Younger folk, do you ever find yourself gently explaining to older people what language you are allowed to use in polite conversation?
Finding myself in the awkward position of telling a slightly older woman that women are not allowed to call each other “Skanks” in the 21st century, due to the slut shaming connotations.
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Younger than whom? lol
I recently used the word “screwed” in the presence of a 93 year old and she cracked up. I am 53. I am not hardcore PC, I am discriminating but don’t buy into every nicey nice little sugar coated label. I am also from the PC BC era.
You may be intellectually challenged or maybe you ARE just retarded! haha
Why does being linguistically brave relate to either age or gender? Either you’re interested in language and its evolution, or you’re not.
I am a woman older than most and I find this question very odd.
@gailcalled Can you be more expressive young lady? The oddity you are experiencing?
I call a skank a skank if it’s true.
@chyna Skank to me (and I am assuming to you) implies female promiscuity. There are a ton of words to describe women and men who are jerks without portraying female promiscuity bundled with negative traits.
Not at all. A skank to me is a filthy person that doesn’t take care of herself.
@chyna Or himself? What is the male equivalent of that word?
Calling any adult female “young lady” is also probably not a good idea.
@chyna I agree, A “skank” brings to mind a dirty crackhead ho vision in my minds eye.
@Coloma Male or female? When have you ever heard of a male referred to as a skank. I just checked Websters, and it said this was a an adjective especially utilized for females. I am really trying to figure out why you would not use “Bum” to describe females like this.
@gailcalled You seem like a lady to me, one young at heart. I will let you know if this ever backfires on me in daily life.
^^^. Still, the expresson is usually considered patronizing. I know it makes me cringe when I hear it. Alex Trebek uses it often on Jeopardy! and I want to reach into the screen and whomp him upside the head. I never hear him say, “young man.”
@gailcalled seriously, in real life, I have never had a problem saying this with women who were clearly older than me. If you project to a lady how much you respect their intelligence and authority, then call them young lady, they will often tell you in privacy they like the nickname.
@chyna Don’t jump in with her. We are having a whole different disagreement.
@Imadethisupwithnoforethought “When have you ever heard of a male referred to as a skank.”
Exactly. I get the question; I don’t know why women are taking offence to it here. There isn’t really a male equivalent. Dropping the term (and others like it) is a pro-feminist move. I’d like to think that I don’t qualify as an “older woman”, but I’m not a young one, either, and I’m well aware of the trend away from slut-shaming language. I’ve never had to have it explained to me, but I could easily imagine explaining it to someone in my mother’s age bracket, for example.
The thing is, while some older women may not realize that some terms have fallen out of favour because they are now seen as slut-shaming, there is an equivalent problem in that some younger women believe that they live in a post-feminist world, and that none of this matters. So your question is just one small piece of the landscape right now.
It really depends on the situation and my relationship with the person. If I barely know them or their past, I usually let it go, especially if they are much older (80s – 90s). If it’s someone I know well, I would talk to them about it if I knew they would be someone that wanted to stay on top of things like that.
That being said, I know women today that still call each other “skank”, “slut”, “bitch”, etc (they are close friends and do it as a joke) and none of them get offended when the others say it. I wouldn’t even try to tell them they shouldn’t say it. They are who they are and telling them it’s impolite because of the slut shaming connotations would just make them laugh (in reference to the skank example in the OP).
Some people keep up with the colloquialisms in common use and some don’t. Age has nothing to do with it; it’s how “in touch” you are, and how well you can adjust to the fact that the world isn’t the same as it was XX years ago when you were a young whipper-snapper.
As for the political correctness of the situation described in the question, I think that anybody sensitive enough to be offended by what another person calls their friend because of subtle connotations should really just crawl back under the rock they live under. That degree of sensitivity implies something wrong with you that means that you are the one that needs protection. Plug your ears and close your eye, lest the entire world offend you by it’s mere being!
@Imadethisupwithnoforethought Regarding the issue of “young lady”... really, just don’t. You may not think that this is “backfiring on you in daily life”, but I assure you that if we met in person, and you took to calling me “young lady”, I would relegate you to the sidelines pretty quickly. Whatever else you may be saying to these women about their intelligence or sparkling personalities, it is patronizing and dismissive. And soon it would become very boring.
@jerv I don’t get your response. Seriously. I am not worried about being called a slut or a skank. I am worried that my daughter will eventually have to deal with these terms, and that older women still use them. So what do your comments mean to me? Should I let it go?
@glacial I am internalizing your advice, and will be more careful go forwards.
@Imadethisupwithnoforethought In that case, you need to be more clear about what you’re actually asking.
And no, I’m not trying to be mean. I would just like us all to get along without either somebody getting butt-hurt by a bad word, yet without that person trying have their minority viewpoint become a strait-jacket for the majority, restricting the behavior of the masses in order to conform with what I see as an extremist viewpoint.
I just happen to lack tact as I consider honesty more important than manners.
@jerv That was what I was asking originally. Should I gently coach older people on language that is less judgmental? I do not even know what your original PC response means when compared to your second response. What changed in your head?
@Imadethisupwithnoforethought What worries you about your daughter having to eventually having to deal with these terms? Why not educate her as appropriate as she is growing up. You can teach her your values in regards to those words and teach her not to worry about what others say. I know “slut” was thrown around a lot when I was in middle school by girls to other girls just to hurt them, even when all of us were virgins at the time. Perhaps it won’t be “slut” when your daughter gets to that age, but there will probably be some insult that gets thrown around during her youth. It’s best to keep communication open with her and talk to her about those things as they come up.
@Imadethisupwithnoforethought In your example in your original question, what was the context of the slightly older woman using the word skank? Also, how old are we talking about?
@Seaofclouds I am 40. The woman I was speaking to was mid 50’s. The woman used the word “Skank” and I said “Asshole” would be more appropriate.
I don’t find your example that bad.
The only time I find myself “correcting” elders sometimes is when the “casual racism” comes out. I understand they’re a product of their times but I still don’t find it right and feel the need to say something.
@Imadethisupwithnoforethought What was the context of her using the word skank? In order to answer your question about gently coaching someone, I think the context in which it was used will decide if something should be said or not.
@Seaofclouds
1)The woman was being an asshole
2) The woman who was being an asshole had flirted with me previously
3) The woman using the word “Skank” was aware the asshole had flirted with me
@Imadethisupwithnoforethought If you asked it exactly like that, or put that sentence in the “expansion/clarification” portion of the question it would’ve been far clearer.
Still, my original point stands as there are people our age (40-ish) that are more “with it” than some fuddy-duddy 20-somethings that are trying to preserve the “respectful” attitudes that their great-grandparents had back in the 1940s, while there are 70-somethings who have moved with the times.
In these times, while the use of certain words, may shock your sensibilities, that doesn’t make them unacceptable by society at large.
@Seaofclouds I call one of my co-workers a slut all the time. We’re both guys. And it’s that sort of thing that takes the sting out of a word.
Ummm, was she somehow using the term inappropriately? Perhaps the subject of her conversation was indeed a skank?
@syz Not a bum, or an asshole, but a skank?
I don’t particularly see anything wrong with that given the further information. I don’t put a lot of weight into the word skank either though, so that could be why. In that situation, I wouldn’t have said anything to the person that used the word skank. Does she know more about the other person than you do? Perhaps she has more history with her that has given her this perception?
@syz “Perhaps the subject of her conversation was indeed a skank?”
Please define skank.
@Seaofclouds why do you not say that person is an ass or a jerk? Why use skank?
Well, since you mentioned the history of flirting, it takes it to a different level. Sure, the woman may have been being an asshole, but to me, adding the flirting stuff to it adds more to the situation. I also rarely use asshole or jerk to describe another woman. Those are words I would use for a man instead. Did you flirt back with her or did you just ignore it? That may have a part in it too, especially in regards to the woman that actually used the word skank. Could she have been jealous?
I also wonder if you are married (you don’t have to answer). I have a low opinion of women that will knowingly flirt with a married man, so that would have a huge impact on which word I would use.
I’d call a guy skank scum. How’s that? lol
@Seaofclouds I am not married. Please, help me understand when and how you apply negative adjectives to a woman? The amount of flirtation she does with men enters into it somehow?
I am not picking on you, you seem to be the only person answering honestly so I am looking to you.
@Imadethisupwithnoforethought It really depends on the situation and it is hard to explain, but if a friend of mine had been flirted with by a female and then she started treating him badly because he didn’t return the feelings, I’d probably call her a bitch just because of her behavior toward my friend. I don’t actually use skank very often (can’t even remember the last time I directed it toward someone in a negative way). I could see others using skank or slut though since the flirting (which one could take as sexual interest though I don’t) was involved.
Flirtation doesn’t really enter into it as a soley negative issue because there are a lot of reasons people flirt. I just think it may have added more to your particular situation, especially if it was possible the woman using the word skank could have been jealous.
When it comes to flirting, I think there are different levels of flirting, so it has to be looked at for what it is. I know people that flirt just for fun and have no intention of pursuing anything further and then others that only flirt when they want more. I have nothing against people that flirt with others when it’s being received well. I feel badly for people when someone when the flirter doesn’t get the hint that it’s not wanted or being returned. I don’t like it when people knowingly flirt (with intention of more)/go after married/committed relationship people (be in man or woman) because it feels disrespectful to their relationship to me.
For me, overall negative adjectives for women would be something like this:
General bitchiness/assholeness: bitch
Cheating on significant other: bitch and possibly slut depending on the situation
I rarely use the other negative adjectives for women and couldn’t even begin to try to say when I would use them. I’m sure some of it would purely be driven by the level of emotional involvement I had in the situation.
I don’t use the word skank, but to me it is someone strung out, they might be sleeping around also to get their next fix. They are dirty and bone skinny with straggly hair in my mind.
If you don’t like the word, just tell your daughter you don’t like it and prefer she not use derogatory slang words. I don’t think you can tell someone older it is out of favor. Skank is not like calling someone Hispanic a wetback, or an Italian a WOP or some other similar example. I din’t think skank falls under being PC in the same way. It is more about what language we choose even when society at large is not very critical of the choices.
As far as young lady that is for females aged 12–18 in my opinion. If a 75 year old man calls me one it would be fine as long as he wasn’t creepy, I am 45, but anyone close to my age better just not. It would be very odd.
I don’t use asshole or jerk usually to describe women. But, I guess you can. Someone who will get together with married men I would say are destructive and lack respect for themselves and others. I use words like she is horrible. Flirting with a man would not necessarily make me think they are planning to do anything further though. It would depend on the situation.
@gailcalled
“Alex Trebek uses it often on Jeopardy! and I want to reach into the screen and whomp him upside the head.”
Please feel free to give him a proxy whomp from me too, for the times that he’s annoyed millions of us by indulging in his inane attempts at wit, instead of reading the next clue.
Clue Trebek > we’re trying to watch the game, not you.
I wasn’t aware we could ever call a woman a “skank” in polite conversation.
Nevertheless, a skank is a skank no matter which century you live in. Polite or not, sometimes it needs to be said.
This question is as pathetic as it is amusing, some self appointed “Prince Charming” takes it upon himself to consistently offer bullshit theories relating to female etiquette.
Trying way too hard to be the unwanted dashing saviour of women’s virtues when in reality women are just bored to death of such obvious crap.
@ucme Not in my reality, they’re not.
@glacial I refer you back to your earlier post on the “young lady” comment which clearly suggests otherwise.
That example was what I was more or less getting at.
@ucme And I was referring to your second comment. I think it’s great that @Imadethisupwithnoforethought wants a better world for his daughter, and is willing to risk social discomfort to explain to people how their words can (quite unintentionally) be hurtful to her and her peers.
I have to constantly explain to my 50 year old step mother that it is not polite to call every skinny person a “bony anorexic”, but I do not believe it is just because she is older. I think people of all age do this.
Every father worthy of the title wants a better world for his children, I rate myself right up there & more importantly so do my kids.
Children can’t be wrapped up in cotton wool, forever screened from nasty language, that’s totally unreasonable & quite pointless. At some point they’re going to hear rough words & wonder what they mean. Simply explain that these words are bad & shouldn’t be used, they’re smart enough to work it out for themselves beyond that simple advice.
Their vocabulary we can control, that can’t be said of society in general, so don’t go there.
@ucme “Their vocabulary we can control, that can’t be said of society in general, so don’t go there.”
That is demonstrably false. The “N word” no longer has the place it once had in daily vocabulary, and with some effort, we will soon see words like “homo”, and “slut” likewise diminished. It just takes mindfulness, and I don’t think it is unreasonable to expect that of people. Or at least, I am not nearly as pessimistic as you appear to be on this subject.
I’m the most optimistic person I know, i’d replace pessimistic with realistic in the context it was meant.
No right minded person likes to hear words like that along with general swearing/cursing, but to pretend it’s not out there does nobody any favours.
My daughter hears swearing & slurs like “slut” “puff” & “scruff” on a scale of alarming frequency, mostly from the more unpleasant element at school.
She’s never once repeated any of it & even asks if it’s okay to say tame words like “bloody”
@ucme Perhaps I am just misunderstanding your posts. It sounds like you are arguing with me, but I have no idea why we would not be on the same side of this issue. Or are you perhaps interpreting all of this as an attempt to stop people from “swearing/cursing”? That is not what this is about.
The point is not to stop using words like “slut” because it they are just “bad words”, it’s because of what they say about women and their sexuality.
@glacial You actually took the words out of my mouth, you came across as combative when we share broad agreement, so I guess we both misunderstood.
Over here both sexes are tagged with slurs such as “slut” “bitch” & ironically enough “skank” so you see, the individuals who use such words are equal opportunity insult makers.
About the only exclusively female insult would be “cow” which is so pathetic it doesn’t warrant the time or energy spent discussing it.
@ucme “we share broad agreement, so I guess we both misunderstood”
Cool, I suspected we might have more common ground here than both our previous comments have indicated.
Personally, I steer away from all one-word epithets. “Skank,” “slut,” “bitch,” “cow,” “jerk,” and “asshole” are so overused as to be essentially vague and pejorative name-calling (unless in jest and with a friend).
If I were dealing with my daughter, i would discuss just that. “Asshole” in particular no longer has any meaning, as far as I am concerned. You can and should certainly speak to the issues of name-calling, labeling, shifting acceptance and abhorance of certain nouns (not adjectives, by the way).
I cannot remember the last time anyone projected to me how much s/he respected my authority.
I am a huge fan of mild flirtation, between and among all ages and genders
Now I am off to whomp Alec Trebec, who is a pompous twit (or do I mean berk)?
@ucme I am sorry I asked a pathetic question. Thank you for showing me how to mentally justify not trying to make the world better, and how to rationalize it to myself. You are truly a hero to those who would do nothing. HUZZAH!!!
Dude, we’ve moved on, quit banging your weak little drum, you sound like a stuck record now.
@ucme I just responded to you. I am sorry you had a conversation with me in your head I was not privy to.
@Imadethisupwithnoforethought You made that up all by yourself did you? Very good, i’m pleased for you I really am, when essentially you sound like a spoilt kid who didn’t get his way.
Keep on trying to be the saviour of the masses whilst patronising older women with the truly laughable “young lady” tag.
I shall look forward to seeing you on TV receiving your nobel prize for services to mankind, will your wife get an invite, oh you’re not married…explains a lot.
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