What's the whole story with Trump banning green card holders?

What’s a green card? Is it like a Canadain sin social security insurance number?

^^It’s a permanent resident card/status. You have practically all the same rights as a citizen, but you have to renew your “green card” every ten years, and you can’t vote for president.

You can have a green card and not be living in the US. When you move outside of the country you have to come back every six months to maintain your status. There are some exceptions to the rule, like health issues you would be given an exception.

Take a deep breath @JLeslie The article is from CNN (First red flag) and they preface the entire article with the word “may” (Second red flag). Don’t take the bait.

^^I’m not. I’m the one questioning the whole thing.

I just was curious on the specifics. I don’t want Trump to ban refugees who have been approved already.

@JLeslie Questioning CNN anything is a colossal waste of time….have fun.

^^I think the story has some merit, in that Trump is making bigger and more sweeping changes right now than I am comfortable with. But, I don’t even know if what Trump has been signing off on has anything really to do with this particular case, and especially with the green card mention. People are too hysterical. Having a green card is very different than coming here as a refugee.

@JLeslie I am now confused by your question and subsequent comments. This man in the link you provided is expressing thanks for being in America despite the new regulations. CNN conveniently leaves out the fact that he was in transit at the time and at the exact moment the new regulations being implemented and he even went so far as to stress this little hiccup that caused him to be temporarily detained and he was more than OK with it as he understood the crazy coincidence of the moment. I am not surprised in the least that CNN spun it the way they did and do not hold it against you for being suckered into reacting to this bull shit.

We may not agree on much but IMO closer scrutiny of immigrants from countries that support and sponsor terrorists and who also hate our guts for the time being is not a bad thing.

The whole story there will be WALLS and restrictions from the Cheeto for the next four years.

Oh all walls will be paid for by the good people of the USA !

@Tropical_Willie “walls will be paid for by the good people of the USA !”
That is something we can agree on!

I think one huge part of the reason that people are “hysterical,” as you say, is because the POTUS came out on multiple occasions and accused major news sources of being fake. He has called into question the legitimacy of the mainstream media, the information that the majority of people trust and rely on (excluding those who prefer Fox), and threatened to take action against the free press. Asking for the “whole story” is a difficult thing to answer, because you’ll get different answers from difference sources. It’s up to us to decide which are most likely to be significantly biased, outright false, propaganda, and those which are most likely to be accurate. Which, I think is what @Cruiser is getting at, as CNN is one of the organizations that the president claimed to be “fake news.”

Where is the Mexico wall will be paid for by MEXICO ??

@Cruiser

I like Tequila and avocados but you must like Russian Caviar it is a GOP thing ! !

CNN’s reporting was accurate as you would expect and green card holders were being refused entry. I believe a judge has overruled Trump’s executive order so sanity is prevailing for now.

@Tropical_Willie I avoid alcohol like the plague but love my avocados with salt and fresh lime juice. Gentle reminder I am not and never will be a GOP Republikin. Yak at me with a disparaging tone all you want and won’t dent my fenders one bit as I am a Conservative Independent to the core.

Insanity will be the rule of Washington. ! !

I am too late to edit my previous reply, but I like AllSides to compare sources.

Cool link @ANef_is_Enuf Thanks for sharing. Bookmarked and will give it a try.

I forgot to mention my SIL was detained 20 years ago. Anyone who knows a lot of immigrants knows a lot of immigration stories.

The story is that Trump signed an executive order preventing travellers from certain countries from entering the United States, even if they already have permanent residence here, for a period of 90 days. The order also suspends the US Refugee Admissions Program for a period of 120 days. A federal judge has already place a stay on some provisions of the executive order, citing Constitutional concerns.

Trump’s executive order makes no difference to Islamic terrorists, they weren’t allowed in anyway. It is ordinary people who are being hit by this badly thought out measure such as this holidaymaker returning from Costa Rica. As she can no longer fly via the states she will have to pay an additional £2,600 to get back to her home city of Glasgow

This executive order isn’t a security measure. It is a knee-jerk populist wank job. The people who love the idea are racist and have no idea how national security threats are assessed.

The order took effect immediately and it swept hundreds of people who were already flying or on their way back to the US, LEGALLY. There are still many abroad, I’m sure, that are wondering how to get back to their jobs, families and life in the US. Thank goodness for the injunction, but it was a no-brainer. It highlights the incompetence of Trump as a Executive in Chief. He doesn’t know the law, and worse, he doesn’t even care about it. That whole oath to support and defend the Constitution?? Remember that? Yeah, he never had any intention of doing that.

Just in case the temporary hold is ignored
For green card holders (LPRs) and student visa holders denied entry at the border or airport, contact ADC (American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee) immediately at 202–244-2990, via email at legal@adc.org, via Twitter @adctweets
Please copy, paste and repost.

This is from a woman (a scientist), Nazanin Zinouri, from Iran that got taken off a plane in Dubai on his way back home to her dog and job in South Carolina, after she visited family in Iran.

I normally don’t write long posts or any kind of political or religious comments.
I apologize in advance and I don’t expect my friends to read this long long past!!
But today I just couldn’t hold it any longer. Friday ½0/17 started like any other normal day. I was excited about my trip to Tehran. After all I only get to visit them once a year. I was excited and anxious at the same time. I was worried about my little puppy but I couldn’t wait to see my mom…
It was an uneventful trip. I made him home on Monday ½2/17, after around 28 hours, exhausted but so so happy. We were all happy. I was going to eat lots of delicious Persian food and make tons of great memories and go back to my life in the US. But the happiness didn’t last that long. On Wednesday, we started hearing rumors about new executive orders that will change immigration rules for some countries including Iran. Soon we started reading drafts like everyone else. I might be banned from going back?!?! No that can’t be true. I’m not gonna let that ruin my trip. But then it got serious so fast. Before I knew it, it was actually happening. Even though I didn’t want to leave my family, I quickly booked a ticket to get on the next flight back. Only a few hours after the order was signed, I got to the airport, got on a plane and made it to Dubai. After waiting in the line to get my documents checked and after 40 minutes of questions and answers, I boarded the plane to Washington, only to have two TSA officers getting in and ask me to disembark the plane!!! Yes after almost 7 years of living the the United States, I got deported!!!
No one warned me when I was leaving, no one cared what will happen to my dog or my job or my life there. No one told me what I should do with my car that is still parked at the airport parking. Or what to do with my house and all my belongings.
They didn’t say it with words but with their actions, that my life doesn’t matter. Everything I worked for all these years doesn’t matter.
I just had to say it…

So, Trump supporters can deny all they like and try to discredit credible news sources. Just because you don’t like it, doesn’t mean it’s not true.

@cazzie Nobody that I am aware of ever said these peoples experiences never happened or are not true. They were simply caught in the middle or something that is anything but a knee jerk reaction. Enhanced border security has been in the works for years now and Trump when he took office implemented it. It would be foolish to think that people would not be caught by surprise and obviously many did. Change is necessary and not a moment to attempt to turn them or yourself into some kind of martyr over policy change. BTW the story you posted is (no surprise) not the whole story as this girl knew exactly what she was up against and chose to attempt to leave her country despite knowing better. In her own words…

”“On Wednesday, we started hearing rumors about new executive orders that will change immigration rules for some countries including Iran” she wrote in a Facebook post. “Before I knew it, it was actually happening. Even though I didn’t want to leave my family, I quickly booked a ticket to get on the next flight back.””

I wish it were different…but Iran is our enemy and our President has implemented a temporary ban on immigration from hostile countries. If you don’t like it move back to the US so your opinion on what our country does will actually matter.

The rest of the world’s opinion doesn’t matter? I think you’ll find that quite delusional. Calling entire countries your enemy based loosely on the number of Muslims, and not even applying that rule evenly, because of business interests in the countries you don’t want to ban, is NOT a basis for ‘border control’. It is displaying racism. The list of countries are not enemies of the US.

And you immediately dismissed this news from @JLeslie . So, saying that ‘nobody ever said these people’s experiences never happened’ yes, you did. It was you.

Let’s just point out that the nations that are not part of this Muslim ban are the only nations whose citizens have actually committed terrorist attacks on the US. They are also countries in which Trump does personal business.

@cazzie WOT? ”So, saying that ‘nobody ever said these people’s experiences never happened’ yes, you did. It was you”

I said… “Nobody that I am aware of ever said these peoples experiences never happened or are not true.”

Our President implemented a __’temporary’__ ban until our country can piece together a more robust vetting procedure of immigrants from hostile countries. Wave your hands and stomp your feet all you want over there….ain’t gonna change shit over here.

@Cruiser if the temporary ban had anything to do with stopping terrorists coming in to the US it would have included Saudi Arabia as that’s where most of the terrorists who’ve caused most of the damage to the US and its ideals came from. But you cant upset the Saudis cause then you wouldn’t have oil to put in your car etc.

Quite frankly right now the US is nothing more than a sad little bully that’s stomping its feet because its less and less relevant in the modern world.

There are Syrian refugees – families – who have spent 2 years in the most robust “vetting” procedure ever undertaken by any country, who have just been told it was all for naught and they’re not getting in anyway.

Fuck your self important America First facist bullshit.

It wasn’t just refugees on their way after filling out and qualifying, it was people with valid visas and green cards that had lived in the US for years.

And @Cruiser , your Cheeto-in.charge just had his ass handed to him by a federal judge, so yeah, stomping our feet does make a difference.

I just googled it and Federal judges are appointed by the President. In that case, if I were that judge, I’d be updating my resume.

@Cruiser

Many of these people, like the scientist mentioned, are already legal residents of the United States. In case you’re too smitten by your new orange idol to figure out what that means – it means they’ve already been fucking vetted.

@cazzie And our customs agents are giving the judge the middle finger and ignoring her petulant ruling and enforcing Trumps travel ban. Turn on your TV and you will see and hear the most ardent critics of this ban admit that we have a very weak immigration program and then will list all the things they think we need to improve like better tracking of the entry and exit of immigrants, better vetting of immigrants and all are using the woman who was involved in the San Bernardino shootings where again they all say had we had the system in place Trump is advocating she would have and should have been denied entry. Again move here so your low information opinions would possibly mean something.

@jca

The president can’t fire judges, much to Trump’s dismay I’m sure.

@Darth_Algar If they were legal US citizens they would not be caught in this net but the people who are being locked out are citizens of these select countries. There are legal residents who are involved but they are not legal citizens. Subtle but relevant difference.

Do you have a link to these legal citizens being locked out?

His? You mean her ruling. Read the actual facts and you would have known the judge was a woman. *shock horror. A woman!

I have been a legal citizen of just one country, but the legal resident in three. Denying me entry back into either my country of citizenship or my country of residency will be a denial of my constitutional rights. How is that not obvious to people?

@Cruiser

Do you even read? I said “residents”, not “citizens”.

and even if we did get Faux news here, I wouldn’t watch it.

@Darth_Algar I applaud you correcting your mistake

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-lax-protest-muslims-trump-20170128-story.html

‘One detained traveller was an Iranian woman who’d held a green card in the U.S. for five years and whose citizenship swearing-in ceremony is in two weeks, Cunnings said.

The woman has an 11-month old child with her who is an American citizen.

“People don’t have phone access or communication access to the people waiting for them, or their attorneys,” Cunnings said. “It’’s just really heartbreaking.”’

I hate the idea of a total ban. Let me say that. I also think the media did nothing to compare how many people are questioned or detained in any given day, so whatever number happened yesterday it sounds huge, because everyone in their mind compares it to zero, but zero is a bad comparison.

@Seek I heard Trump does business with the countries not on the list. One of the countries is Saudi Arabia. Obama didn’t have that country on the list, either did Bush. Back during Bush many of us accused him of being oil friends with the Saudis. I really really wish the media would ask why American presidents aren’t putting Saudi on these lists, or the other countries that are suspect. The media really needs to make it less partisan so the America people can know what’s going on.

Saudi Arabia is the biggest state sponsor of terrorism. Saudi Arabians have inflicted more damage to us than terrorists from any other country. Saudi Arabia is vile, backward, oppressive regime that is a cancer to the world.

But, we say and do nothing about Saudi Arabia because we’re helplessly addicted to oil and Saudi Arabia is one of the world’s biggest suppliers of it. No junkie wants go go against his dealer, no matter how repugnant, how damaging or how evil that dealer is.

So we’ll keep sucking on the oil tit, the House of Saud will keep growing fat off oil wealth, and we’ll keep dealing with terrorism no matter how many people we block from other countries.

Also, along with this ban I have a question. Trump is banning those 7 countries, but not banning Muslims right? I’ve seen people writing he is banning Muslims. I did see he is considering special exceptions to oppressed groups like Christians and other minority religions.

I don’t think the media is lying or making up things, but I do think the media is delivering the news in a way that promotes hysteria. Like when H1N1 was a big deal a few years ago. People were in a panic, and the panic was not necessary. The government worked on a vaccine, it didn’t look like it was spreading more than the average flu virus. Now, the courts are working on this crazy ban. Hopefully, reason will win.

I’m all for people speaking out, but I feel like everything is over the top.

@Darth_Algar Right. Trump even accused Bush after 9/11 of getting his friends out of the country.

@JLeslie the media always sensationalizes, it’s been a growing problem for years. That is why I think it’s significant and important to check multiple sources and try to balance the information available. Getting the “truth” or “accuracy” from one source just doesn’t seem realistic. People are naturally biased, but we have also been conditioned to subscribe to sensational media, and that isn’t going to change when something like this is going on.

A president who called for a “Muslim ban” and then does this in his first week in office, without provocation (the countries included don’t seem to have been chosen logically, as has been discussed above), while bashing the very best outlet we have to connect with the White House. Of course people are freaking out. My question is, why isn’t this administration, who claims to be for all of the people, even trying to address the people’s fears? Why is there no attempt to explain, comfort, or reassure what appears to be a lot of very upset people?

As far as I can see the mainstream media have reported this story in a responsible way. The facts themselves are enough to cause worry for many people who have hitherto been able to travel freely and without hindrance to and from the USA. In these unusual times count yourself lucky you live in a country where such things can be freely reported and commented on.

There was a lot of confusion over Trump’s order but that wasn’t the fault of the media. Immigration officials themselves weren’t sure how to interpret the new instructions. The media has tried to clarify what was going on and we should thank them for that. If it was left to social media alone things could really get out of hand.

@Darth_Algar: Federal judges can be removed.

@flutherother “There was a lot of confusion over Trump’s order but that wasn’t the fault of the media” Stop making excuses for the media….they ARE the problem we have today as far as reliable information. THEY are responsible for getting the facts…the truths which are IMO as easy as easy can be to get the facts. Unfortunately networks like CNN have agendas and must do everything and anything to undermine our President. I have had CNN on all afternoon while I worked at home and all they did was hammer away at the racist anti muslim nature of his travel ban from hostile countries. Not once did they provide the truthful purpose of Trumps executive order. The media is failing at providing truths and facts. We now live in a whole new world of faux news.

It was Fox (Faux) news that is telling you that people of a certain faith from certain countries are hostiles.

Cheeto’s unconstitutional executive order has nothing to do with it ! WHAT ! The networks didn’t all decide it was unconstitutional; it was a Federal Judge. Cheeto will put her on parking ticket duty as soon as he can.

Oh and none the countries that Cheeto has business connections that are Muslims countries LIKE Saudi Arabia were on the deny entry list. Oh he does know anything about the businesses because he put them in a third party, I means his loving family’s hands. Talks to them twice a day

He is acting more and more like a frustrated dictator.

To whoever….attempting to use Saudi Arabia as a meaningful counterpoint to Trumps executive order only serves to highlight your ignorance over what you are talking about! Seriously? Trump’s executive order is explicit in that it targets countries that have and are openly hostile towards the US. 15 years ago Saudi Arabia as we all now know funded, trained and hand delivered terrorists who eviscerated NYC in 2001. We did nothing then and nothing now. We even gave Osama’s family safe passage during those tumultuous months. Barry implemented a ban on Iraqi refugees in 2011 and Trump is implementing a very similar TEMPORARY ban on refugees from countries that are hostile towards the US. Seriously?? You have a problem with this? C’mon…get up and jump….wave your hands….scream at the top of your lungs….this is so freaking entertaining to me! To think I almost left and would have missed out on this! You go Jellies! Bring it!

Okay what did have to price of . . . .? @Cruiser

oh LA-LA-LA @Cruiser‘s hands over his ears. What part of the only Muslims countries in the area that DON’T have bans are ones that do business with Cheeto !

Oh I know not relevent to @Cruiser

”Okay what did have to price of . . . .?” Slightly incoherent there @Tropical_Willie…can you or someone interpret for me?

@jca “Federal judges can be removed.”

Yes, but not by the president and not because he just doesn’t like their ruling. The process for removing a federal judge from office is the same as removing a president from office (as per Article II of the Constitution of the United States).

I think we can always question the stats and the reporting. I don’t doubt Trump didn’t think through how his order would play out. I have no doubt more people than usual were brought in for additional questioning or detained at the airports, but I would be curious to know how many are detained daily on a usual day.

@Tropical_Willie Why not ask why US presidents don’t put Saudi on the list and then maybe republicans will get on board? As mentioned above it’s not just Trump. The media could dig deeper and make it less political. It would help the country to take political parties out of the equation whenever possible and see an issues as an American issue or question instead. Would you agree with that?

@ANef_is_Enuf Great points about all the anti-Muslim stuff Trump has said all along. Trump is scary with all these changes so fast.

@JLeslie The “targeted ” countries are Muslims nations he doesn’t have business connections with and only revenue generating countries getting a “pass”. I’m not saying it the sole reason but it sure looks like he knows where his money is coming from. He hasn’t handed his businesses over to anyone.

He still acts like a bully and some of the players he is to playing “Chicken” with can have all their population jump in the air and land at the same time and Earth will shift in orbit..

when you resort to blaming Fox news for everything you’ve lost the debate

@puddintane when you resort to blaming Fox news for everything you’ve lost the debate

I would change your “Fox news” to “the media” in general.

True.

@Tropical_Willie So, you don’t care that the countries he chose and didn’t choose are countries chosen by the administrations before him. Don’t get me wrong, each president makes his own choices, and those are his own responsibility, but I’m talking about overall American policy regarding those countries, that should matter for something.

In my mind Trump’s major fuck up here is including green card holders. I personally don’t want to delay or block any refugees already approved, even if he slows down the process the next few months. I have always been in favor of the US accepting some of the Syrian refugees.

The Trumps obviously have some trouble understanding all the different visas. They proved that when they said Melania was legal in the country when she was a young woman working here [i say with some sarcasm] but people with working visas don’t need to leave and come back. I know a whole bunch of people who say they are here legally, but are working illegally. They are convinced in their own minds they are “legal” because they have a tourist visa.

According to this New York Times Story, the green card denial is the work of Steve Bannon, aka Darth Vader Do a search in the Times story for green card.

@LostInParadise In the end the responsibility ends with Trump.

@JLeslie

Exactly. Truman, during his term in the Oval Office, kept a sign on his desk that read “the buck stops here”. He could not shift responsibility on to someone else. He knew that as president he was ultimately responsible for everything done by his administration.

I was just talking to my dad about this. During the conversation I pointed out that the Syrian refugees probably go under much more scrutiny than green card holders. We do know there have been people who are citizens of the US, maybe some green card holders also, who go to countries in the Middle East while they are being radicalized. Thing is, I don’t think preventing them from going back and forth will do anything. The terrorists seem to figure things out right here in the US if they are motivated.

Scary times.