How would you solve the inner city violence problem?

Get rid of the instruments of violence.

If people are shooting each other, get rid of the guns. That’s a first step.

^^How?

Unrestricted use of thermonuclear weapons.
To quote a former papal functionary: “Kill them all, and let God sort them out.”

I do not believe Trump ever expected to solve the inner city gang problem by sweeping up criminal illegal immigrants though it won’t hurt to do so.

Trump did campaign that he was going to work with states to bring in more jobs and better paying jobs and he is committed to overhauling the educational opportunities in our countries with an emphasis on the inner cities which as we all know are sorely under performing hence his pick of Besty DeVos who has years under her belt on working with the inner city education challenges in Michigan especially Detroit. So Trump believes better jobs and better education will help ease the crime and gang problems of the inner cities. I happen to agree with Trump on this and a minor yet important part of the reason he got my vote.

@Cruiser A friend of mine has sold educational software to MI public schools for over 20 years. She has always said that some of the biggest budgets are in Detroit, and yet still Detroit is a mess when it comes to education.

DeVos can’t spell “education challenges”...

Is there any evidence at all that illegal immigrants contribute significantly to gang violence? “Deport the illegals” can’t be the solution to everything.

@cinnamonk No one is saying it is. I don’t think even Trump thinks that solves the problem.

@JLeslie then why did you mention illegals?

@cinnamonk Because it’s one thing Trump has mentioned. I took it farther to maybe even include people who are legal and not citizens. It’s certainly not the biggest problem when it comes to violence and crime in our cities. Not in my opinion. I think there are a lot of things underlying our troubles.

Evidently the solution is fairly simple, I believe the answer is to Send in the Feds

@JLeslie ah, ok.

I have neither direct or indirect experience with this issue so my opinion is completely unqualified – take it with a rock of salt. But it seems to me that the solution to inner-city violence starts at home. (I think) kids are less likely to be vulnerable to gangs if they grow up in stable, two-parent households. Maybe if the state can figure out how to help families stay together, there will be less gang violence.

@JLeslie THAT is the whole problem with our current educational “system”. Bigger budgets does not equal better education. That should be pretty obvious to anyone that has kids in school. And if not just peruse average grade scores to find out the real truth on the return on investment we are not currently getting from many of our school systems.

As Emma Goldman once said – crime is naught but misdirected energy.

As long as there is a dearth of economic opportunities and a lack of productive means to use ones energy then people will turn to crime. This problem is especially pronounced in the inner cities, where there are masses of people clustered and an every increasing dearth of opportunity, but you’ll find it in small rural towns (where there are few minorities and fewer immigrants, legal or otherwise) as well.

@cinnamonk How is the state going to encourage that?

@JLeslie I have no idea! lol. Parenting classes at the county job center? Tax-breaks for intact families?

@cinnamonk It all comes back to jobs. Good paying jobs will keep parents working especially the dad’s who won’t resort to crime. So many inner city dad’s are currently in jail and you perpetuate the cycle with like father like son.

Betsy DeVos didn’t do a thing for Detroit. Detroit’s violent crime and murder rates are about THREE times worse than Chicago, though we get the headlines.

She didn’t TRY to do anything for Detroit. Her goal is undermining public schools and shoveling taxpayer money to churches and private investors.

When asked why she didn’t simply fund the private “Christian” schools she wants, DeVos said ”“There are not enough philanthropic dollars in America to fund what is currently the need in education versus what is spent every year on education in this country”

She said it out loud. She needs taxpayer money to convert children to her idea of Christianity.

Her charter efforts didn’t make better schools. They don’t get better results. They DO make profits.

Michigan spends $1B on charter schools but fails to hold them accountable.

Betsy DeVos and the twilight of public education.

Betsy DeVos and the Plan to Break Public Schools

@Darth_Algar is on the right track, A stable household is easier to achieve with a stable income (but not always I know). A good first step would be to figure out a way to bring employment opportunities back into the city.

@rojo Is it a terrible idea? I wonder if places like Chicago would appreciate the manpower? I haven’t heard anything from Chicago or IL officials, because I haven’t been paying close enough attention.

I’m not offering an opinion about it, I don’t know the details, but I’m happy the fed protected black children walking into schools after desegregation, and when the fed goes in after natural disasters.

Also “inner city” is a stupid term that portrays Americans as some kid of aliens. It’s Trump talk that reinforces his hateful rhetoric about carnage and cities on fire.

@JLeslie The mayor of Chicago was in Washington this week meeting with the Attorney General and outlined what Federal help he would like from the Justice Dept.

“On the FBI, DEA, ATF, send more agents [who] are permanently placed here in Chicago to cooperate and work with our Chicago Police Department. They do it in a number of areas today. But, we don’t have the full expanse of what we need to do the job and we have a good relationship with those three federal entities,” the mayor said.

“Second is invest in the technology that you saw in Englewood in the 7th District and the 11th District — the strategic predictive analytic rooms — help us take that to other police districts in the city.”

“I talked about making sure that our kids have an alternative consistent with what I’ve said about BAM [Becoming A Man] as a mentoring program,” Emanuel said. “There’s an account that deals with ex-offenders. We would like to see that because we have the largest ex-offender program. . . . And help us with summer jobs and after school where the federal government has actually been cutting those resources.”

Emanuel said he also renewed his call for the U.S. Justice Department to step up federal prosecution of gun crimes. – Chicago Sun Times

DeVos scares me. Most of the people I know who are for vouchers don’t give a crap about education for inner city kids. The intention isn’t in the right place. They generally think give them money and let them (them is basically black poor people) sink or swim by their own hand. They want voucher money for their own kids already in private school. They are all for public money going to fund religious schools. When I ask what if a bunch of Arab Muslims come in and open schools that can then receive vouchers I get dead silence. I have never once had a white, Christian, Republican, voucher supporter answer that question, they just start bringing up other points.

@Call_Me_Jay Thanks. So the mayor wants to work with the federal government.

What should we use instead of inner city? I agree it’s an imperfect term. There are gang problems in more places than the inner city, that’s for sure, and not all cities have the same troubles.

how about something like “underserved urban communities.” That might better avoid the racial overtones of the term “inner-city.”

Kids and teens being shown testimonials on how crime and gun violence don’t pay by inmates. Like this. Heartbreaking.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlHNh2mURjA

You speak of eeh-merry-ka i’m guessing & so my answer is as simple as your nation, take away your shooty bang bangs of course.

@JLeslie

Trump doesn’t have any real interest in protecting inner city kids. What he’d do is turn those neighborhoods into police states where anyone who even looks like a drug dealer or gangsta is gunned down without trial (similar to what’s going on in the Philippines right now, Trump has expressed admiration for President Duterte’s policy).

@ucme over here, we call them “rooty-tooty-point-and-shooties.”

@Darth_Algar I do have some fear of that happening. I’m not sure what my opinions are as I said.

@JLeslie Mayor Emmanuel only wants to work the the Fed Gov because he has failed so miserably to improve education in Chicago, in fact it seems to have gotten worse. I lay a big part of it squarely on his shoulders because of his failure to address the budget issues the CPS has faced since day one of his Mayorship. Largely because he is in the tank with the Teachers Unions who have been YUGE supports of his campaigns. Secondly, he is in bed with Mike Madigan machine which has driven Illinois into the shitter during his 30+ years in Illinois politics. We finally have a Republican Governor who is trying to pass a budget that will address our funding issues and the budget does not have additional money to throw at Chicago and Emanuel knows this as Illinois is beyond broke because of the mismanagement of the States finances and legacy union costs are a bigley part of our financial woes. The State Dems are standing in the way of necessary reforms so we have been at a budget stalemate for some time now and our Gov won’t let him raise property taxes for the umpteenth time in his Mayorship. So Emanuel’s only hope is to beg the Fed to help bail him out. It’s a sad self inflicted situation Emanuel lacks the balls and fortitude to solve the way it should be solved.

How should it be solved?

@cinnamonk I so wanna hear Trump call them that, with his tone it would sound perfect.

@Seek We have to get rid of or at the very least neuter Mike Madigan. It’s that simple. Cullerton a Dem has worked out solutions to our budget problem with our Governor (Rep) but Madigan top Dem in our state keeps voting it down. Sorry I don’t know exactly why but I do believe he is succumbing to pressures from the Unions as a big part of the solution requires changes to Union benefits.

The Chicago Tribune wrote a pretty decent article that spells out this crazy dilemma our state has been mired in.

It was solved by letting “Wack-jobs” and outright “Crazies” get their second amendment rights back to have another Sandy Hook. Next it will authorizing fully automatic weapons for an extra ten bucks.

Give everybody a gun and teach them how (and when) to use it. If you don’t like that idea, then kill them all and let God sort ‘em out, if you believe in “God.”

It’s going to be so awesome when Rahm Emmanual and Michael Madigan stop causing all the violent crime in Detroit, St. Louis, Birmingham AL, Baltimore, Memphis, New Orleans, Indianapolis…

Those guys cause all the crime They should stop.

Please be more specific. I didn’t ask you who you blame for the problem.

You’re naming people. Those people are not the cause of the problem, and replacing one person with another isn’t a solution unless the replacement is going to do something different.

What is the problem, and what, in your opinion, is the solution?

Give them all guns and let them sort it out.
Sorry couldn’t resist, everyones answer is of course take the guns away and all will be right with the world uh sure.
Bad people still get guns but the people with the rainbow sunglasses refuse to see that.
How about showing these people that it’s not hopeless, encourage industry and education, and show people they do have a chance at a good law abiding life with a good paying job that can buy a house and raise a family.
But who am I kidding the rich won’t go for that so what do inner city kids have to look forward to a minimum wage at walmart that won’t even pay for a crappy apartment.
So yeah back to take all the guns away that will make the world wonderful again.

@Seek Were you asking me? Your post asking how should it be solved had no @ so I thought maybe you were asking me since I’m the OP.

@SQUEEKY2 Well said, agreed. Just like in nature, overcrowding, lack or resources lead to violence amongst the species in question. Dog eat dog, er, dog shoot dog as it were. Until we can provide a sense of real hope for inner city kids and all people oppressed by their economic circumstance the violence will continue. Hopelessness+anger=lack of resources= violent behaviors.

How can you have hope when the drugs and violence are there? Let’s say you build a very nice school, but the children have bullets flying in their neighborhood at night, and their single mom works two jobs to pay bills.

A few nights ago I found out my girlfriend cheated on me with a dude I know. I was livid. I had been drinking a bit and wanted to kill the both of them.

Unfortunately, I could buy a shotgun at a pawn shop a few blocks away. The checks were minimal and they didn’t seem to care I reeked of PBR. (Money is money)

@JLeslie It would/will be a very slow process as all societal and cultural change is. sadly.
@johnpowell That really sucks, I’m sorry.
A relationship is never worth that, just dump her cheating ass, ditch the betraying non-“friend” and move on. Living well and being true to yourself is the best “revenge.”

The point seems to be made of helium these days.

@Coloma :: I was illustrating a point. It wasn’t a true story.

But the thing about buying a shotgun was true. When I was living in my moms back-yard I was in a gun debate with a person.

They argued that it was hard to get a gun. I had been drinking and walked to the pawn shop. 30 minutes later I had a shotgun and some ammo for 99 bucks.

They don’t really check for shotguns here at pawnshops.

They even taught me how to use it.

How can you have hope when the drugs and violence are there?

Reminding me a huge factor hasn’t been mentioned.

Legalizing drugs would be a huge improvement. What we have now is much the same as 1920s gangland warfare during Prohibition.

There is a lot of money in illegal drugs. There is money to fight over on the street. There is money to be made in building and staffing prisons. There is money to be made militarizing the police. There is money to be made by police unions threatening to slack off if their demands are not met.

A whole lot of people have a financial stake in keeping the streets violent.

^^and supplied. That shit don’t just appear. Someone has to mfg, import, distribute.

• Install a system of CCTV cameras covering every street, every intersection and every building in the area. Link the feeds to a computer that can track suspects across multiple cameras.

• Monitor the area from the air with drones.

• Make possession of a firearm a criminal offence.

• Provide registered drug addicts with free and medically supervised drugs.

Hello @Seek Do you live in my state? I do and have had ring side seats to this Democratically circus that has driven our state to junk bond status my whole adult life. READ THE ARTICLE! It shows with facts that there is one man and his cronies that have bankrupted our state!!! When you are bankrupt you are OUT OF MONEY! Rham wants more for his Chicago schools but guess what we are OUT OF MONEY and he can’t get any more!! I told you we are broke because of one man…Mike Madigan (well and a handful of Governors who are or have been in jail for their corrupt activities) !! He is the most corrupt politician EVER! Fun fact about Madigan is his lawyer firm specializes in fighting property tax increase disputes….what does Mike do in the Illinois Senate? Pass property tax increases which nets his firm huge dollars then fighting tax assessment cases. He’s been playing Illinois Tax Payers for over 30 years now. The guy is a scam artist with only his best interests at play and taxpayers get the shaft both in their tax bills and declining educational opportunities for our kids.

^Truth. I’m way down state and also know these facts. We are faced with school closures because there is no money. That means consolidations and large classrooms and stressed out teachers. Fuck Madigan.

@JLeslie How do you think we should go about fixing it?
This is not a problem that will ever be legislated away, it is a societal problem, and the state society is in, they best hunker down and deal with it as it is.

Do away with inner cities.

Not joking.

Smaller communities have fewer problems so make all communities small ones.

@rojo Yes! Sadly that is not reality. Bring those inner ciy kids up to the ranch here. Give them the experience of nature, animals, communing in a beautiful natural setting. Let them work with rescue wild mustangs, feed the chickens, sit by the pond under the willow trees watching the Koi fish, work in the garden/orchrds. If you have no reference point of other lifestyle alternatives, well…your stuck in the reality you’re stuck in.I always wanted to have a dude ranch for inner city kids, the full Ponderosa bunkhouse, ride and rope and work experience.

@rojo Rural areas can’t sustain the economy and the population.

Taking my own state as an example, Chicago produces 70% of the GDP and the Chicago metro area produces about 90%.

That’s 75% of the population making 90% of the jobs, paying 90% of the taxes, and 90% of the production.

Good point but the inner city areas are not contributing to this. These are dead, decaying areas that businesses avoid as best they can. Perhaps suburban is a better setting is better. Can you say that having a large aggregate of unemployed citizens is working well? No? Then perhaps it is time to say goodbye to the ghetto and move people to where the jobs are. Assuming that there are jobs and I question whether or not this is the case.

@Call_Me_Jay _ Not sure where you got your stats…and I will merely riff off your comment “That’s 75% of the population making 90% of the jobs, paying 90% of the taxes, and 90% of the production.“_

Bigley misleading as yes 75% of the Metro Chicago may hold 90% of the jobs but it is the owners of the companies that employ all those employees that make 90% of the jobs, pay 90% of the taxes, and oversee 90% of the production that is responsible for our states GDP.

What you leave out of the equation is the importance the other 95% of our state has towards supplying agricultural and coal needs for the rest of our country. Unfortunately what happens in Metro Chicago stays in Metro Chicago and in the bank accounts of the .5%‘rs that enjoy their lucrative existence in our beautiful Downtown skyline. Meanwhile those of us outside Cook County don’t even have a sayso of what happens in our state. Yay for us!

@rojo OK, you get on the project. Move those people. Tell us how it goes.

On a less sarcastic note, some people are making that choice. Chicago is losing population in the poor areas. I personally know a handful of people who left crappy neighborhoods in Chicago for other states.

On the flip side, the city is gaining upper middle class and wealthy people. Five buildings on my block have been demolished and turned into single family homes ($900K or more) and condos ($400K or more).

Sarcasm noted but what I am saying is perhaps huge cities with high population density are not the way to solve employment problems anymore. It may have worked to bring a mostly rural population into an area where they could find employment but evidently that is not happening anymore. Large companies employing countless workers no longer exist for the most part so there is little reason to consolidate populations in such densities any longer.

@Cruiser

My 75% number was 75% of Illinois lives in the Chicago metro area.

75% of the Illinois population produces 90% of GDP and pays 90% of taxes.

And no, the owners of the companies do not pay 90% of the taxes. That’s a ridiculous claim.

Also, obviously, agriculture and coal are a small part of the state economy. Otherwise, downstate would have more than 10% of the GDP.

Ag is a small part of the state?

Marketing of Illinois’ agricultural commodities generates more than $19 billion annually. Corn accounts for 54 percent of that total. Marketing of soybeans contributes 27 percent, and the combined marketings of livestock, dairy and poultry generates 13 percent. The balance comes from sales of wheat and other crops, including fruits and vegetables.

Billions more dollars flow into the state’s economy from ag-related industries, such as farm machinery manufacturing, agricultural real estate, and production and sale of value-added food products. Rural Illinois benefits principally from agricultural production, while agricultural processing and manufacturing strengthen urban economies.

source https://www.agr.state.il.us/facts-about-illinois-agriculture/

http://www.newsmax.com/t/newsmax/article/636484

The state of Illinois houses more than 74,600 farms at 357 acres each. Almost 90% of this land is used to raise crops, and about 1,500 different types of fertile soil exist in the state. Top agricultural products raised on these farms are corn, soybeans, wheat, pork and cattle. Additional crops grown in Illinois include oats, sorghum and fruits and vegetables.

My apologies @Call_Me_Jay I conflated Metro Chicago with Downtown Chicago. Your metro numbers do hold water. Yet to champion those numbers is to champion the very few CEO’s who control the lions share of business and jobs that occurs in Metro Chicago and additionally supports their ability to manipulate state legislation that has destroyed our state and filled their bank accounts and not those of the hard working stiffs of Illinois and left farmers and coal miners to fend for themselves. I maintain my point is we need to cut the cord that enables so few to control so much of what fiscally happens in our great state that is no longer great by any stretch of the imagination.

@Cruiser It’s not Chicago inflicting pain on the rest of the state. The vast majority of the hard-working stiffs live around here. My grocery store cashier and the people building houses on my block live here, too.

@Call_Me_Jay If you are correct that 70% of the state’s income is from Metro Chicago than we should examine the fact that this relatively small segment of our state consumes over 70% of our states budget. The return on investment on infrastructure required to support all that commerce in metro Chicago will never ever be felt by the farmers and coal miners in down state Illinois especially when power brokers like Rham Emanuel and Madigan funnel the money to their special interest cronies. It does not demand an IQ of over 130 to understand this Democratic corrupt rip off that has been going on for decades.

As I said, 90% of the income is from metro Chicago, not 70%.

We are subsidizing downstate.

@rojo

When you move everyone out of densely populated urban areas into small rural areas what do you think happens to those rural areas?

Hint: they don’t stay small rural areas.

“We are subsidizing downstate.”

Downstaters don’t like to hear this, but it’s absolutely true.

I talked to my friend who sells to the public schools. My friend is a conservative on most issues and a registered republican and her own son is in private school. She says DeVos is awful and taking money from the public schools is an awful idea, and in doing so it most certainly hurts the poor the most. She said the same as me that the Christians for some reason don’t realize that voucher money will be able to go to Muslim schools too. I’m thinking it wouldn’t be the first time Muslims went after African Americans. That happened in the ‘70’s and ‘80’s.

She also said DeVos is a big investor in a company called K12.com; its an online school that some states allow you to use voucher for; and some charters use it. So she stands to make money.

As far as the city subsidizing rural, but it is the money in the city doing the subsidizing, not the poor people. In cities Mike Detroit and Memphis it’s probably the opposite. The suburbs in the county subsidize the city. I know in Memphis that’s the case for the schools.

@Call_Me_Jay So, the expensive homes that went up, am I right they are in a pocket with bad areas around it? Where are they sending their kids to school? Private?

@JLeslie I think it is repellent that anyone should profit from the education of children and that the U.S. Secretary of Education herself stands to make a profit through a company in which she has invested would surely be unthinkable in any universe other than Trumps.

I see one of the options offered by K12 is ‘online education’ for children rather than a traditional school. I can’t think of a better way to ensure maximum profit for the company and minimum education for the kids.

And this is taxpayers money we are talking about.

@JLeslie No, expensive homes are not going up in little pockets.

Most of the city is fine. Chicago has 50 wards. ½ the violent crime is in 12 wards. Note the red areas in this map, and note the vast areas that are NOT red. Map.

I am in a mixed income ward, not ritzy, and the violent crime rate is 8 times lower than the worst.

Regarding schools, there is a similar gap. There are a lot of good public schools and people buy homes to get their kids in those schools. They are stereotypical single-earner families with stay at home moms, so the schools essentially have an auxiliary force with time to lavish on the kids and schools.

At the other end, are the stereotypical kids from single-parent homes, where Mom is working two jobs. The kids and the schools lack parental involvement.

Which leads back to the original question – an improvement in quality of life would take a massive commitment to K-12 education. But I don’t see that happening with our electorate. We should have first-world health care and education for all, but instead we get things like a trillion-dollar losing war in Iraq.

Online school is actually a really good option for a lot of kids. Not least of all because it avoids the problems of bullying, school violence, 3 hour school bus rides, and the daily cattle drive from class to class complete with bad food.

@Call_Me_Jay “Most of the city is fine. Chicago has 50 wards. ½ the violent crime is in 12 wards. Note the red areas in this map, and note the vast areas that are NOT red. Map.”

Well I can’t see that map, but this is true. Contrary to the image many people (who have little to no actual experience with the city) Chicago isn’t fucking Fallujah. It’s not raining bullets everywhere. There are certain areas you might want to avoid, sure, but generally you’re not particularly unsafe in the city.

I can’t see that map

Sorry, did not realize it needed a login, I think this is public – Map

That one works.

It’s also my understanding that a lot of the escalating violence in Chicago in recent years is due to a lack of strong leadership, who can maintain firm boundaries and relative peace, in a lot of these various gangs. So there’s a lot trying to step up and take power for themselves, a lot of gangs splintering, a lot trying to claim new turf and a lot of jackass going off half-cocked at the slightest provocation.

@Call_Me_Jay I think you would agree a lot of the increase in crime in Chicago is due to lackluster leadership by the 2 previous Police Supers and in the wake of the Black Lives matters protests beat Cops are less secure in doing their jobs. Sixty Minutes did a show on this very matter last year.

“Former Chicago police officer Brian Warner says police are holding back because of the increased scrutiny on — and regulation of — officers. He says officers are responding to 9–1-1 calls, but they are not aggressively patrolling and looking for law-breakers as they once did.”

“Warner points to an October arrest during which Police Officer Veronica Murillo says fear of public scrutiny kept her from pulling her gun on a violent suspect.” She went on to have her head beat in by these thugs.

Rham and the current Super have announced they will hire 1,000 new cops and implement them over the next 2 years. We’ll have to hurry up and wait to see if this improves things in Chi-town.

Is that true, @rojo? Small towns/rural areas have less problems? While they may not have gang violence, America’s small towns have horrible problems of opioid and meth addiction. So I wouldn’t say moving to a small town solves all the problems—many of the same problems can be found there, especially when it comes to drugs. Many of America’s rural areas are plagued with unemployment and disillusionment just as the inner cities are. The same self-destructive behavior occurs there.

This is why I tend to agree with @Hypocrisy_Central. It’s not something that can be fixed with legislation alone or “less guns”. It requires a change of hearts and minds. Most of the legislative fixes are more like band-aids: they’re going to wither and fall off and the wound is still there.

The concept of taking city kids to the country is not that far fetched. Back in 1978 I worked with a program that not only removed the kids from the city, but taught wilderness survival skills, as well as equestrian skills and team building. That year we took 80 teens from Tucson to Denver and back be horseback and covered wagon. I’d like to see more programs like that.