Looking for advice on calming aggression in dogs. Can you help?

The younger dog seems to view the older dog as alpha bitch.
Big problem, because she will certainly vie for that position if she perceives aging or weakness.
Your daughter must be viewed as alpha bitch, with no wiggle room.
Pleading, and/or bribes will quickly lessen that position. She must be viewed by both dogs as clear alpha. She must assert herself frequently, whether opportunities present or not. It couldn’t hurt to put both dogs through drills. It doesn’t have to be extensive, but should be regular. Admonition and treats should be in use.
I would drill the dogs seperately at first, and then together, treating the one which does this best, admonishing the other.
Both dogs will see that their treats, their scolding, their routine comes from the same place.
You may want a professional to help.
Failing a full training program, I would relocate one of the dogs.
Or, go the shock collar route.. not a good choice.

Rehoming may be necessary. Some pets just aren’t well-suited to environments with other pets.

It’s also possible one or both of these dogs have some sort of mental health issues it happens. I had a crossbred hound years ago, both his parents were of wonderful temperament, we met both parent dogs, and my puppy began to display bold and aggressive behavior from a very young age, 4 months or so. I enrolled him in puppy/ obedience classes at 6 months old, took him everywhere to ensure good socialization with humans and other dogs.

He was properly exercised for his breed, kept indoors as part of the family and always treated with love and kindness. He, however remained highly aggressive towards other dogs and had high stranger aggression issues as well. I bent over backwards to try and modify his behaviors but nothing helped. He had to be confined when company was at the house and not allowed around other dogs.

His protective instinct was very high and while he could play with a neighbors lab alone, as soon as I walked out the door he would turn on his playmate and drive them away. He was an extremely high maintenance dog and I have since come to firmly believe that nature, does indeed, trump nurture in many cases. By the time my daughter was 5–6 years old his unpredictable aggression could no longer be tolerated with a young child in the house and the risk of him possibly turning on her or one of her little friends. He had already bitten my brother in law at one point, and then, bit me on the hand requiring 10 stitches the final straw.
Nope, with a dog it is 2 strikes you’re out especially when kids are involved.

We had him euthanized, the only responsible thing to do inspite of it being a heartbreaking decision. You should never attempt to re-home a human aggressive dog. I would suggest professional evaluation/training intervention but there are no guarantees the problems will be resolved. Sometimes incompatibility and aggressive factors do persist that may result in the need to re-home one or the other of the dogs.

@Patty_Melt Don’t dogs set up a hierarchy? What I mean is even if my daughter becomes the alpha female won’t they still vie for a number two position?

@Coloma she is not aggressive toward humans, at least not yet.

She has on occasion chased the cat but they grew up together and have played together for the year but now there is fear for the cats safety as well, her play is getting a little rough. But, that being said, the cat will still jump her from time to time and initiate what she sees at least as play.

Number two would only be important in a breeding pack.

You could try some calming spray. I believe it is a pheremone that make dogs feel they are in the presence of their mother while nursing. It lasts into adulthood. It helps our meth addicted chihuahua calm down when new dogs are around.

@ARE_you_kidding_me is that available in stores like Petco and the like? I am gonna save the intriguing question about a meth addicted chihuahua for a later time!

We get ours from amazon, I have never looked at the pet stores. It comes in collar form too.
My chihuahua acts like she is whacked out on meth.

The thing is many dogs become more bold and aggressive as they mature/get older. I know someone whose dog ( an adopted bully breed mix ) shredded their beloved Siamese cat after never showing anything more than the occasional passing interest in chasing the cat. They left both the dog and cat inside one day while they were gone for a few hours and came home to unspeakable carnage. I, for sure, would consult a professional trainer for your best chance of possibly rectifying the behavior before it worsen, which it is likely to do.

Are both of the dogs being walked for more than an hour a day? The human walking them make the the human the leader and calls the shots not the dogs.

No, @Tropical_Willie she cannot do both at the same time so each gets about 15 minutes a day of walk. They do have a large back yard that they spend the day outside in.

I found this article, and I don’t know who the author is, but the recommendations made sense—basically, get the dogs to behave reliably in non-competitive ways, and gradually bring them back together… and then once they’re amicable, try and make sure the time they spend together is time that is rewarding for both of them. http://www.sfgate.com/pets/pettales/article/Teaching-two-dogs-in-one-home-to-just-get-along-2599151.php

Wherever possible, I’d be keeping careful track of everything that went on before—especially the moments before—a fight or show of aggression. Watching everything in the moment, and then writing it down before I forget… and start to track the patterns that emerge. Are there certain circumstances that are triggering it? If so, those circumstances would provide clues on how to teach the dogs behave differently—or at the very least, knowing the triggers can help your daughter avoid them as much as possible, to put the fighting on pause while she works on the relationship otherwise.

To echo others… What @Coloma said about getting a professional trainer.They’ll have experience with these kinds of situations. Make sure you/your daughter looks into the trainer carefully and agrees with their training methods. What @Darth_Algar said about being open to rehoming; some dogs don’t handle sharing the resources of the home well with other dogs/pets, and it may be better to rehome one than to try to change their behavior/disposition. What @ARE_you_kidding_me said—I’ve never done that kind of therapy, but I helped out at a shelter and would see just how chill the dogs were after a volunteer would give them aroma therapy every Friday.

Also remember it will take time. That you got the dogs in the same room together ignoring each other most of the time seems like a hopeful sign… make sure to give them time to shift their behavior patterns. Plan out incremental goals. Get them to reliably be unreactive at farther distances and in easier circumstances first, then move them slowly to the end goal. Set them up for success at each step.

I would absolutely rehome them both, especially the more aggressive, younger dog, especially if your daughter has children.

I’m fortunate with our two dogs. Dakota, a white German shepherd, is always the alpha female to every other animal in our house, even alpha to Rick and me I suspect, but she isn’t aggressive about it at all. She just is The Boss. Sometimes she’ll do provocative things to our smaller dog, like, just walk up to her and calmly take her bone right out from under the her nose, while Dutchess gurgles in outrage. Dakota just tosses her head at Dutchess. One time she took all the bones outside and set them in the snow, then laid down by them and laughed at Dutchess who was going nuts on the other side of the sliding glass door!

I just would not have an aggressive dog in my house. Would not.

@Dutchess_III individually, the dogs are not aggressive.

I wouldn’t have a dog who was aggressive to other animals, either. Dakota will kill you to protect her family. I have no doubt about it, but she doesn’t waste her time acting like an asshole toward other animals to prove it. I did see her back down a much larger dog who we were house sitting for a friend. The bigger dog went after our (“her”) cat. Dakota turned into Cujo. Scary as shit. The other dog started minding his manners after that. There was no more trouble from him.

Does your daughter have children?

Just a quick update for those wondering.

My daughter and I took her dogs over to a training facility on Monday They believe the dogs are overall good dogs but the young one seems to have “fear aggression” but that this can be trained out of her. Unfortunately the classes, which are intensive multi-week affairs, do not start until toward the end of March.
While we had them both over there they were on their best behavior toward each other but at one point another dog, in the back, began barking and you could see the immediate tensing up of both dogs. Then they made eye contact and the hair on their backs stood up. They didn’t make a move toward each other but the tension was palpable. We immediately turned their heads from each other, engaged them individually and the tension subsided.

She has been keeping the two dogs separated but this evening while she was out grocery shopping her daughters friend inadvertently let the two of them come together (she opened the back door and let the one inside out). They made a beeline toward each other and immediately began fighting. Injuries were minor, small punctures in the snout and ears, but it took a good dowsing with a hose to separate them and that was only because the back deck got so slippery they fell down while going after each other and were easier to pull apart.

She is calling the school again tomorrow to see if there is any way to start training earlier. She is not willing to give up on either of her dogs yet but is close to being at her breaking point.

One item of note, the younger one was still “shivering” off and on an hour after the fight but it seemed to us to be more of a scared, fearful move than one of an animal on an adrenalin high.

Someone is going to get hurt. I don’t mean another dog, either. Most likely a child.

^^more likely me ^^

I honestly think you can’t train aggression out of a dog, any more than you could change it into a cat. If a particular dog is aggressive by nature, they will always revert, eventually. If there are kids around it just isn’t a chance I’d be willing to take.

This sounds bad, and I’m so sorry you guys are in such a difficult situation. You’ll need a (force-free) trainer who can evaluate the dogs – I’d love to help, but without seeing the dogs in question, there’s no safe way to do that. I can tell you four things:

1) Dogs can get to the point of drawing blood, and still be trained to be best friends again. The Adaptil collar mentioned by @ARE_you_kidding_me might be worth a try.

2) With stress levels as high as they are in your daughter’s house right now (re:shivering), both dogs are in danger of getting hurt very badly. It may become impossible to separate them. This combo of dogs cannot be supervised by children, and I would immediately take the necessary precautions to make sure everybody is safe. Meaning, an adult has to be home at all times. Whenever that is not possible, the dogs should be separated by a sturdy, locked door. The key should remain with the adult.

3) The alpha myth has been debunked. It’s based on observations of caged wolves done several decades ago, and even the scientists responsible for the findings have long since turned against it. Dogs are not pack animals. Wolves live in family structure, they don’t establish a pecking order – and while they do need order in their lives, they don’t need drills or force.

4) To be perfectly honest: A dog getting just 15 minutes of exercise a day…that’s a recipe for disaster, especially at 14 months. If your daughter doesn’t have the time to give her dogs the care they need, she’ll have to get some help. They each need at least an hour of hard exercise every single day. The younger one most likely needs around two hours of training or play to be happy.

Are the dogs in the house all the time? Does she have a yard?

@Dutchess_III @rojo said above “They do have a large back yard that they spend the day outside in.”

I missed that. But I was responding to @longgone‘s comment “A dog getting just 15 minutes of exercise a day…that’s a recipe for disaster, especially at 14 months.” Being outside should be plenty of exercise.

@Dutchess_III Depends on what they do. Many dogs spend the entire day outside, just getting more and more bored.

^Right, most dogs just lie around, having a yard is no guarantee they are going to be self exercising unless someone is actively playing ball or stick or other active games with them. My old hound dog could run, be in the go for 5–7 hours a day, seriously. That dog was almost impossible to wear out but outside alone he just lounged around. We would take him out on remote trails and he would run for hours, swim, drag around tree branches, he was a beast! haha

Well, then that’s the dog’s problem. I guess he or she doesn’t really need the exercise. I’ve never known a dog, not one, that wouldn’t take the time to run for what ever reason, or no reason, especially when they’re younger. I’ve never known a kid who didn’t run just to be running when turned loose outside, either.
We have a lot of squirrels around here, and they love teasing our dogs and that keeps them busy. And the cat chases them.

@Dutchess_III Well… sure, maybe a tiny burst of activity chasing a squirrel but in my experience most dogs just lie around unless engaged. My cats are the same way. They may wrestle with each other now and then but unless I am actively engaging them with the laser pointer or tossing toys they don’t play a lot on their own. Animals suffer from boredom just like people and need new and interesting stimulation. Sure puppies and very young dogs and cats are more prone to random, impulsive bursts of play but most older pets need to be encouraged a lot of the time.

Well, then they don’t feel like playing. They’re relaxed.

If a dog becomes aggressive and stressed because of enforced inactivity and you let them out they aren’t going to run outside and lay down. They’ll run for the hell of it until they feel better.

To me it’s like saying children won’t play unless you actively engage them. Left to themselves, sometimes they’ll play hard, sometimes they’ll play slow. Depends on how they feel at the moment.

I think providing a yard allows a dog all the exercise they want. If you don’t have a yard, don’t get a dog.

@Dutchess_III Maybe your dogs play by themselves but mine never did and my neither do any of my friends. 2 dogs are more likely to play together than an only dog.My only dogs never ran around by themselves and neither does my friends dog. She lies around on the deck and barks, that’s about it unless you involve her in some game.

My neighbors 3 dogs have a yard and all they do is run in and out of the house and bark at things. haha The other neighbors dog just slowly wanders around the yard and lies in the driveway of their rural home. I have never seen that dog just running and playing by herself.
Other than maybe running the fence line and barking my dogs always just layed around unless I engaged them to play ball or took them out for a walk or run.

I still say that MOST dogs need to be engaged unless they have a play pal.
Clearly it depends on the dog (s).

Then the dogs don’t have any stress and aggression that they need to unleash.

@Dutchess_III There are dogs who just need physical exercise to be happy, but they’re rare. Most need stimulation – new trails, new smells, water and sand under their paws, games, and friends.

@Coloma Well said.

I’ve never heard of a dog who won’t run, given the chance. I’ve never had a dog like that. But every one, dogs and people, need stimulation to be happy.
I can’t wait to get ours out to the lake soon! Man they love it there. They run around like crazy then collapse!.