Graduating from college: Now what?

Regarding question 2:

It’s an established no no to discuss salary during the first interview.

Take almost whatever comes your way.

It always seems easier to find a job while you already have one.

A good employer will respect it too.

@SecondHandStoke I’m well aware of that rule. Hence my question…

So you’re suggesting I take any shit job that comes my way because it’s “easier” to find a job while employed? And what about that does an employer respect?

Go talk to your professors and your college placement office if they have one. My first job was through one of the professors that worked with the business that hired me to arrange interviews, etc. I had the job all set before I graduated.

”but they all ask for 2–5 years of experience”
That is the usual wishful thinking on their part. Part of the impossibly perfect 18 year old, with a phd and 5 years of experience that they always want to have.
Ignore it, apply anyway and see how it goes.

@SecondHandStoke “It’s an established no no to discuss salary during the first interview.”

What?

Yeah, you need to bring that up (if you feel the interview is going well). You have certain expenses, like rent, electricity, water, heat, sanitary products, clothes, the lot. And you need to eat. Probably a car, and even if not, costs for public transportation. That all needs to be covered plus taxes, and the job HAS to pay enough to cover all of it, at the very least. If it does not, it makes no sense to continue to pursue it.

You have a really specific career targeted and for better or worse you’re competing with people with more experience. That doesn’t mean you can’t jump straight into it, but no one is required to give you a shot.

As with your other questions regarding job seeking, you need to look at it from the employers perspective and offer something to them that makes you stand out as someone that can help them. It’s not about whether or not you can do the job, or if you seem to have goals, it’s about them getting their job done and them achieving their goals. Hopefully the two align, but recognizing the difference is important.

Question 1: If they are comfortable hiring recent college grads, they understand that there is a process for graduation, you should be fine without a transcript.

Question 2: You can do research online to see what a company pays for a position. For the public positions it sounds like you’re going after, salary is public information and a range should be included in the job posting. For others that you can’t find anything on, there really isn’t a way to know until you get in and they’ll ask you what your salary expectations are. The advice given to me was to give a range with your (reasonable) bottom amount as the bottom of the range. Of course you’ll take more, and that establishes you’re flexible without you ending up with less than you need.

Question 3: Target 3–5 companies that you really want to work for and let them know you’re a recent graduate that likes what they do and wants to be a part of it. Figuring out how will be most effective to do that is part of it and needs to be tailored to the company.

Question 4: No one knows what they want to do with their entire life at graduation. People change careers all the time, employers are only worried about the job you can do with them, right then.

Good luck, I hope you find exactly what you’re looking for.

It is a no no to bring up salary first. First person to pick a number loses. And whatever number they say is not their max offer.

@ragingloli

Having the need for money does not distinguish any one applicant from the rest.

The purpose of interview #1 is to set yourself apart from the others by showing you possess the skills, education, any experience, professionalism, self motivation and @livelaughlove21, the attitude (one with a minimum sense of entitlement) more than all the others.

We nearly fall out of our chairs at the number of applicants that vivisect their chances by coming in with the “I went to school” and “how much” chips on their shoulders.

Negotiating salary happens later.

Why an applicant plays their compensation card immediately is beyond me.

@SecondHandStoke Asking how much does not demonstrate that an applicant has a chip on their shoulders… I would rather say that it demonstrates that they have a head on their shoulders. How is an applicant to weigh the relative merits of multiple offers without anyone talking about money?

^ You would not believe the number of applicants that come in clearly believing the job is theirs simply because they’ve attended college.

It’s written all over their faces. It colors every last aspect of their body language.

You aren’t owed a job. Ceasing to act like you are is a first great step toward getting one.

If you must act, act like you’re excited as hell to have found the very position in the very company you were always hoping for.

Lets review! Discussing the dosh comes friggin’ later.

These are the sort of crucial details that used to be mentioned to the future’s workforce while still in school.

While it has us scratching out heads it does make it easier to detect the Whoppers missing the malted milk inside.

Since many of the types of jobs you are considering can be found in government, you might consider applying through civil service. I got a job through civil service shortly after I left college. It was not the greatest job, but I learned how to program on the job, which provided the experience I needed for other jobs.

@SecondHandStoke Sounds to me like the applicant isn’t the one with the chip on his shoulder.

@LostInParadise

GA.

Government jobs take a long time to get. I don’t think government jobs care about your transcript as much as that you have a degree.
My sister just got a job as an investigator with adult protective services. She does welfare checks on seniors and investigates reports of abuse.
This was a late in life career change.
She knew she wanted to work for the government because this was a late in life career change and she’s 58. She wanted a job where she could get vested for retirement in 5 years.
She just checked out the city, county, state, and federal websites every week and applied for anything that remotely interested her. She turned down a few jobs but interviewing for them gave her great experience.
She loves her new job. She told me, “I got paid to sit in the mud with a homeless man and try to convince him to go to a shelter.”

^ “Government jobs talke a long time to get.

They also take a long time to get any service from.

See, whether you want to government field or private firm concentrate there properly. Make a plan about what do you want to do &, which is your preferences. I think you should have to go with your interest because that is the place where you gives your best ever.

@SecondHandStoke
Here is my perspective.
An applicant is not a beggar. At least in an ideal situation, s/he is a prospective contractor, an equal partner.
S/He is offering her/his service in exchange for payment. ”This is what I offer, and this is what I want in return.”
When I go to a plumber, I tell him what I want him to do, and he tells me, and I want to know, what he is going to charge me. I do not go to him with the mindset that he has to beg for the work and talk about for the money at a later date, because that would be arrogant of me, and insulting to him.
So if you as an employer have a problem with applicants asking for how much they would earn if they get hired, then the problem is your mindset of a slaver, not the applicant’s mindset that rejects being a slave.

@ragingloli

I am in agreement that some jobs follow the “private contractor” model.

I’ve spent years serving and tending bar in restaurants:

Techinically my professional relationship is between me and the patron, not me and the restaurant’s owner. The contract is obvious and requires no negotiation beforehand.

I’ll serve you but the quality and amount of attention from me will be based on your appreciation and your reputation.

In the case of bartending, there’s no harm at all in waving a five dollar note before I serve you in order to make it clear that you understand how this all works. Your drink is on it’s way.

Like any contractor I’m going to give greater attention to the patron that will likely pay the greater amount. I’m busy with those clients that have a reputation for paying up, I’ll get to you at some point.

Not getting the attention you believe you should? Have you come in here before and been a cheapskate to another of the house’s servers? Are you shouting into your cellphone for some reason other than to find how much longer the rest of your party is going to take to get there? The house is packed, we sat you at a table while others are patiently waiting to be seated. You aren’t the only individual on the planet remember?

Your plumber model applies, but not how you think: When waitservice and plumbing are compared I see the following scenario all to often:

The diner would be perfectly happy to pay for the plumbing job’s related materials but has no qualms insisting that he or she has no intention of paying for the service (installation) or grossly underpaying. (That food before you did NOT suddenly and miraculously appear).

If you cannot bring yourself to properly pay for the service then stay home and have a date with your microwave.

Regarding the entitled manner of applicants: If you barge into personnel (a time when you should be drawing upon your most professional behavior) and toss your ‘tude around what conclusion should I draw about your way with clients?

I’m not taking issue with the negotiation of compensation. Rather I’m speaking about the established appropriate time to do so. It’s in your best interest to bring the subject up once it’s clear that you are among the finalists. This puts you in a far better position to get a higher rate.

As a slaver I’d be providing certain benefits you don’t often see so much anymore: Housing and meals.

[mod says] Just a reminder that this is the General section. Please keep on-topic and civil.