beyond what we do on the Internet. Be sure to get outside, breath to air and do things out in the real world. Drop in to Fluther to see what questions are on peoples minds and what people say in response. Give your own answer if the topic stirs your interest. Feel free to ignore questions or answers that don’t seem interesting. I am sure you have a unique set of viewpoints to express and I will make a point of paying attention to what you say and I will try to give you a respectful reply. We don’t have to see the world the same way. I’m still interested in what you have to say. If you decide to stay, I hope you will find some satisfaction from your experiences here. If you decide to leave, I will respect your right to make such a choice. Personally, I hope you decide there are reasons why you will continue to participate. We are all just people. Sometimes our discussions are lighthearted, other times some of us get very wrapped up in articulating our points of view. Whatever you decide, I wish you joy and satisfaction in your life experiences.

Perhaps if the site is causing you so much negativity, it might be better for you to go. Or, take a nice break, and then return. Many of us do just this.
I’m not saying I want you to go, but if it’s causing you all this pain, it might not be for you. I’m not saying that your claims of this place are not true; I found it tough as a noob, and I find it tough now. But I found reasons to stay, and it’s worth it. Good friends, and a lot of laughs and learning. I mean this place is a little bitchy, but it also offers a level of freedom which is not common in many sites like this. And people have accepted me for who I am, and such would not have been possible without the freedom I speak of. And the peeps who don’t like me can’t do fuck all about it. :)
But it has to be said, not every community is for everyone. And no community is perfect. We are not excluded from these rules. Some can hack it, some can’t. Try to give it a bit more time, and a little chance. I agree, I wish we could do away with the lurve system, but if you can see passed that, we’re not a bad buncha fuckers, really. :)
I guess only you can decide, as stated, and I suggest a little break. Then come back and see.

I don’t really have anything new to say.

Since this is a support thing I will add my two cents. You have a good sense of humor you can make me laugh.. Remember that question with zen?

But I take breaks they are healthy. Fun to get out of my head and into the real world just as it is to share ideas and gain insight and think etc. The fun anonymous laughs with jellies.

You should realize that this is merely an internetsite. I don’t mean to sound harsh, but that is the fact. Take it for what it is. It’s got nothing to do with you. If it’s making you cry, then you are taking it too seriously.

Uh,ultimately it’s just a Q&A site – why do you let it get to you so?

If you feel oppressed on opinion questions, don’t click on them, just answer those questions in your area of expertise (that’s more the original purpose of this site, as I understand it – a diverse group of users providing helpful input. It’s evolved into more of a “Chatty Kathy” social site, but personally, I’d be happy to see it move back to thought-provoking and creative questions).

It’s ultimately your decision on whether to hang around, take a break or quit altogether, that much is clear.
What I will say though is this, there are inevitably faceless moronic cowards peppered across sites like this, who spew out their bile at strangers they’re never going to meet, it fills a void in their lives as they sit in their own blubber welded to their chair XD
Don’t sweat the small stuff & put into context sites like this…it’s all a load of bollocks at the end of the day, isn’t it?

There is nothing on the Internet worth participating in regularly if it is going to cause you to sit in front of our computer bawling your eyes out. There is enough in real life to make one feel that way, why seek it out? Fluther may be the place for you and it may not, only you can say for sure. If you do decide to stay it should only be if you can divest yourself a bit emotionally; if you can’t then it just isn’t healthy for you to be here – especially if you have an emotional disorder to begin with.

I am in a Fluther minority and a great number of people disagree with me in many, many threads. I have learned to deal with it a couple of ways. First, I keep in mind that what they think doesn’t matter at all in my world so let them attack. As long as they don’t attack me as a person, I let it roll off my back. If they do attack me as a person I flag the response and it is removed. It is very important to distinguish between a personal attack and an attack on what you are sharing. I also remind myself that these discussions are purely rhetorical in nature. Looking at it this way actually makes heated discussions fun. The more a person tries to challenge my beliefs, the more chances I have to contemplate their questions, come up with a reasonable response, and solidify those beliefs in my mind. The key is the ability to be able to look at the debate in a healthy way, not in a way that destroys you emotionally.

Thanks everyone from the bottom of my heart :)) It is clear to me that I need to stay.

@dxs hit the nail on the head. I can be very passionate about it. I feel like my answers can be mocked at times so sometimes I lash out and the bipolar monster takes over but the first answer was always very honest. Me as a bipolar person does not do debates well. :/ Especially with something I am super passionate about.

I suppose I don’t trust people because I don’t even trust myself. I struggle each day with my disorder. I also have a bit of an addictive type personality and will even multi task to accomplish the need, so say I’m at the gym on the treadmill, I might be checking my text at the same time or even writing an answer to a fluther question. I really have to stop it. I’m a work in progress.

Thanks for all the answers. The answers to this question show me that while I may feel like an outcast in a particular area, which I think I am really just going to avoid, because I feel I am very educated about it but I need to find somewhere else put that energy to use where people will accept it graciously instead of be against it, if you know what I mean.

But for all my other opinions everyone has accepted them. So again my bipolar gets the worse and best of me and I over exaggerate yet again. :/

You see you have helped :) We may not be perfect together but I realize I can’t leave a place I lurve because we butt heads on one thing or some things or whatever.

We can still travel together we just don’t have to stay in the same room all the time :)

Hi, @nofurbelowsbatgirl!

I’m sorry you’re having a hard time.

As someone who has been taking part in discussion threads for a significant portion of my life, I have to say that I understand your frustration, to an extent. But it’s a form of stress that I find enjoyable. I like that some discussions make me question my own motives, my own beliefs, my own sources. If my comments are mocked by others, that’s motivation to look into why I said what I did. What is the reasoning behind that belief or that statement? Is it valid? Should I look into further researching my position on this topic?

If you are not of the mindset to constantly defend your position on certain topics, you might not enjoy what is, in its essence, a persuasive form of writing. Debate threads are just that. You’re presenting the case for your beliefs and then defending that case, with the intent to convince others of its validity.

Now, you’re from what is, in greater society, a majority position. You’re not accustomed to having your beliefs questioned in “polite society”. “This is what I believe” is generally enough for most people. On Fluther we tend to dig deeper than that. Why is abortion wrong? Why shouldn’t gay people get married? Why do you think God exists? We don’t necessarily want you to change your position, but we do want you to know why you’ve taken it, and understand the logic behind it. And, I among others want to encourage you, if you’ve never really thought about it beyond the simple fact of belief, to explore the logic behind it.

If that’s something you’re interested in doing, I encourage you to take a break, cool off, enjoy some non-Fluther time, and come back when you’re ready to talk. And if not, you can find a social group that fits your personality a bit better. Or, you can enjoy the light-hearted side of Fluther – the pancakes and the lurve parties, and avoid the debates.

Whatever works for you.

“The light hearted side of Fluther”…welcome to my world :)

I only discovered this party just now…
Try to remember the difference between people not accepting your opinions (this is their right in a free society) and people personally attacking you. They are very different things. Feel free to take breaks to recharge. It’s only the internet…
Please stay. I appreciate your presence here.

I’m a theist myself but I’m on here because I enjoy debating people who think differently than me on certain issues. I’ve been the recipient of quite a few goose eggs in threads where every other person but me recieved at least one GA. My suggestion here would be to take occasional breaks from fluther, and to realize that your own happiness and worth as a person should not be dependent on how others react to you on this site.

Stay! I’ve got to know what your name means. Does the nofurbelow go with batgirl or nofurbelow? I need to get the image right in my head. :-)

Spoiler: Her late husband hated body hair.

@nofurbelowsbatgirl Stay, I like you.

If it sets you back mentally though, your mental health is much more important.
Maybe stay away when it gets to be too much? I do that sometimes, and I also don’t talk to everyone.

People all have their own personalities and the nasty ones that you’d avoid in real life, are the ones you should ignore here as well, it’s not worth the time to argue with idiots. :)

Stay! I’ve laughed at your posts, I like your sense of humour. Maybe steer away from the threads about religion? Seems like they’re too upsetting for you right now… But stay! :]

Please stay. It can be easy to get discouraged, especially if you’re not “in” with the right crowd (a glaring fault of Fluther’s, considering how egalitarian and open-minded the collective claims to be). Real discussion among intelligent people allows for disparate viewpoints; don’t let a lack of lurve bother you—especially since it obviously “doesn’t matter”.......

I also enjoy your contributions! :) However, as others have said, if it’s hurting you, a re-think (and definitive action) is in order. Your well-being trumps the perceived opinions of a faceless community any day.

@nofurbelowsbatgirl I like your sense of humour and your chutzpah. But I almost never respond to your comments, because I find that you come out swinging from “what your gut/heart tells you” and not from a logical standpoint. Often, you ignore very sensible responses, seemingly without taking in what the other person is saying – and just interpret every criticism as an attack.

Generally speaking, these criticisms are not attacks – they are just arguments from a different point of view than yours. If you do want to stay, I would strongly recommend taking people’s arguments a lot less personally, listening to other people’s comments, and actually considering whether they might be right, instead of assuming that everyone is attacking you for (usually) your religious point of view.

I am an atheist, and while I disrespect religion, I have respect for people, whether they are religious or not. For the most part, I have found that, despite the cries of “Persecution!”, most atheist or moderately religious jellies are the same. But if you are not going to argue logically, then people are going to cream you. It’s just the nature of discussion.

@glacial Some of us are sensitive, and I know a lot of you don’t get that, maybe it’s a regional issue, but you guys can be harsh.

@nofurbelowsbatgirl and I have talked a few times, and she’s great, and sweet, she just stands up for what she believes, regardless of whether she can ‘WIN’ the debate, do you understand? Not all of us are here to ‘win’, we want to discuss things like rational adults, and one-on-one you guys can get ‘it’, but as a group, it’s like mocking mode kicks in, which is incredibly frustrating to some of us.

I can be really mean, and I can say thing’s I’d regret to make my point quite often, but I don’t because it’s not that important to me to make you understand as a group, and because I want to be a nice, good person. I’m not so sure that all jellies have that same goal here, and that decreases my comfort level and trust, which in turn impedes true open dialogue.

You know, @KNOWITALL, I’ve never thought about it in these terms before, but I think it is a good way to put it, that not everyone is on here for debate. I’m here to banter and receive/give advice and learn what fellow humans think, rather than to try to win arguments.

@bookish1 Exactly, pshewww, I’m glad I finally explained something correctly..ha!

I think a lot of people here are so set on being logical they forget what it is to be kind. And if they had a choice between the two, logic wins out every time.

When I was first started here, I was labeled as “naive” because I didn’t hop, skip, and jump just like everyone else here. In fact this one person, a mod, who thankfully is no longer here, was actually OFFENDED that I couldn’t buy his mean spirited (but logical) arguments. I think his modness got to his brain and festered there.

@KNOWITALL you can’t have it both ways though. You can’t say you aren’t here for debate, jump head long into debates, then cry persecution when someone disagrees with you.

@bookish1 one reason I respect you is because you say what you mean and mean what you say. I very rarely see you jump into a debate type thread and when you do it is clearly out of a sincerity and passion for what you believe and with a desire to educate people. You make your arguments clearly and logically and I have never seen you express self-pity because someone disagrees with you.

@snowberry I understand logic, I’m a big fan of Spock afer all, but to me the descriptive would be ‘browbeating someone into groupthink’, of which I am not a fan at ALL.

It’s interesting that human history keeps repeating with various factions of firmly held beliefs being the cause of so much pain and death. This is an interesting group because it does represent so many beliefs, that it’s a treasured resource for me.

Sometimes we really can just agree to disagree and move on.

@KNOWITALL Yes, I was willing to disagree; he couldn’t handle it. It’s more important to many people to be right than kind. Group think is “right”. I guess kind is just illogical.

To me a question that has a straight forward right or wrong answer is not a debate. For instance when someone asks what RPM single records used to be the answer is 45, no room for debate. When a question is asking about opinions or personal beliefs it is set up as more of a debate.

Thank you @SuperMouse; I appreciate that very much. I do not always succeed at it, but I always want to be kind above all.

[Mod says] please don’t name other members in a negative way and especially if they are not in the thread to respond. I’m going to remove those posts in accordance with the guidelines.

I invoked @Bellatrix just now saying how fair she was, that’s classic.

[Mod says] The guidelines on not naming people in a negative way when they aren’t in the thread are very clear. Moderators would remove mentions of any member’s name if they were discussed negatively. If you feel my action was unfair or biased please feel free to complain to the site manager.

LOL I love it! And she is fair. We’ve had a lot of fun together. Better mod this one too! :D

Sounds to me like your looking for validation, and it looks to me like you got it on this thread. Stick around a while and see how it goes.

@Bellatrix I wasn’t being snarky, I think you’re great…and fair, too. I am tired all, night, good talk.

That’s cool @KNOWITALL. Nite nite.

I have no problems with anything except, the ridicule. There are people here who don’t seem to be capable of disagreeing without resorting to snideness or ridicule. Disagree with me all you want but don’t ridicule my opinions. But it happens all the time. It is tiresome especially when done by people who think they are intellectually superior.

But hey, ignore the bs and have fun and when it gets too nasty, just hit “stop following.” You don’t get into trouble that way.

Yes, @rooeytoo I also have learned to avoid questions if certain members begin to chime in. They are pure poison, and not worth the time to read their comments.

Look at us all communicating and stuff O:-)

I do have to say though if you really want to help me out for you jellies who just can’t live without logic and debate there are actually websites out there just for that, just saying. That may get your need for it out and then you can come on Fluther and leave me be. LMFAO it’s a joke! Don’t take it seriously you serious jellies!

Your original question asked whether fluther was the right place for you; whether the many other jellies who have a different POV belong here is their question.

@rooeytoo et al , that is what the flag button is for. If someone is ridiculing/attacking you then flag it. IMO the mods are really good at removing posts that attack others especially when they are flagged and brought to their attention…

Yeah, I’ve flagged stuff that was definitely ridicule, and it was deemed “OK”. It’s all about who’s popular and especially what belief systems are “right”. If you’re not on the “right” side, then you’re an idiot, stupid, naive, etc. I also think it depends on which mod picks up your flag. As I mentioned before, some mods here are very nice.

I’m a grownup. Regardless of other people’s opinions, I am not stupid, naive, or whatever. When that whole deal about missing lurve happened, I realized the lurve thing was a sham, and I lost a lot of respect for the mods here.

I stay to support the few people who come here asking questions on certain topics and actually hope to find answers.

@snowberry Why not take that up with Auggie then?

” When that whole deal about missing lurve happened” What missin lurve thing?

“I realized the lurve thing was a sham” of course it is… it’s just like a nod of agreement IRL , I don’t get why some seem to apply so much meaning to it in the first place…

Oh, we went over it and over it and over it. A whole question on it. I’ll not ruffle the mod feathers by giving you the link, but you can find it if you look, unless of course they took the question down. I wouldn’t be surprised. Anyway, now it’s over. I just stated where I am now after it’s over.

Edit: Comment Redacted

@uberbatman The founders made it a big deal when they started throwing “mansion parties” for the ones who made certain milestones. And don’t forget the award system. They gave lurve meaning and weight. http://www.fluther.com/awards/

They musta seemed like good ideas at the time…

I have gone over and over it too. It is why I have landed on the “fine line” theory. It seems ridicule and rudeness is acceptable as long as it is not in the form of a personal attack. Now apparently a personal attack is saying “you are a whiner!” But if you say “you act like a whiner” or “you whine all the time, if you don’t like it, why don’t you leave” that is acceptable. Unless of course you say it to the wrong person, then you are accused of being argumentative and arguing improperly.

It is interesting, I thought I was the only “trouble maker” but apparently, there are a bunch of us. Good to know!

Now @snowberry said, better drop it before feathers get ruffled again!

Yep. You’re catching on, @rooeytoo! Smartypants!

@uberbatman, that is the best description of lurve I have ever seen on here. It can mean so many things—whether people think you have expressed yourself well or convincingly, whether they agree with you, whether they just respect you because you wrote a shit ton or with great conviction… It’s a nod of agreement or recognition.

@bookish1 – I don’t see which one you are referring to, is it the response that was redacted?

@rooeytoo See here, “it’s just like a nod of agreement IRL”.

gotcha! thanks and I personally don’t even think it carries that much relevance. So much is accrued at the high score parties and for silliness. It seems that it is more indicative of how much time one spends here than offering valuable or helpful answers. Except for you of course @augustlan, you are the diplomat of the century. I still think you should be at the UN.

Haha, I’m picturing myself walking into a UN meeting with my whip!

Scary!

relevant.

Many people leave without asking for validation. Every member is valuable but if one must leave to preserve one’s sanity, then ya gotta do what ya gotta do.

I suggest you not look to lurve for anything more than something fun and silly, like when children get goody bags when they leave a party.

As far as arguing with people, I try to avoid it as I tend to let arguments bother me and stay with me, even when I shut the computer off. To me, your opinion is your opinion and my opinion is my opinion, and as the saying goes, “opinions are like assholes: everyone has one.”

It’s a fun site if you can keep it lighthearted in your head.

Whey-hey, will ya look at that, yet another thread descends into petty little insults/attacks, internet idiots with nowt else better to do.

Who’s going to let a few bad apples ruin the whole crop, not I. Just keep remembering that diversity is what makes life so interesting, and people unwilling to do that, only limit themselves. How boring if we were all the same! :) Peace.

@ucme Actually, it wasn’t like that at all. The comments were true, spot on, but a person was named. So it got modded. If that’s not clear enough for you, I refer you to @rooeytoo‘s post, which sums up the “personal attack” part.

“I have gone over and over it too. It is why I have landed on the “fine line” theory. It seems ridicule and rudeness is acceptable as long as it is not in the form of a personal attack. Now apparently a personal attack is saying “you are a whiner!” But if you say “you act like a whiner” or “you whine all the time, if you don’t like it, why don’t you leave” that is acceptable. Unless of course you say it to the wrong person, then you are accused of being argumentative and arguing improperly.”

Get the picture?

No I don’t get the picture, maybe if it was framed nicely & you lowered the asking price.
Seems like the usual shite though, just wearing a different coat.

Usual shite, yes, as for making it more clear than that, I cannot. It would get modded again.

Edit: And @rooeytoo did an excellent job of explaining how things work here.

@snowberry Yeah, been there, done that, got the t-shirt, not the fluther one though, dear me no…now that is shite :)

@snowberry “The founders made it a big deal when they started throwing “mansion parties” for the ones who made certain milestones.”

The founders had nothing to do with the whole milestone thing. That was an entirely grass roots initiative that started when @marina hit 10K. Jellies just spontaneously threw the first K party. Once that happened, then it naturally became a “thing”. The awards came quite a bit later. Just for the record.

Take a break, like maybe one week. If you want to force yourself to take a break, you can even ask me to temporarily ban you and then unban you in one week (I’ve done it to myself before).

So, after you leave Fluther for a week, or however long you want, two things could happen:

You could return to Fluther. The only reason for this to happen is if you actually want to come back to Fluther and you find Fluther enjoyable.

Or, you could find something else that is enjoyable to fill the time that you spent on Fluther, and never come back.

Either one of these possibilities will benefit you. If you are on Fluther, but it’s not fun, then you are not receiving any benefit, so that is why you should take a break and decide what is best for you.

Don’t worry about what is best for Fluther. You owe Fluther nothing.

@PhiNotPi Can’t imagine why you felt the need to make a dramatic announcement on getting back on track, all threads adapt & develop dependant on the flow of conversation.
Not withstanding the abundance of modded responses, this thread remains consistent with that trend.

As drama was not my goal, I have removed that statement.

I’d make a great mod ~

Yall gots to settle, homebrews.

I’d be a great mod too

@Symbeline I reckon we’d be firm but fair, although I may just abuse my position a little…bribes & such like.

@ucme Haha, what kind of bribes might be made on here?

But seriously though, the #1 way to decrease variability in moderation is to increase the number of mods, and that’s in the math. It’s similar to the central limit theorem, or the law of large numbers, except with mods.

@Symbeline How the fuck should I know, I just made that shit up for the lulz :)

I have been coming here for years, and still have not achieved 5000 lurve points. LOL. Big fucking deal. (Probably because most of my sage-like answers and G-rated comments get removed.) :). Use this place to ask yer questions and state your opinions. If people don’t agree, so fucking what? I certainly wouldn’t be upset or sad about it in the least. All in all there are some peeps that are cool as hell, buti i still voice my “delicate and un-abrasive “opinions at will.

@thorninmud “The founders had nothing to do with the whole milestone thing. That was an entirely grass roots initiative that started when @marina hit 10K. Jellies just spontaneously threw the first K party. Once that happened, then it naturally became a “thing”. The awards came quite a bit later. Just for the record.”

OK, I don’t care much HOW the lurve thing started, but the fact is, it did.

The the way things are here at present, lurve apparently DOES matter even though a lot of people insist it doesn’t re: awards, points, mansion parties, and many many questions.

And at the same time, it’s all a hollow sham. How screwed up is that?

@snowberry I think the reality is that lurve matters to some people and it doesn’t matter to others. I don’t think there is anything wrong with taking pride in one’s lurve and I do find it irritating when people who claim not to care act like they are more evolved than those who do care. To some people it is a hollow sham and to some people it is quite important. That is the way with lots of things in life some people get worked up about things other people could not care less about.

@Only138 All in all there are some peeps that are cool as hell, buti i still voice my “delicate and un-abrasive “opinions at will.

Personally, I wouldn’t have it any other way. :)

@tinyfaery I’ll even say it to you: It’s just a Q&A site.

Yes, but it is also my ocean and I don’t appreciate the pollution. I’m a true introvert with psych problems and fluther has helped me in so many ways, and I have met great friends here. I want fluther to be what it has always been and others seem to think it’s their site alone and want to change it.

I just had a thought, oww my head hurts…this question would make a great country song title, providing enough angst was produced in the lyric :)

@tinyfaery Psych problems or not, if you find the turns that this thread has taken has started to bother you, just hit the “stop following” button, and Boom! Your world is back the way it was.

As for myself and a few others, we have found this discussion to be not only encouraging, but cathartic as well. I wish you well.

You can keep the platitudes to yourself.

I would not dream of coming here for catharsis. Now, cathexis, that’s a whole other story.

@gailcalled, Thank you for teaching me a new word today!

^^^One good reason to hang around here, I guess.

@snowberry, couldn’t we say the same thing for your lurve? If it is bothering you so much just stop paying attention to it. Let go of the meaning you give it. Boom, your world is back the way it was.

@SuperMouse Yes, that is true, but I keep getting the #$*& notices. So no, it doesn’t go away. I wish it did.

@gailcalled, I’m here to build my vocabulary, steal an outhouse, and see pictures of angry Milo.

yall give me a holler when yous ready to do that outhouse thing

Milo here: I already have my custom-built outhouse and its attending attendant, but thanks anyway.

Have you seen what @rooeytoo did once while I was napping? Please note that my expression defines baleful.

Wow! I’ve been gone for about five hours and all of this has transpired. I thought some of you might appreciate A Spread

So on the day I decide to take a break ya’ll go FCUKing nuts on my thread.
Wat the fug! ( ⊙ o ⊙ )
Oh, BTW just so we make this clear I am flutherfriggen LURVE HAPPY, I actually don’t care who answers or whether I agree or not, there have been a few bad days but those don’t count OK! LOL. No. I actually mean literally they don’t count LMAO.

^Are you on meds?

^Yep. why? :/

Your mood seems to be erratic from what I can see just in this thread.

Ah, yep while it isn’t normal it is much better and I am also working myself out of pysochotic depression.

I think most of the people on this thread sound as if they forgot to take their meds!!!

@rooeytoo :)

@Bellatrix @chyna I didn’t know it was a qualification though :/ so I apologize for my erratic behavior.

@nofurbelowsbatgirl I like you, and honestly, even on meds you’re still way cooler than some negative nancy’s on this site that have to be ‘right’ and ‘win’ before they’re happy. :)

I’m late to this party. But I’ll say as many others did…take a break if it upsets you so much. Or go loopy on meds. Whichever works for you. Only you can know if Fluther is right for you.

All I can say is that I relate a bit. Much of the time I feel invisible on here. I’m certainly not one of the popular kids. And yes, some of the popular ones take advantage of their position. Others don’t.
I find it interesting that, many times, it’s the ones in these cliques who don’t see a problem. Heh, go figure.
I have almost left Fluther a few times because of the cliques or the “cool kids”. Why? Because it can be frustrating spending so much time trying to make a legible and intelligent answer (it can often take me longer than others because of health reasons)...and it gets 0 lurve. Then someone comes along and says “tits”, and they are swarmed with GA’s. No, I’m not talking about anyone in particular. It’s just an example.
The frustration also rises when one does not share a popular view. You can be out right attacked. If it is by a member of the Fluther elite, it’s less likely to be modded. I’ve seen it so many times over the years.
In saying all this, I’m not putting down Fluther. I do like the site and its community. But for those who aren’t in the clique, it can get frustrating. Especially when the clique complains about those who are complaining about this very problem.
Asking a question about leaving seems odd to me though because only you can know if this site works for you. Perhaps it is simply self validation. That is fine too, as long as it’s not constant.
All that being said, I care about lurve…yet, I don’t. I like to know that my posts are useful to someone instead of falling to the wayside. What’s the point of posting on a Q&A site if your answers are unhelpful? Sometimes, that can feel like a lot of work for nothing. Granted, just answering questions can many times help me see some things more clearly. It can also teach me about myself. I am also one of the jellies who do not come here to debate. That is so not my forte. So, yes, it can feel intimidating when someone jumps on you…trying to pull a debate out where one isn’t wanted.
Fluther will be what its members make it. Them’s the breaks ’

@Plucky I enjoy you and am sorry you feel that way. :(

Quite an interesting study in human nature though, unfortunately along with the good you have to take the bad, just life ‘real’ life. Embrace the nice ones and let them enrich your life and your brain, and ignore the others, I’m trying to do the same. (My temper often keeps me answering far longer than I should, I’m working on that.)

I have to wonder who these “cool kids” or “popular Jellies” are that everyone is talking about. If I’m one of them, that would certainly be a first in my life.

@Plucky You’re not invisible, I have you on my radar…right in the crosshairs of lurve :)
I had to laugh at the notion of “cool kids” though, if there are cliques then they’re far removed from being cool, this is fluther, think of them more like the card school in One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest, harmless types living in their own bubble…“ahhh, I love Juicy Fruit”

@Plucky I am really sorry to hear that you feel this way. I am not asking you to name names, but I have to ask, what makes one a member of the “Fluther Elite”? Also, I really have to chime in and say the mods bend over backwards to make sure the moderation is fair. There is no secret plot to lift any members up above any other members. We all do our best to moderate the site according to the guidelines. Period. The only members we treat differently are spammers and those we terminate with extreme prejudice.

1) There is no doubt my assertion will bring quips from those who disagree and have “proof” of the unfairness of it all, but I will always believe that fairness to all and the maintaining the quality of the site are the main priorities of the entire mod team.

2) @Seek_Kolinahr I was totally wondering the same thing! I have never been one of the cool kids and am fairly certain I am not a cool kid here either. Not that I would want to be what with them all being so mean.

3) I think it is essential to remember that this is the Internet not real life. It is supposed to be a distraction from real life not add to the stress!

@Seek_Kolinahr We aren’t allowed to talk poorly about someone by name here per Bella.

@KNOWITALL we really aren’t supposed to single out jellies for commentary in any thread. That isn’t per @Bellatrix it is Fluther policy. The only time it is allowed is in lurve celebrations.

@KNOWITALL Well, then just for the record…

I wear glasses.
I spend 12 hours every weekend playing video games.
I have over 70 Star Trek novels.
I spent most of my senior year in high school dressed in Elf garb.
Same year, I was voted “Person Most Likely to Blow Up the School”
I thought high school parties in movies were a joke, because I never knew there were actual parties going on.

and mostly…

I’m here because I don’t have meatspace friends.

The idea that I’m a “cool kid” is sort of hilarious, and also makes me think, “Well, shouldn’t I be allowed to be “cool” somewhere?

Also, it’s ironic that you called out a name to say you’re not allowed to call out names

I should have explained invisible better. I mean I’m usually in the background…or feel like it. But that is how I am in RL too. I’m not saying it’s bad or good.
I’m one of those people who sit back and watch…noticing the little things. Since I’m quiet and non-threatening, I get away with hearing/seeing more than I should. So, I guess it surprises me when I feel like I’m taking the same role in the Fluther community. As, online, I’m so much more out there. So it can sometimes feel like being somewhat ignored… Goodness, I hope that made sense.

@Seek_Kolinahr Yeah, I can’t think of any clique or group of overly worshiped people on here. except maybe ragingloli, he’s kind of like a god

And what, only 12 hours of gaming? XD

Maybe we’re all just social outcasts, unknowingly forming our own “clique”.

@Seek_Kolinahr I wasn’t saying you were one of the jerks or anything, so I’m not sure what your list was about.

I talked about an jerk the other day and Bella told me we can’t do that, so I didn’t want Plucky to get in ‘trouble’ if she answered you honestly. :) Peace.

I am a cool cunt, but pass myself off as a harmless clown here just for the lulz.

Ugh.

Cool kids reference just means the popular members. It has nothing to do with real life coolness or lack thereof.

I am also not attacking the mods. I think they generally do great. And from what I hear, they are so much better than most other Q&A sites. I do not have a lot experience in these other sites.
I also do not mean the mods are these Fluther elites.

I really hope someone else comes along, with more courage than me, to explain what I mean better. I’m not comfortable trying to do so. :/

I think @dxs is onto something. What little experience I’ve had with mods has been relatively evenhanded. It’s just people being people, including those who want to believe they’re smarter than average. Yadda yadda, we’re all social outcasts, bla bla bla… then yes, you do see some people getting lurve-bombed for saying “tits” while another’s well-crafted response gets little to no lurve, much like the dynamics seen in high school.

If you can’t see it, you’re not looking hard enough. :)

@Plucky You don’t have to if it makes you uncomfortable. No worries. If I knew exactly what you meant, other than being ganged up on, I’d be happy to wo-man up.

I’ve had more PM’s about ‘bad’ mods than just about anything, although I personally haven’t experienced anything negative really. I never read the rules all the way through so I get chastised sometimes but it doesn’t bother me at all.

@Symbeline I need time to watch full runs of various sci-fi shows on DVD, as well. This week it’s Firefly. Then we’re starting on Battlestar Galactica.

Just saying that we IRL dorks have to be allowed to be accepted somewhere. Sorry if the IRL “Cool People” – the ones who have polite society down to a science – aren’t running the show here, too. Except not very sorry.

tits

@ucme you are in the zone with your answers today! tits!

I was trying to debunk the theory mentioned earlier & low & behold, some daft buggers went & gave it some lurve :)

That’s ‘cos it’s you, @ucme :) Your posts are generally hilarious (the “for teh lulz” vibe shines through). I am not here to say one theory is Right and another is Wrong, but perhaps there’s a little something to the other viewpoint, after all…??

@ucme I think it’s a biased study… I don’t usually give you lurve for sheer vulgarity, but I enjoyed the irony of it here. ;)

@peridot The plot thickens…or not :)
@glacial Daft bugger ;-}

@Seek_Kolinahr What is “polite society”?

Also, by elite, I don’t necessarily mean more intelligent. Perhaps favoured is the correct term.

Basically, the places where I’m asked if it’s okay to refer to me as “eccentric”, or if I find that “too insulting”. – Happened today at work. Clearly I’m not one of the “cool kids” in the office.

@Seek_Kolinahr Seriously, someone asked you that at work? WTH? That is so rude, I’m sorry.
In my line of business, those ‘cool’ kids are the weirdo’s, like so boring, the music industry accepts artists as they are. Ignore them, they probably all shop at JC Penney and have their nails done, too right?! Drones and sheep.

@Plucky I really think the notion of favored jellies is incorrect. Who would favor said jellies? What would favoring them look like? As I mention upthread, the mods go out of their way to make the moderation as even handed as possible and there are lurve limits, so I am having a hard time seeing how favoritism could manifest itself here.

Now look all of you who persist in saying, thinking, even dreaming that fluther is anything but 100% fair and equal, you have been told, your suspicions are just that, you are paranoid and delusional, there is no fluther clique!

How many freakin times do you need to be told!!!!!

Now if this is all too difficult for you, maybe you need a break and some shock treatments or perhaps a lobotomy. Definitely see your doctor and look into these possible cures. Then come back when you are ready to see the light (no no no, not that Light, we all know that Light is nothing but a fairy tale! the jelly glow light!)

Thing is if there was an actual clique, or several ones, we’d know. Well okay I base this on AB, (answerbag) where there were groups of people more popular than others. But that place definitely has/had them. Frankly, haven’t been there forever, so I don’t know what it’s like now.
But if there are cliques here, then they must be pretty secretive. It’s like, nobody knows who they are. Like fuckin’ Fluther having its own Illuminati or something.

Only you’re not allowed to know if your’re a member of the Fluther Illuminati.

that actually happened on GameFAQS years ago

I think we’ve all felt like the outsider before, I know I have, but I’m pretty sure Plucky didn’t mean it as a literal group as she stated above. It’s her perception of fluther, jeesh people, some of you just can’t help but keep pushing people who are already down.

THAT is what some of us are noticing occurring here and finding it disturbing.

Ain’t pushing anyone around, just making my observation on cliques from having been at two different Q&A sites. Plus a stupid joke at the end, because that’s the only way I can get people to pay attention to me up in this bitch. XD that was also a joke

@Symbeline I didn’t mean you in particular, but look at all the comments about the ‘cool kids’ euphemism she used. One comment or two I could understand, but it looks a little ignorant if a euphemism or analogy is treated as reality.

Plucky was reaching out, you don’t slap that hand down, or at least I don’t.

There is nothing, repeat, nothing sadder in this world than an answerbag clique…like a circus of fools gathering for a flash mob event in a tent.

But….......if the shoe fits!

@KNOWITALL it makes me sad to think that @Plucky or anyone else believes there are favored groups here on Fluther, as that assumption is incorrect. Stating that fact is not slapping a hand down it is merely stating the truth. I really don’t see how there even could be favoritism, cliques or cool kids. @Plucky‘s feelings are hers and are certainly real, but cliques or favoritism are not responsible for those feelings.

In every single crowd there are going to be folks who perceive any argument against their point of view as a personal attack, that is just human nature. Once someone has a run-in with a particular person they are going to perceive an attack in almost any post by that person that is the least bit contrary to what they are saying. Again, it is human nature. A small minority of people on Fluther feels this way and there is absolutely nothing anyone can do to change their minds. That being said, I am not willing to wear kit gloves around these people. It is not the purpose of a site like this to answer questions just to placate people. The reason most people are here is to engage in spirited debate. I think most people do their best not to cross the line into personal attack but we cannot be held responsible for anyone else’s perception of our quips. Sometimes one’s history with a certain jelly can color that perception.

The members of this site are human. They state their opinions forcefully, they get their feelings hurt, and sometimes they cross the line into personal attack. As I have said again and again in this thread, the moderation team works very, very hard to moderate all quips fairly and no one is above modding. No. One. Everyone from Ben & Andrew on down has been or has the potential to be modded on this site. Whether they are the founders, relatives of the founders, moderators, or the community manager, if they do not follow the guidelines they experience moderation. No matter how much anybody wants to say that isn’t the truth it simply is reality.

@rooeytoo, I am not sure what shoe you are speaking of, but I can assure you the favoritism footwear does not fit.

Well said, @SuperMouse.

And @Plucky, I think you’re cool. :)

I wonder if the shoe is wedged up the arse of the “salesperson”...what a load of cobblers!

What I was getting at with the clique thing is that if there are so many “social outcasts” here one Fluther, then we’re just one big clique of social outcasts. I think Fluther’s cool, though.

@SuperMouse I keep seeing the phrase “personal attack”, again and again. Who’s saying anything about that?

Social dynamics here are skewed, as they are anywhere else humans congregate. People who refuse to see this choose to do so, and there is absolutely nothing anyone can do to change their minds.

@peridot how do you see skewed personal dynamics manifesting on Fluther?

I mention personal attacks because there is much said about people believing they are attacked for sharing their opinions.

I actually didn’t come here to engage in “spirited debate” I came here to give my piece of knowledge to the world of jellies. I call that an opinion people can take it or leave it, can’t they? I have other reasons for being here but it was never to debate. Being bipolar I don’t “engage in spirited debate” well. :/

@nofurbelowsbatgirl it is totally your prerogative to avoid spirited debate. That being said, when you opt to engage in that way it doesn’t work to cry attack when people disagree with you.

Depends on what size shoe you wear. The fine line and which side you are on is subjective. If a friend or cohort is the one teetering on the line, the line blurs a bit more than if it is a faceless entity. I don’t know why mods make such a big deal denying it. It is human nature and I assume you are human. There are no absolutes, it’s not 2+2, it’s subjective! I hear all these protests and it makes me think thou doest protest too much. If you like fluther you accept it and put up with it.

@rooeytoo one of the reasons the mods work as a team is to try to make the moderation as fair as possible – to try to avoid or at least lessen the chance for subjective moderation. Moderators don’t deny being human, what they do deny is favoritism in the moderation practices. FYI there are many non-moderator jellies that I know better than the moderation team so your statement about the jellies being faceless entities is simply incorrect.

You are right, there are no absolutes, and that includes your absolute belief that every single time someone disagrees you in a way that get your hackles up, they are crossing that “fine line” you are so fond of pointing out.

@SuperMouse I don’t say this to be obtuse, but it has been mentioned many times, in this thread as well as others. My repeating yet another example is not going to change your mind, so I won’t.

@SuperMouse Engage in what way? I don’t actually understand that statement. Do you see how you just tried to rookie me into a debate? Sorry, but to me that is called flame bait.

@nofurbelowsbatgirl flame bait? Rookie you into debate? I did not try to “rookie you into debate”. That is absolutely wrong.

My point is that if you jump into a thread arguing against the prevailing opinion, you should expect people to argue back. One cannot say one wants to avoid debate, jump into a thread and debate (i.e. argue against what has been said in the thread) then say the are being attacked when others argue their point.

Honestly, how you perceived my post as flame bait is beyond me.

@SuperMouse Well simply because I feel like I need to state my position therefore I need to start a debate about what you said. And really it is the context of how you said it. An opinion is that, just an opinion and it is a simple statement.

The first part of what you what you said “it is totally your prerogative to avoid spirited debate” is an opinion. The rest of what you said is where someone may feel the need to defend themselves, therefore being pulled into the debate, IE to me that is the flame bait.

Late to the game.

Most of my favorite cohorts have moved on from this site. I’ve been around since 2008 (Jude). This (mama_cakes) is a new(ish) user name. Anyhow, I don’t get emotionally involved. It’s a Q and A site, ferchristsakes. ;)

I stick ‘round for tinyfaery and symbeline and to post questions when I need help. I rarely get involved in discussions anymore.

The only time the clique stuff gets to me is when people start listing their favorites, or who touched them or who they would miss. I’m never on the list and I sometimes turn into that grade school girl who was never accepted by the popular kids. Invisible.
The only other time is when it seems the lurve is flowing at the milestone parties for everyone but me.
Then I come to my senses and realize I’m a 52 year old woman and I’m on an Internet site with people I’ve never even met.

(Judi, I’d miss you. :) I have you over of FB, which is good!)

@nofurbelowsbatgirl interesting theory, but the truth is that your first paragraph is pretty much a description of how provocative questions are supposed to work on a site such as this. That is the essence of debate. If you don’t want to debate don’t. There are plenty of questions here that aren’t about opinion, jump into those and avoid debate. Or jump into debate questions and have at it. Just don’t jump into debate questions then cry foul when people you know, debate with you.

As has been the case on other threads, I am done discussing this with you. To me your seeming desire to rile me up it is not worth the aggravation. That is one of the ways I avoid getting so wrapped up in stuff like this that it stresses me out.

Just so you know, when I said favouritism, cool kids, Fluther elite, etc… I was not talking, or even thinking, about the mods um modding. I really don’t know how else to describe or explain my point. It’s really easy to notice the cliques just by reading how people interact in the threads on here. I said it when I first joined, when someone had raised the issue then. And I was new, yet I was able to notice the hierarchies of Fluther.
Seriously, if I thought the modding was so horrible, I’d have left ages ago. That wasn’t my point. I don’t have a lot of experience with being modded, so I can’t say much from that point of view. I think I’ve only had two, maybe three, answers modded…one was at my request.
I also wasn’t speaking of being attacked personally. I’m talking mostly in terms of what I’ve observed. I follow threads more than I actually post.
And, I’m not sitting here all upset or crying over this issue. It was just my opinion on the topic of “not belonging”. The cliques are natural in any community…natural but disappointing. That is all.

Beautifully put, @Plucky

@Plucky thank you for clarifying! I hate that you feel like you aren’t in the cool clique! I think you are a great member of The Collective and I hope you eventually get comfortable and that feeling goes away.

Not sure if that does any good because I have a hard time believing I am one of the “cool kids” (especially since I didn’t know anything about them so I am not in on the secret) but hopefully it even means something coming from a proud nerd.

Well I have never cried foul if you are trying to indirectly say I have. I have actually presented great arguments. But again I am a theist and the room was full of atheists. I can handle one on one quite well, I won’t name names but I did that in PM and it was not me who put up a brick wall in the conversation. But when I am being jabbed by everyone from all corners then yes my bipolar kicks in and I rant..I can’t help it. And then I get suggestions like “try to not be like that” well OK tell the amputee to act like they have an arm then.

Sometimes, the best response is to walk away @nofurbelowsbatgirl. If you don’t, you certainly can’t then complain that people argued with you.

Bellatrix – also not one of the cool kids. Will the cool kids please stand up and identify themselves!

Lol @Bellatrix

Supermouse now I think you’re accusing me of citing the fine line anytime anyone disagrees with me is not a personal attack but rude untrue and unfounded. Many disagree wuth me and it is no problem. It is comments like yours that are incalled for. My greatest sin is to accuse you of being human.

@rooeytoo as a brilliant jelly once said, “If the shoe fits…” and I know whatever shoe you are attempting to slip on me doesn’t fit.

…and with that I bow out of craziness that is this thread.

OK everybody, I am about to name all of the cool kids in the cliques starting with 000110100001111010011001001000010100010001100100000101001000010000100100100010

Hmmm, my computer seems to have turned everyone’s name into code

Well at least I can show you the photo of the Fluther Illuminati

Now who wants some of This?

Just dropping in to say I lurve you people. Even the invisible and/or uncool kids. <hugs every jelly>

@Bellatrix Yes it’s true walk away, but again sometimes it is hard for me to do even that. Has no one ever seen the bipolar lady on the plane. I do not like the word demonic though. Being on meds does not get rid of being bipolar, I still have symptoms I just do not have crazy ups and downs as I used to and my mood is much more stable than before.

I have never been a cool kid. I believe in God. I have a mo-hawk and 4 stretched ear piercings. I am tattooed with skulls and flames and other things. I play awesome electric guitar and I love to dance like this.

I am an interior decorator I love lively things but oddly enough I have a fascination for death and all kinds of weird shite, I was an atheist and I was into cultish type things with a group of friends but I drew the line at almost doing a grave dig as I have too much respect for the dead. Now I am a vegan and I won’t kill anything and I will not eat anything that is dead or harm any living thing on the planet earth and I won’t even eat stuff that is processed.

Now I cringe when the lords name is used in vain but I will use some other offensive words. I stand out like a sore thumb. I mean even while I may be christian I am still doing it my own way. Oh and I am not into any type of politics at all. I made that decision a long time ago, I can’t handle the debating lol.

I should also add that my brain is like a Rolodex. I have tons of information in there. I am not trying to boast about being smart. Thing is I have a lot of knowledge about a lot of things. You jellies can take it or leave it that is up to you but if read through all the ranting I swear there is some really good shite somewhere in there. LOL.

I haven’t read through all of this, but I am wondering the same as @Seek_Kolinahr (well the hell up), who are the cool kids here?

I was thinking about that, and while there are certainly friendships that develop between people here, the ‘cool kids’ group seems to vary from thread to thread. It seems to depend on the topic and maybe on who all is in any particular thread. A certain camaraderie can be observed among people in one thread, but those same people can be at each others’ throats in another.

I do get that some people seem to fly under the radar, and honestly I really appreciate those people. The quiet ones with well thought out answers are every bit as important to Fluther as the in-your-face debaters with strong answers – the minorities and the majorities and even the jokers all add something to the mix. Fluther wouldn’t be what it is without all of you.

Ahhhh Augustian if only we could clone you!

Auggie that is right! WE are Fluther :) We are the union. The alliance. The league. The association. Illuminati here we come!

I have had disagreents with Auggie but she has never insulted me or been rude or name called.I believe that is called adult communication. Others should take a lesson from her and that is an absolute.

I know that I am not COMPLEETLY uncool because when I ask a question with my alternative username people that are usually pretty nice can be abrasive and even downright rude. I know that they would answer differently if they knew it were me.

And Bingo was his Nameo.

I wish people would be nicer to newbies and/or “unknowns” (like jellies asking under an alter-account.) Whether we ‘know’ the person or not, it never hurts to remember that there’s a real human being behind every avatar.

“even the jokers add something to the mix” Ha, you managed to say that like you were scraping dog shit off your shoe :)
I’m going to flip this around & say the only “clique” i’ve noticed are the small but increasingly vocal whiners who insist such a thing exists…look a little closer to home people, those in glass houses should’nt throw stones.

I’m really late to this conversation, and I tried to read all of the replies… but I do want to add that in all of my years on Fluther, I always find myself rooting for the “underdog.”

The members who come to the site and go against the grain and who hold unpopular opinion and still stand up for themselves take a lot of heat here, but they’re often my favorite jellies. Internet Q&A site or not, it takes a lot of guts to stand up for what you believe in, especially when everyone seems to disagree. That’s good stuff, and that’s what keeps this place interesting.

@SuperMouse I won’t speak for anyone but myself in saying no one is asking you to wear kid gloves in Q’s is a tad dramatic. Just try to be a little more polite, you know, have manners like adults should.

@nofurbelowsbatgirl I think people are under the impression that people who believe in God are wimps and won’t fight back, so we’re supposed easy targets. That makes those particular people bullies who aren’t worth our time or love. Like someone else said, just walk away, it’s hard, but even when you give them the answers they ask for, they just ask another, it’s a circle of nonsense. Peace.

Ya know…. I’ve been on this site for almost 6 years now and for probably the past 4 years people have been complaining about the cliques on Fluther. Personally I have never seen them myself and I’m generally pretty aware of these sort of things. Maybe I’ve just been a secret member of the Fluther Illuminati all these years without realizing it.

@KNOWITALL “I think people are under the impression that people who believe in God are wimps and won’t fight back, so we’re supposed easy targets.”

I honestly don’t think that anyone on Fluther thinks that.

@KNOWITALL I take offense to your insinuation that I don’t have manners and don’t behave like an adult. I debate in an adult way. I ask hard questions and challenge people, and I always do so politely. Since @rooeytoo used a saying, here is another one that seems to fit here, “if you can’t stand the heat get out of the kitchen”. For my money it is childish to complain of favoritism just because one does not like being challenged on their responses.

By the way, I believe in God, I am not afraid to say it, and I always fight back. I can think of at least three other jellies who do the same. The difference is they know their stuff, they argue based on logic rather than emotion, and they do not take disagreements personally. As a result they are among the most respected members on this site and they are theists. It is a big mistake to try to paint any group (theist or atheist) with such a wide brush.

I planned to leave but I had to set the record straight.

For my money it is childish to complain of favoritism just because one does not like being challenged on their responses.

^^ This.

@SuperMouse I didn’t mean you specifically, but I also don’t see anyone asking you wear kid gloves with them.

I was inducted into a White Pride gang in my early 20’s, if you think CONVERSATIONS ONLINE are scary to me, think again, you should know that SOME OF US WORK FOR A LIVING. I don’t have time to get out my Bible and go through passages to find one that proves my belief is biblical, or who said something.

I’m glad you believe in God and that you fight back, and those other jellies, too. If you can be unemotional about your faith and your God, you may not be able to understand the emotion that some of us feel. My relationship with God means a lot to me, he’s the only father I’ve ever had.

No one has to bother to explain themselves to disrespectful jerks, that is my point. Some of you are classy, intelligent and know how to conduct yourselves, it’s interesting you can’t see the difference even after we’ve explained this several times now.

I’m with uber..

Just so you know, I do NOT feel there are specific cliques or cool kids.

I’m more of the opinion that we’re all here for different reasons and we’re all very different people from very different cultures and regions, backgrounds, etc… Disagreements are inevitable, but they can all be handled poorly or handled well, depending on the person and their goals.

@nofurbelowsbatgirl is pretty neat and spiritually seeking, and I’ve seen her under almost constant attack in quite a few threads when she posts one simple response. You may not see that as bullying a person with a mental illness that she’s open about, but I do and she deserves better.

MIlo here; Uber and I were in a clique for a while when we bonded over our fascination with Vladimira (formerly Vladimir until Uber discovered her gender), his mantis shrimp.

Vladimira

@KNOWITALL I feel very strongly emotional about my faith in God. The thing is that I know that when I am discussing it with non-believers and trying to share my faith, I have no choice but to keep emotion out of it. My faith means a lot to me. While student teaching full time, working a part time job, raising three school aged kids, and helping provide cares for my husband living with quadriplegia, I find time to pray and read the Writings of my faith daily, so please don’t try to trump my faith because I manage to engage in a way that gets my points across without being emotionally overwrought.

I really have a hard time understanding how you can use a phrase like “some of us work for a living” in the same post where you are calling others out for being disrespectful jerks.

I have a sister living with intense mental illness. I have never invited that sister to participate on this site because I know it would be more of a detriment to her than a benefit. No one is picking on @nofurbelowsbatgirl even though it may seem that way to some. When one gets in the middle of a debate one must expect to be debated. Especially on a site such as this. It is undisputed that there are more atheists than theists on here and that theists will always be called out- shoot that has been the topic of more threads than I can count! One must know and respect one’s limitations. If one is unable to engage I debate without it impacting their mental health, one should avoid engaging in debate.

I think that what we see on Fluther is a textbook example of ingroup/outgroup dynamics, which is a perfectly normal—and unavoidable—feature of human social interaction.

Put any bunch of people together, make them interact, and they will inevitably self-sort into groups along often trivial lines. Even if you arbitrarily create groups based on a coin toss, the members of those groups will develop an ingroup/outgroup bias. That’s a fact. So it’s no surprise at all that values-based groups have a very strong sense of “in and out”.

As @augustlan pointed out, group affiliations are dynamic; they shift depending on context. So you can be allied with a particular jelly on one topic and not on another. Some I find nearly always in my ingroup, others rarely. It’s complicated.

Many of us are understandably uncomfortable with this quirk of human nature, because we recognize that it can lead to some pretty dark places. But I think it’s essential to accept that this is the way we operate, no matter how “enlightened” we want to think we are. Only when we accept its reality can we see it in operation and regulate it in our own behavior.

An interesting aspect of ingroup/outgroup dynamics is the “outgroup homogeneity effect”: you will tend to perceive the members of your ingroup as being divers, and the members of the outgroup as being more homogeneous. This leads to some of the perceptions expressed in this thread. You’re less likely to recognize that you belong to a particular group than that someone else belongs to your outgroup. That enhances the impression of cliquishness in your outgroup, and diminishes the impression of cliquishness in your ingroup. The truth is usually somewhere in between.

I’d like to see us just accept that this is how we are, not attach any moral significance to it, and just be vigilant that it doesn’t get toxic.

@SuperMouse I think you and I have discussed this enough as you seem to be purposely ignoring what I write and the context. Thanks.

@thorninmud Agreed. You can’t force anyone to have manners or kindness after all.

Here’s the music I hear while reading this thread & also the expression I wear ;-}

@ucme I picture you running around to that song, twirling your moustache and swinging your cane…that is so funny!

@KNOWITALL It’s the tune me & the wife have sex too…bloody exhausting keeping up with the rhythm, but loadsa fun :D

@ucme TMI honey…lol (If that counts as txtspk, sorry, it’s Too Much Information.)

See, I have to admit that even though you’ve bashed God a few times, you are so funny and obviously not mean-spirited, I enjoy your company. Just sayin, thanks for that.

@thorninmud “You’re less likely to recognize that you belong to a particular group than that someone else belongs to your outgroup.”

Well… that just sounds a little too self-fulfilling to me. I am not in any group, but because someone else is not me, they get to decide that I am in some group of their choosing, and presumably one that they don’t like? No thanks.

I don’t actually see any value in “accepting that this is how we are”. I think this is exactly the sort of thing we should actively try not to do. And I do think that we can start to break down these myths and get along better if we explain our points of view, as @SuperMouse and @KNOWITALL have been trying to do.

@KNOWITALL Bashed God? I swear on a stack of gideon bibles, I never touched the fella…honest.

@glacial I do see your point, BUT people have to care, and let’s face it, read this forum, some would just prefer her to leave. See why I prefer animals to humans, we are so cruel to each other.

I feel compelled to stand up for those with a mental illness like my mother, and I won’t change that. I certainly won’t stand by and watch them bullied into suicide or depression on any site I participate in either.

Animals would have smelled weakness or instability and killed her to cull the herd.

We are animals. We just have language and clothing, and a modicum of empathy.

@glacial Accepting that this is how we are is the necessary first step in defusing it. Accepting doesn’t mean being fine with it. It means seeing that those tendencies are there in yourself, acknowledging them and understanding how they work. Until you do that, they just operate in the shadows.

I absolutely hate the idea that I might be a racist. Racism goes against all of my ethical positions and outrages me when I see it in others. I’ve taken that Harvard test that identifies subliminal racism, and can pat my back for having come out “clean” on that. I like thinking that I’m a poster boy for whatever the opposite of racism is. But the fact is that when I look deeply and honestly, I do see traces of racism in me. It horrifies me when I glimpse it, but I have to accept that it’s there. I’m pretty sure there’s nothing I can do to make it go away, but knowing that it’s there keeps me on my toes.

Better to own up to our unsavory quirks.

@thorninmud Have you seen American History X? That will show you how you really feel.

After the White Pride gang I was in, I know I’m not a racist at all. They would just assume kill anyone of another race for absolutely nothing, it’s very evil.

@Seek_Kolinahr Yeah maybe, but that’s not cool, she’s a human being with faults like all of us. You’ve needed help before and received support, as have a LOT of others, so I’d think you would understand.

@KNOWITALL Thank you so much for that!!!

@SuperMouse I will defend myself to the very end. My first comment is never left with the intention for debate. But low and behold like how I stand out like a sore thumb in my real life, it seems fitting that my comments may also sometimes stand out here on fluther. Everyone has their downfalls in life and unfortunatley I happen to feel more patronized on my worse stress filled days and act out because of it. And I find myself getting more upset because I feel people are ignorant to it, which is my problem and actually stems from childhood traumas and the fact that no one ever listened to a fcuking word I said, so when I feel like that is happening in my adult life I get extremely manic, almost like the lady on the plane. Life is stressful I can’t avoid all stress and I can’t dope myself up on meds so much. Seriously sometimes I feel like I am Gary Busey and Fluther is our Celebrity Apprentice. sigh.

@nofurbelowsbatgirl No need at all to thank me for caring, I wish I could blink and make everyone understand mental illness, but I can’t. :(

@KNOWITALL I do understand. I’m just saying that the idea that animals would be better is seriously in error.

@thorninmud Respectfully, I disagree. And I will refrain from pointing fingers at your “quirks” if you will refrain from pointing fingers at mine.

Me too. I wish I didn’t have this mental illness. Makes things so much easier to walk away from. But sometimes I can’t. Even my sister does not understand. She actually loves debate she is ignorant more than anything and she fires the very root of all my manic episodes I ended up almost killing us on the highway because she just wouldn’t stop, she disowned me after that, haven’t talked to her since. I pray for her every day.

Well no I know it’s not elementary but it is evolution my dear seek. ;) what a minute I confused myself, elementary requires knowledge, knowledge requires evolution…lol maybe it is all elementary then.

@nofurbelowsbatgirl Family can push your buttons like no one else, mental illness or not, they know all your quirks and still push…lol

Hey, I hope some of these responses have helped. :)

Thank you @thorninmud for posting. You explained my point incredibly well. I was also talking about the frustration that can come with it. Thank you a million times over! You said it so much better than I.

@nofurbelowsbatgirl Gary Busey was paid to be on that show. No matter how many times or how many different ways you put it, I will not understand why you purposely put yourself into situations that cause you extra stress and impact the management of your mental illness. To me it is just a matter of pragmatism. If someone or something stresses me out, I do all that I can to avoid that person or that thing. It seems especially easy when that something is a question and answer site on the internet – not something that is a huge part of my life and my world. I think it would be a great idea for you to work hard to be able to walk away even it it takes every bit of your strength, your mental health depends upon it.

The situation with your sister is a bit more dicey and sometimes we have to deal with jerky family members whether we like it or not. You are doing the right thing by avoiding her, it makes perfect sense. As I mention upthread, my sister lives with a serious mental illness and it would never even cross my mind to engage her in a way that would hurt her or make what she is dealing with any more difficult. Then again my sister knows her limitations and when the family gets going she gets up and leaves the room to avoid the unnecessary stress.

@Seek_Kolinahr I think @KNOWITALL meant she prefers being around animals to people…as a human being (not as part of the specific animal group/species). It wasn’t about who was better. Correct me if I’m wrong.

@Plucky Exactly, I’m worn out with explaining every post that to me seems very straight-forward to me. This particular thread has been difficult for me, I’ll be honest.

I just woke up and I think way up there^^^ @SuperMouse told me, succinctly of course, to get the hell out if I don’t like it. Is that what you meant by “if you can’t stand the heat get out of the kitchen” I just love it when mods tell me to leave if I don’t like it. Makes me feel so much at home. Now here is my record, one mod has told me to leave the country if I don’t like it, now another has told me to leave fluther if I don’t like it.

Doesn’t anybody have any manners anymore. Is there no free speech anymore. Am I not allowed to express my opinion anymore. This place really is getting ridiculous, disagree with the clique, powers that be, control freaks, whatever you want to call them, and get told to leave. Thank you @SuperMouse, I’ll leave when I am ready unless you decide to have me banned for not marching in line.

@KNOWITALL Sorry, I was shooting from the hip there. Forgive me.

@rooeytoo you are mistaken. I was speaking to @KNOWITALL discussing the fact that if the debate in a thread gets to be too much, leave the thread. It is you my friend who has crossed the line by calling the mods control freaks and your insistence on reading things out of context and airing your dirty laundry all over this site. I have not and will not ask you to leave; the only piece of advice I have for you is to try to lighten up a bit, not everything is directed at you, and not everything that is is an attack.

@Seek_Kolinahr Always, I heart you. :)

@SuperMouse And I took that advice to heart. And when I don’t have time to get too involved, I’m going to try to refrain from posting anything to prevent the frustration on my side.

I have to say, I’ve been personally cussed and threatened, I’ve seen one person tell another to basically sit down and shut up, and a few other things that are not making me comfortable. Injustice is not to be ignored.

I’m not here to debate. I’m here for support from my clique (the cool women and mommies), to get help, help others and to stalk my husband. :P

@SuperMouse – I forgot, I forgot, I should have said you are acting like control freaks, not that you are control freaks, that keeps me on the right side of the fine line. I am sorry.

And is airing dirty laundry what you call describing what has been done to you in the past?

Watch out @knowitall, apparently now saying what has transpired is now called airing dirty laundry.

@rooeytoo just stop already. Please.

For the record, yes I do call mentioning your “fine line” in every single thread where someone disagrees with you airing your dirty laundry.

Oh great…did someone get a hold of my dirty undies?!

@SuperMouse Seriously? If I could be rational then I would not have a D I S A B I L I T Y. That is so ignorant of you.
Gary Busey could of been paid to be on the show but it doesn’t matter, he has a disability. It’s called brain damage. I will never understand how come you don’t want to learn about things, if your idea of knowledge is to just keep walking away it’s a no wonder you will never understand my disabilty you keep putting up a brick wall, and you have said now on about 3 different occasions that you were “done with me”. I see that a lot out here. I seem to be the only one who can handle the heat in the kitchen, and I have one melt down because it gets too hot for a freaking bipolar person to handle!

We should be getting along, but now I understand why we are butting heads!

Responding to the “whims that don’t fight back.” Statement.
I refuse to fight. To quote the great Andy Griffith, “How do you fight fire? With a hose!”
And Martin Luther King Jr.
“Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.”

Guys, this thread has gone well past the point of productivity. We’re going to archive it.