Social Question

AshlynM's avatar

What do you call the evening meal?

Asked by AshlynM (10684points) November 15th, 2013

I usually call it supper.

Observing members: 0 Composing members: 0

171 Answers

Adirondackwannabe's avatar

Slop, swill, or gruel. I can’t cook for crap.

picante's avatar

I grew up calling it “supper,” and we called the midday meal “dinner.” Moving to more cosmopolitan digs, that shifted to “lunch” for the midday and “dinner” for the evening meal.

JLeslie's avatar

Dinner. But, if you call it supper I’ll still gladly come hungry.

Supper I associate with the farm, but I know not only farners use it. I always thought dinner is technically the biggest meal of the day. That’s the way I learned it anyway. Now, I think it is just a regional thing which one you use.

zants's avatar

Typically “supper,” but if we’re eating really early (e.g. 6pm) we may instead use “dinner.”

ucme's avatar

Super supper.

syz's avatar

Dinner. (Although my Grandmother used supper/dinner for lunch/evening meal, and I was always getting confused.)

OpryLeigh's avatar

Tea or dinner and I use lunch for the afternoon meal (some people use dinner for the lunchtime meal). I have never used supper but the people I do know who use it refer it to a light meal they have a couple of hours after their main evening meal. A friend of mine always used to have a bowl of cereal before going to bed and she called this her supper! I don’t tend to eat a light meal after my main meal and if I do I just pretend it’s desert!!

Seek's avatar

I spent half my childhood in the Northeast and the other half in Florida living with people from Kentucky.

Lunch is the noontime meal, and dinner and supper are evening meal and interchangeable, and I am never EVER having this argument again. I do not care, suck it.

ucme's avatar

Up here in the north east of englandtown we have our tea as an early evening meal.

OpryLeigh's avatar

@ucme Same here in South West Englandtown!!!

WillWorkForChocolate's avatar

I call it dinner or supper, depending on what comes out of my mouth first. The midday meal is lunch, always lunch, no matter if it’s the biggest day of the meal or not. Breakfast, lunch, and dinner/supper. :D My kids usually refer to it as dinner.

ucme's avatar

@Leanne1986 Aye, just noticed your post bonny lass.
I don’t think i’ve had supper since I was a kid, unless a pizza & a bottle of Bud count.

Smitha's avatar

We too call it dinner or supper.

As per Wikipedia: Supper is a name for the evening meal in some dialects of English. While often used interchangeably with “dinner” today, supper was traditionally a separate meal.

Dinner usually refers to the most significant meal of the day, which can be the noon or the evening meal. However, the term “dinner” can have many different meanings depending on the culture; it may mean a meal of any size eaten at any time of day. Historically, it referred to the first meal of the day, eaten around noon, and is still occasionally used for a noontime meal if it is a large or main meal. However, the meaning as the evening meal, generally the largest of the day, is becoming standard in the English-speaking world.

flip86's avatar

Dinner or supper. Depends on what pops into my head first.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Dinner. Although, oddly enough, I just realized that if I’m asking about it I will ask, “What’s for supper?”

KNOWITALL's avatar

Breakfast, lunch and dinner. Although I want to use High Tea sometime with someone who’d know what I mean.

Dutchess_III's avatar

That’s still illegal @KNOWITALL!

Pachy's avatar

My family called it dinner rather than supper, which is what most of my friends called it.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@Dutchess_III LMAO!!
Maybe I’ll get ucme to tell me what all is included, I think it’s cookies, small cakes, finger sandwiches (Not real fingers, just finger-sized), and teas.

Kardamom's avatar

Dinner, but I love the idea of having tea as an afternoon meal. It’s so civilized.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Not real fingers! LOLL!! Now you really be trippin’ @KNOWITALL!

longgone's avatar

Abendbrot.

janbb's avatar

In parts of England, as @ucme says, “tea” is just the word for the evening meal. “Supper” is a light meal sometimes served before bedtime. My MIL used to serve a supper of turkey sandwiches when we were home for the holidays. The holiday or Sunday dinner was served at mid-day.

What we think of as afternoon tea, is pretty much an outdated meal now and only served in posh houses, tea rooms or at hotels. “High tea” is generally a term used in Scotland for an evening meal that is more substantial than an afternoon tea would be and usually includes more savouries.

At least, that is my experience. YMMV.

(“Downton Abbey” has a lot to answer for.)

dougiedawg's avatar

Served at home, it’s supper. Served at a restaurant, it’s dinner. Go figure;)

Unbroken's avatar

Dinner most of the time. But I recognize supper as equally valid and on occasion use it. Otherwise supper wouldn’t exist and I like the idea of supping it seems more intimate then dining.

OneBadApple's avatar

‘Dinner’ these days, but growing up in New York, it was always…...“suppah”

downtide's avatar

Growing up in rural England it was always “tea”. But now I’m a cosmopolitan city boy it’s “dinner”.

Kardamom's avatar

^^ Now I’m craving watercress sandwiches!

Dutchess_III's avatar

What is a water cress sandwich? I always envision some sort of nuts between a couple slices of bread… :( )

ucme's avatar

I think a few of you are confused as to what tea means in terms of an early evening meal.
It’s not fucking cucumber sandwiches with the queen, nor is it some fancy cakes washed down with a cup of tea held with your little pinky in the air.
It’s a hot meal similar in content to lunch, this is real life not a period costume drama.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Calm down. We’re just having a friendly discussion @ucme.

Thank you for clarifying that for us. I have never had “tea” in my life. Of course the only thing that came to mind was what I saw in the movies.

Now, why would anyone have lunch twice though?

ucme's avatar

I’m as calm as a fucking duck pond dear, you must have read that wrong. Either that or you’re a sandwich short of a picnic…maybe.

Dutchess_III's avatar

So what was / is the purpose of “tea”?

ucme's avatar

I don’t think there is a purpose, it’s just dinner by another name.

Seek's avatar

@ucme If I understand correctly, though, there’s as much argument in the UK about dinner/tea as there is supper/dinner here in the US, no?

The posh types sneering at anyone who says “tea”, and all.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Ok, so they have breakfast, lunch, tea and dinner? Traditionally breakfast is in the morning, lunch is around noon, tea in mid afternoon, and dinner in late afternoon?

ucme's avatar

@Seek_Kolinahr Well yeah, posh fuckers were born with a silver spoon in their mouths so they’re bound to sneer at such minor things.
@Dutchess_III It’s tea or dinner, not both, those of us who know it as tea, have it in the early evening. Nowt is eaten mid afternoon, save for snacks & such like.

Dutchess_III's avatar

OK. I got it. That actually falls in line more with the way I eat. I eat breakfast, then I don’t eat again until about 3:00, and those are usually my meals for the day.

ucme's avatar

I believe we’re all supposed to eat 3 square meals a day, but I like pizza & pancakes & pie and they’re all round…not fair :(

Dutchess_III's avatar

I think the 3 meals a day is a “tradition” that came down to us from our farming forefathers. Big breakfast early in the morning (like 5 or 6,) go work your ass off, by noon you’re starving again, so come in and eat a big lunch, go work your ass off, then knock off for the day, finally, in the evening, when you’re hungry again because you’ve been working your ass off all day.

I believe most of us could easily get by on just 2 meals a day because most of us aren’t working our asses off day in and day out.

Valerie111's avatar

I call it dinner.

Kardamom's avatar

@Dutchess_III I had watercress sandwiches in England at an afternoon tea (the type @UCME says doesn’t exist) in the city of Bath. Watercress is one of the greens, it’s much more delicate than say lettuce and it has a bit of a peppery bite. They spread butter on white bread and add some watercress and that’s it. It’s very delicious.

There are actually 2 kinds of tea (as was explained to me when I visited England) They are High Tea and Low Tea which are served at different times of the day and include different types of food.

Here is a collection of English Tea Sandwiches

This is Watercress

In the U.S. watercress is more likely to be used in Soup

Dutchess_III's avatar

I like tomato sandwiches. I wonder if they would qualify for a tea sandwich. Tomatoe and Swiss cheese. Yum.

Kardamom's avatar

@Dutchess_III Yes, they would.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Join me for tea this aftanoon?

ucme's avatar

Nowhere did I say “tea & scones” doesn’t exist, I defined tea, for the umpteenth time, as what we class as our evening meal. So I guess @kardamom misunderstood.

ibstubro's avatar

Dinner

and tomato sandwiches are all that and a schmear of Miracle Whip!

JLeslie's avatar

Does the word schmear and miracle whip even go together?

ibstubro's avatar

well, you technically have to schmear both pieces of bread to have enough Miracle Whip

Dutchess_III's avatar

@ibstubro Oh, you got it! Miracle Whip mixed with a little lemon juice!

JLeslie's avatar

What Jew eats Miracle Whip? Or, admits to it anyway? Unless you are just using the word schmear and aren’t Jewish. I guess Yiddish is being used by so many people now you never know.

ibstubro's avatar

@Dutchess_III Have you tried the generic brand from Aldi’s? YUM. Even tangier and zippier!

Dutchess_III's avatar

Will do! But, in the meantime, u r busted by @JLeslie!

ibstubro's avatar

@JLeslie You sound like you’re getting—perklepsed- verklempt!

JLeslie's avatar

@ibstubro Do you mean verklempt? Next you’ll tell me you drink milk with dinner.

ibstubro's avatar

What a klutz i was!

ibstubro's avatar

What, because they’re Jewish, they can’t have good taste? Oy.

Dutchess_III's avatar

If they are Jewish they can not eat McRibs. Even if they aren’t Jewish they shouldn’t eat McRibs. They’re just gross!

Seek's avatar

Schmear goes on bagels.

Period.

And McRib is disgusting.

ibstubro's avatar

Schmear

Why, @Dutchess_III? O thought it was pork they were supposed to avoid!
>:-)

I loved McRibs when they came out and I still ate meat! lol

Seek's avatar

Pork, shellfish, and any combination of milk and meat.

There are other things, too, but those are the biggies.

ibstubro's avatar

Ah, so I can drink milk with dinner, as I eat no meat. Then again, I might be safe with a McRib.

JLeslie's avatar

You can schmear anything, but if you say schmear in a bagel place they know you mean cream cheese.

@ibstubro Good taste? LOL. It’s just funny because that mid America (I don’t tknow where you live) white bread and mayo with a glass of milk is seen as such a bland unsophisticated palate. Don’t get me wrong, I have Wonderbread in my house now and then, although I never schmear anything but mustard on it if I make a sandwich, so I am not completely kicked out of the club.

Edit: An exception is my tuna salad is made with mayo, but still none schmeared on the bread. I sometimes use white toast for the sandwich though.

My ex used to order pastrami on white with mayo at Carnegie deli and they used to give him a hard time every time. He’d have to repeat it sometimes. LOL. It just isn’t done. He wasn’t Jewish. Obviously.

Dutchess_III's avatar

What was the question?

JLeslie's avatar

@Dutchess_III What do you call the evening meal?

ibstubro's avatar

@JLeslie I know what you mean! MAYO! BLEH, SPIT. @Dutchess_III and I prefer the much more sophisticated taste of Miracle Whip!

Seek's avatar

Mayo is disgusting.

ibstubro's avatar

I used to call the evening meal Bessie. Occasionally Arnold. Myrtle on Sundays, pan fried, extra crispy.

Then I gave up meat.

Seek's avatar

My uncle raised cows sometimes.

The last pair were named “Sirloin” and “Cheeseburger”, so we wouldn’t get too attached and forget what they were there for.

OneBadApple's avatar

“Uncle” meat will keep you alive if you’ve crashed in the Andes….or so I’m told….

ibstubro's avatar

That’s great, @Seek_Kolinahr. There are too few Americans that actually associate meat with animals. I can’t tell you the number of people I have know that were completely repulsed by bones in chicken.

I believe we are WAY too far divorced from our food supplies.

ibstubro's avatar

@OneBadApple Kuryakin or Solo?

ibstubro's avatar

Well, crap. If you had candy why are we eating uncle?

Seek's avatar

Ha. My son still doesn’t believe me when I tell him that chicken comes from chickens.

He does believe we actually eat fish, though, since he saw me fillet a grouper after a fishing trip.

OneBadApple's avatar

Chicken comes from…...chickens ??!!??

ibstubro's avatar

YUP! @OneBadApple and Sandy Claws is a beach bum, 363 days of the year.

OneBadApple's avatar

I STILL leave that sonofabitch cookies…..

ibstubro's avatar

How can one eat a “chicken leg” and not realize it’s not “Chicken on a Stick”??

OneBadApple's avatar

Well…......I always thought that some guy in Arkansas just….you know….fabricated the thing out of this and that…

ibstubro's avatar

No, no, no. You’re thinking vegetarian food. Chickn patties. Whings. Buffalo nuggerts. Chix patties. If you call it “chicken” it has to contain, like, .01% REAL MEAT.

OneBadApple's avatar

Well I’ll be buck-buck-bucked…..

ibstubro's avatar

Uncle Buck?

He was a meal and ½. Probably 3. May I ask how many are dining?

OneBadApple's avatar

Seven, please.

Me, my wife….and Mr. Candy, here….

ibstubro's avatar

Crap. I forgot.

What was the original question?

OpryLeigh's avatar

@ucme The rich and the not so rich use “tea” in different ways don’t they. Like you, I use tea to mean my evening hot meal. I have never once taken afternoon tea (unless a digestive biscuit on the run counts) but I know some kids that go to private school (not far from Bath @Kardamom) and I was surprised to learn that this was a normal part of their school day. It strikes me as a little outdated and a bit pretentious, how many of us have time in our day jobs to take afternoon tea?! I usually have two meals a day and then if I am hungry in between a snack to fill the gap but I don’t down tools in between the two.

ucme's avatar

@Leanne1986 That’s what I mean, to actually designate time to a pathetic little snack, is as pointless as it is wasteful.

Dutchess_III's avatar

@ibstubro The original question was “What do you call food?” I think…..I don’t really remember.

ibstubro's avatar

@Dutchess_III Thanks! That’s right, someone wanting the number for take-out.

Dutchess_III's avatar

U, I give you an 8.

dougiedawg's avatar

As a son of the South, I must take exception to attacks upon mayonnaise! Miracle Whip is a poor substitute for Duke’s or Hellmann’s which are basically comprised of vinegar, egg whites, and a small amount of sugar and when properly smeared on bread make peanut butter and banana sandwiches delectable fare.
Sliced tomato sandwiches (homegrown) with mayo, salt, and pepper are a staple of Southern cuisine during the hot, humid months of July and August and no self respecting Southern table would omit them from the lunch or supper menu;)

ibstubro's avatar

@dougiedawg I am a son of the northernmost Southern state, Missouri, and marvelous Miracle Whip beats the socks off miserable mayonnaise.

Sorry.

>:-)

dougiedawg's avatar

Each to his own. No accounting for tastes obviously. My gf prefers mw over mayo but is otherwise okay;)

ibstubro's avatar

I still remember my complete shock and utter disgust when I put mayonnaise on something and it turned out to be…MAYONNAISE! We called the white stuff in a jar mayo, when it was, in fact, M Whip. lol

I have a friend that strips fried chicken off the bone and drags the meat through mayo as he eats. Makes my stomach churn.

Dutchess_III's avatar

We got some powdered dip once. The instructions were to use Hellmans mayo. Well, we were out of “mayonnaise,” so my husband picked some up. He got Miracle Whip. I had a feeling it wasn’t going to work!
So next time around he got Hellmans. We used it for the dip, and it is still sitting in the fridge because we haven’t used it for anything else.

ibstubro's avatar

Yes, @Dutchess_III, I agree. The miracle only whips certain things. If you’re trying to add flavor, Whip it (Whip it good!) If you’re looking for something to flavor, mayo or sour cream.

JLeslie's avatar

@ibstubro I hate to break it to you, as much as very southern MO has some southernish parts, MO is the midwest not the south. Most of that state feels and looks like the midwest. All of sudden stores and restaurants have German names, more red heads are around, if you go up into St. Louis there is even an Italian section. Maybe you are close to the southern border though.

ibstubro's avatar

No, @JLeslie I lived in Missouri most of my life, north of St. Louis. Southern products are stocked on store shelves. Cross the border into Illinois, and those products are replaced by northern fare. Two Walmarts, 30 miles apart, separated by the Mississippi river: in Missouri you can buy boiled peanuts in a can. Not in Illinois.

The Missouri Compromise

KNOWITALL's avatar

@ibstubro Nice, another Mo buddy!

@ucme All my books about England show tea as NOT being a full meal, that’s where the misinformation came from on my end.

I LOVE mayo and MW, and @Dutchess_III watercress grows wild in our streams and rivers here in Missouri! It’s delicious and free!

JLeslie's avatar

@ibstubro I love that I open that link and your claim to fame is having been a slave state. I half jokingly told people in TN and NC when I lived there that I grew up in MD so I am southern, and they look at me like I have six heads. The fact is southern MD is the south still. To me MO is similar to MD at this point and add in FL also. There is south and deep south, and for me MO is a midwestern state with the southern border being part of AR, just like northern FL is part of GA.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@JLeslie It’s still a very divisive issue and we have a ton of racists, as I’ve mentioned to you guys before.

I’m currently reading Up From Slavery by Booker T. Washington again now, it’s very interesting the interpersonal relationships.

JLeslie's avatar

@KNOWITALL All I meant was that of all the links to argue MO is a southern state on a mayo thread he picked the one that has a big ol’ map about slavery right there at the top, rather than a map or paragraph just naming the southern states and how there are a few interpretations currently. I laughed out loud. Most southerners don’t like to reference the slave days. When I “argue” about MD I just point out it is south of the Mason Dixon Line (which often people tell me it isn’t. I drop it when they say that and tell them maybe I am wrong and maybe we should look it up.) I don’t really argue about MD, but when I moved there from NY and some people said y’all and there were more blonds around, it felt like we were in a different place. Now the suburbs of DC don’t resemble the south at all.

When you say devisive, do you mean whether or not MO is a southern state or not? Or, racism, or slavery? I just want to make sure I don’t misunderstand what you were referring to.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@JLeslie I meant the equality of black people is still very divisive here. There are some families who would disown a child that wanted to marry a black person, remember that hereditary hate we were discussing? There was a KKK branch wanting to adopt a highway here and that was incendiary, and recently I posted a link to a story about KKK pamphlets being passed around. It’s sad but a lot of people are stuck in the old ways.

Although there are some people who don’t recognize Missouri as a true southern state either, but a lot of us do on a personal level. With my family’s Deep South roots, it’s inherently my family’s history on several sides of the fam tree.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Oh, wow…...

JLeslie's avatar

@KNOWITALL If you feel strongly about your southern roots and identify with MO being a southern state, which I accept as how you identify, and I don’t argue parts of MO are southern, would you talk about the slavery? I feel like proud southerners are proud of their politeness, hospitality, charity, even baked goods, but most people don’t drag out, “we were a slave state” I don’t think. Although, they might say their family fought for the confederacy as proof of southerness.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Having been a slave state is pretty much the definition of “The South,” though.

JLeslie's avatar

@Dutchess_III Most southerners I know don’t want to be reminded. They hate being stereotyped as racist. They get quite defensive about it. They will wave a confederate fag and be vehement that they are not racist.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@JLeslie There are many subtleties that a lot of people don’t get and it’s easier not to fight about something Yanks or others don’t understand. Like the Confederate flag.

Some black servants and white massa’s stayed together even after emanicpation because there were real relationships, and even Booker T says that blacks are better off from having slavery existed than if it hadn’t. If you haven’t read Up From Slavery you should.

Anything looked at in black and white with no grey is really not a true picture of reality.

JLeslie's avatar

@KNOWITALL Yeah, I understand why people are proud of their confederate roots and see the flag a southern symbol, and that since they are proud southerners the flag is not a racist symbol to them. That was sort of my point, that they wave the flag and are not racist. They seem to want the association of southern and racism to die. Then there are the racist southerners who you mentioned earlier, but I don’t count them.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@JLeslie I hate assumptions, as you know, because they’re just misleading. Whether it’s racists, bible thumpers, gay bashers, Obama worshippers and haters, just lumping people in a box and disliking them or ridiculing them is just so ignorant I can’t stand it.

I’m glad you get it sista, that’s why I can talk to you about a lot of sensitive things, because you’re smart and you ask the right questions. Thanks doll!

Dutchess_III's avatar

Um….what is a confederate fag, @JLeslie? And how does one go about waving it? Funniest typo I’ve seen in a long time!! Damn it! You fixed it!

JLeslie's avatar

Oh. Hahahaha. A cigarette??

Cool. :). But, just so you are not surprised on other Q’s, I think people should put their confederate flags away.

ibstubro's avatar

How long did you live in Missouri, @JLeslie?

JLeslie's avatar

@ibstubro I never did. Did I mistakenly write that? I’ve been making a lot of typos. Doing to many things at once.

ibstubro's avatar

Oh, @JLeslie, I just found it odd that you would correct the 50–80 years collective life experience of @KNOWITALL and myself regarding a state that you’ve never lived in.

Odd, as well, that Missouri can’t have a Southern state mentality because it’s in the Midwest, yet Florida is not eligible for your list of Southern states because of their mentality.

OneBadApple's avatar

I’ve changed planes in St. Louis twice.

( What do I win…?? )

ibstubro's avatar

A complimentary spirit.

I think St. Louis is still ranked #1 US city on STD’s per capita.

They have to work really had to maintain the ranking of most violent in the US. There are so many others that covet the title.

OneBadApple's avatar

Yeah, that’s pretty much why I kept my tourist dollars limited to the airport bar and the magazine store.

I thought that maybe Camden, NJ had East St Louis beat…..but what the hell do I know….?

ibstubro's avatar

For STD or violence, @OneBadApple? And I’m talking about St. Louis proper, in Missouri. Not East St. Louis in Illinois.

I know the STD thing was a long standing title from reading it in the St. Louis Post Dispatch. Violence is more subjective. Seems like Detroit mighta been a contenda. Probably like anything else…there are 2 million places our there crunching the numbers, and the worst make headlines around here.

OneBadApple's avatar

After a while, my friend, they all blend together and become essentially the same place to me….unfortunately….

WillWorkForChocolate's avatar

How did this go from what to call the evening meal, to STDs?

ibstubro's avatar

Well, we can’t all work for chocolate. Plus, the scenery’s been great.

JLeslie's avatar

@ibstubro I said I think of MO as a midwestern state, but some parts are southern, just like FL and MD. What’s wrong with that? If you want to call it a southern state go ahead, but most of America isn’t thinking MO when they think south, nor various maps on wikipedia and other places. I don’t consider FL the south and it is pretty south. But, it obviously depends whether we are talking present day or historically and by whose definition of the south. Do consider MD to be the south? Very few people think of that state when talking about southern states.

ibstubro's avatar

@JLeslie You broke into a lighthearted discussion of mayo with:
”@ibstubro I hate to break it to you, as much as very southern MO has some southernish parts, MO is the midwest not the south. Most of that state feels and looks like the midwest. All of sudden stores and restaurants have German names, more red heads are around, if you go up into St. Louis there is even an Italian section.”

Odd that Missouri can’t have a Southern state mentality because it’s in the Midwest, yet Florida is not eligible for your list of Southern states because of their mentality.

Now California’s going to be pissed off that they can’t be a Western state because San Francisco has a thriving China Town.

Dutchess_III's avatar

I don’t think of Missouri as a “Southern” state. But it seems like the words we use to define our states doesn’t have a lot to do with geography. Kansas, for example, is considered “midwestern,” but it’s pretty much dead center in the middle of America. A little closer, actually, to the east coast than the west.
Missouri is even further east than Kansas and I kind thought that’s where the east/west dividing line was drawn…...
I heard someone say that Texas was in the South West….no it isn’t! It’s pretty much dead center in America, but way far south.

JLeslie's avatar

@ibstubro I never said MO can’t have a southern state mentality. Where are you getting that from? Y’all are in the bible belt that qualifies you right there. I said parts of the state are southern.

Here, this map and explanation might help. It explains what most of the country considers the midwest since you seem to be unaware of it. Maybe there are maps out there putting the state in the south, but I have never seen it.

I never call California a western state by the way. It is a west coast state. The west is all those mountain states before you get to the west coast. If you divide the country into just east and west California is west sure, but most people do more dividing than that. Although, I did find in the south they tended to think north, south, west, although I am not completely sure they call California western. I do know they call Michigan North, and sure it is north, but I never would say Michigan is a northern state, it is a midwestern state.

JLeslie's avatar

@ibstubro Also, I said MO, FL, and MD are similar not different. We aren’t communicating well.

You commented on the lighthearted discussion. The comment about MO not being southern was lighthearted in my mind, but obviously you take it very seriously. Sorry if somehow I offended you in some way. I am not sure why it is such a big deal, except that as I have said on other Q’s southerners seem to get more easily offended in my experience. I’m not sureif you are actually offended, I am not assuming anything, but you seem defensive. I appreciate the history lesson about MO, history is my worst subject, but it doesn’t change how the states are classified and referred to commonly present day.

ibstubro's avatar

I think it’s the being talked down to part that sort of offends me?

“Here, this map and explanation might help. It explains what most of the country considers the midwest since you seem to be unaware of it.

I’m just stupid that way.

JLeslie's avatar

@ibstubro That was not my intention, sorry if it came across that way. Were you aware? You didn’t say anything like, I know MO is usually considered a midwest state, but we have a lot of southerners and southern mentality here. You did point out the history regarding slavery and the war, which I appreciated, because I didn’t know the details of it. My experience in MO was that it is a border state and that it is a bible belt state, so there is definitely some southerness there. I think if you had acknowledged that MO is usually classified as a midwest state it would have shown me you knew, but you seem to not know that at all from what you had written so I gave you a link like you gave me a link.

Dutchess_III's avatar

I still say those geographic definitions don’t make much sense. They seem more emotional than geographical. I would have easily considered Oklahoma, even Texas as part of the mid west but your map didn’t indicate that @JLeslie.

JLeslie's avatar

@Dutchess_III The definitions are a little variable, although I personally would never consider Texas part of the midwest, but I also kind of consider Texas all it’s own. I don’t usually think of it grouped in with the south, but it also makes sense that it is. It has more to do with how our country was settled with other stuff thrown in. I read up a little more on MO and since it was with the south on slavery it was aligned with the south, but they didn’t choose to secede so it is different than the other souther states. Kentucky also, a border state, and resisted secession, although to me Kentucky is much more southern than Missouri in terms of when I visit how it feels to me.

Back to how the country was settled, there was the original 13 colonies and you can and divide that into north and south. Then there was the old northwest, states like Michigan, that are now considered Midwest. During the Louisana purchase that territory as it was settled was west, but as we continued to settle even more west the old northwest states were midwest and then our western states and finally getting to the Pacific we have our west coast states. Our country is so huge we divide up the regions I think partly as a shorthand.

I have seen maps that divide the south from a very broad definition and then narrower, whoch some maps call the deep south.

Add in we all move around now, it gets more confusing. When my friends moved to Sunrise, Florida years ago, west of Ft. Lauderdale, they were questioning their move when their children came home singing Jesus Loves Me from public school. The northeast Jewish invasion had not quite taken a real hold yet out there. LOL. Boca Raton Hotel was a southern getaway and someone told me the used to not allow Jews, which I don’t know if that is true, but probably the idea that they were not wanted is true, and now Boca Raton, FL is 25% Jewish and supposedly one in every three households there has a Jew in it. Those Jews are from the northeast for the most part and Boca Raton is nothing like a southern city. But, drive one county up, just north of Palm Beach in places like Tequesta, Florida and it is Evangelical land. Many of the people there and further north and central have had families in Florida for generations, they are the original Florida “crackers.” A state like Florida, it is hard to classify it at this point in my opinion. But, more and more all states are becoming a big mix, especially states that are georgraphically in the southern part of our country because with the advent of airconditioning, people have been migrating down for a few generations now.

I guess it depends how you define what makes something or someone southern. Then you have to decide is it location or the people that southern up a state? Then it deoends how much you want to divide up the regions. Some New Englanders don’t consider themselves northeasterners, they are New England, and states like NY are northeast. People in the south probably would never bother making the distinction, even they were very knowledgable about which states are New England states.

None of it really matters. When it comes to mayo habits the midwest and the south are very similar in my mind. I have to worry about them putting it on my sandwich automatically in both places. Both also do things like put ketchup on a hot dog. Not everyone I realize, I am just talking about stereotypes and generalizations. It has to do with who settled where and how long ago. It’s like one is really better than the other. My husband puts ketchup and mustard on a hot dog, but he’s Mexican so what does he know.

Dutchess_III's avatar

this is interesting. It’s an “official” guide and it puts Missouri in with us other mid-westerners.

I does get confusing and way more complicated than it needs to be. As I said, the various designations are based on things other than literal geographic locations, which makes them emotional designations.

Kinda crazy if you ask me!

Dutchess_III's avatar

Wait…I put catchup and mustard on my hot dogs! In fact, a hot dog is the ONLY food I put mustard on. Does that make me a Mexican?

janbb's avatar

@Dutchess_III No -an Indian!

Dutchess_III's avatar

Oh shit you did not just say that!!

ibstubro's avatar

Native American from the ‘New South’, perhaps?

Dutchess_III's avatar

You can’t call a Mexican an Indian. You can’t even call an Indian an Indian, not even if you’re an Indian, unless they’re from India. And Mexico has been in the south longer than any place else so to call it “New” is as offensive as bell balls. Just ask…someone….

KNOWITALL's avatar

@Dutchess_III & @janbb You sillies, that made me laugh out loud!!!

@ibstubro & @JLeslie I think some parts of Missouri consider themselves Southern based on family heritage, it’s maybe not official though. :) I’m in the Ozark Hills where the old ways are still a little more popular than the modern like St Louis. Our population of minorities is pretty low, blacks almost non-existant, too, although a lot of folks from KC and StL are moving down here for safer schools and the hometown feel.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Ozarks are beautiful.

We went to the Lake of the Ozarks once. My grandson was about 3. He called it “Lake of the Noah’s Ark.”

KNOWITALL's avatar

@Dutchess_III You have to see them in the fall when leaves are turning, it’s AMAZING! I wouldn’t give up the rivers, lakes, streams, hunting and scenery here for anything…well, maybe Flagstaff, AZ (moose crossings, so cool!) or the stark beauty of NM (gorgeous), or the coast of Mexico, but not TOO many…lol

We mushroom hunt in spring, get watercress in March or so from freshwater streams, hunt in spring, fall and winter, it’s just such a beautiful place to live and beautiful kind-hearted people for the most part.

Oh, and Brad Pitt’s from Springfield, pretty close.

ibstubro's avatar

@KNOWITALL I lived in Missouri for 40 years, and have now lived 5 miles away in Illinois for 10.

There is a marked southern influence in Missouri governance. The ”good ole boy” tradition of doing things. It permeates the state in the way that the laws were crafted and the Judicial system set up. Much more laid back.

There is a marked northern influence in Illinois governance. More “Tammany Hall”, money talks, the ’I’m too smart for my own good’ guys telling everyone else what the want and need. Much more frenetic.

Standing in Missouri for 40 years, I totally missed the influence. 10 years of total corruption in Illinois, and I get it.

ibstubro's avatar

Hawaii, @KNOWITALL, you forgot Hawaii. Otherwise you picked 2 of my top 5 places, ever.

A couple of years ago I roadtripped alone to the Ozarks. There is the ruins of a mansion that was amazing. Bright, emerald green river in the canyon below.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@ibstubro Haven’t been to Hawaii yet, but it seems like the kind of place I’d like, back to nature you know.

Well good ole boy, yeah, look at Billy Long- giddiup- lol

You comin’ back or staying up there ya dang Yank?! :)

ibstubro's avatar

@KNOWITALL Did you know that ½ of Hawaii is desert?

It’s amazing standing there in the sand next to a cactus, looking out at all that water. Every shade of blue in the world, laying there before you!

KNOWITALL's avatar

@ibstubro I did NOT, but that’s pretty cool, I imagine it more lush like New Zealand.

I only have seen parts on tv, you know Dog the Bounty Hunter hangs in some poor areas! (a little joke for ya)

ibstubro's avatar

The windward side is rainforest, leeward desert. Most people (at least now) live in the desert. It was funny, because when we got there, I was all, like, “Well, la-ti-dah! WE can have cacti gardens in paradise.

Idjot.

JLeslie's avatar

The Ozarks are beautiful! I can’t argue with that.

@Dutchess_III @janbb LMAO!!

@Dutchess_III Is it Heinz ketchup? As long as it’s Heinz you can still be my friend. Come to think of it, my husband learned to eat hot dogs in Texas, so that probably has something to do with it. When he came to the states to visit, and then eventually moved here he had one of those come to America pig out on all the fast food episodes. He had never seen or tasted so many things that are so bad for us. Corndogs, cheesecake, there is a whole list of foods he had never had before. If he had gone to NY instead of TX, probably some of the food experience would have been different. Don’t get me wrong, there is plenty of junk food in NY, I only mean different.

@ibstubro So corruption is the mark of a midwestern government? Then Memphis is the midwest. LOL. I find corruption in government so widespread and varied all across the nation. Some politicians truly seem to care and be honest, even if I disagree with them I can see their heart in it and them trying to resist the bullshit that is politics today. I see that in the north and the south. In fact I probably idealize the New England states and being more rational and honest in government if I have to pick one region, but there is mess there too. Maybe small town vs big city is really more ofnthe difference. I find that makes a bigger difference in general with how people live and interact, doesn’t matter north or south. Go to smaller towns in Wisconsin, it is more rural, wonderful people, love the land, a generousity towards others. That happens many places in our country thank goodness. I know what you mean about the government kind of reflecting the state though. In FL even though I had lived in a very liberal part of the state, we still always knew we were ruled by Tallahasee up in the northern part of the state, which is the “south.” Now FL more and more is a swing state and the population is very split and the representatives more and more are split. Oh, and all too often we have some corrupt ones also, just to circle back.

ibstubro's avatar

@JLeslie If your just going to make stuff up, what’s the point in participating.

I made a very clear and valid point based on my own personal observations.

I quit reading your post at the word I never mentioned, yet you seem obsessed with: midwestern (government? Then Memphis is the midwest. LOL. I find corruption in government so widespread and varied all across the nation. Some politicians truly seem to care and be honest, even if I disagree with them I can see their heart in it and them trying to resist the bullshit that is politics today. I see that in the north and the south. In fact I probably idealize the New England states and being more rational and honest in government if I have to pick one region, but there is mess there too. Maybe small town vs big city is really more ofnthe difference. I find that makes a bigger difference in general with how people live and interact, doesn’t matter north or south. Go to smaller towns in Wisconsin, it is more rural, wonderful people, love the land, a generousity towards others. That happens many places in our country thank goodness. I know what you mean about the government kind of reflecting the state though. In FL even though I had lived in a very liberal part of the state, we still always knew we were ruled by Tallahasee up in the northern part of the state, which is the “south.” Now FL more and more is a swing state and the population is very split and the representatives more and more are split. Oh, and all too often we have some corrupt ones also, just to circle back.) as it was not pertinent.

JLeslie's avatar

@ibstubro I am not questioning your observation. What did I make up? Talk about the pot calling the kettle black. I am fine with your observations, but you obviously aren’t fine with mine. We could have a fun conversation about the quirks of different places around the US, but I guess you can’t. Geesh, forget it. You don’t get it.

OneBadApple's avatar

Ah, public verbosity. Freedom of speech.

God bless America…..

Dutchess_III's avatar

I want to go back to the Lake of the Noah’s Ark…but I guess I shall go to the Doctor’s instead.

JLeslie's avatar

Oh right you said northern, doesn’t matter midwest or north, you are still idealizing the south, ok, so Memphis is northern now with all their corruption. There, is it a better answer now? I confused it in my head since you now currently live in a midwestern state. But, like most southerners you call it a northern state, which I mentioned above. I am not saying it is not also a northern state, I was just using the term I call it.

ibstubro's avatar

@JLeslie@ibstubro So corruption is the mark of a midwestern government?

Is decidedly not an observation. It’s an incorrect perversion of my personal observations
.
You apparently finally at least read my post, noting that I was talking about Northern, Southern mentality and never mentioned Midwestern as it was never part of my post.

ibstubro's avatar

Yes, @JLeslie. That’s a much better answer, because it states you opinion, “you are still idealizing the south”, which have absolutely NO problem with!

:-)

KNOWITALL's avatar

@JLeslie The good ole boy network is basically who you know as opposed to what you know. Oh, you know old Bubba, then we’ll take $5k off this new truck- that kind of thing, but it’s not really corruption as it’s not illegal. Usually. :)

JLeslie's avatar

@KNOWITALL I wasn’t commenting on the good ol’ boy, I was commenting on southern cities that are very corrupt.

Illinois is a midwestern state. It can also be called a northern state. I find it interesting that southerners still divide things up by the war. Let’s ask a Q about it.

JLeslie's avatar

Here it is,. Let’s see what answers we get so we can stop the derail here.

janbb's avatar

Gee – now what was the original question?

JLeslie's avatar

@janbb What do you call the evening meal?

janbb's avatar

I call it supper.

ucme's avatar

On Fridays I call it fish & chips, mostly.

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