My friend wants to facilitate a reconciliation between myself and another friend. What should I do?

Did the ex friend herself call you?

If she doesn’t want to do it, and you feel it’s not going to work either, there’s no use in trying to fix it. If she herself shows up and tries to reconcile, then maybe you should take it into consideration. (although, it seems obvious that it should be left in the past…)

The third party trying to solve the issue is, pardon me, unnecessary. It is entirely between you and the ex friend.

@avoice Thanks for your reply.

No, it was another mutual friend of ours who called me. But she doesn’t really keep in touch with the other party in the dispute.

I feel conflicted because on one hand, of course, I want to the same thing—a cessation of hostility and the chance to rebuild trust between us. But that would come with certain rules of engagement that I’m not sure she’s ready to abide by. (i.e. not bashing my life choices because she’s jealous of my happiness.) when she’s not even willing to acknowledge that she behaved badly.

The friend who wants to facilitate a fun outing for us is kind and well-intentioned, but I don’t think she understands exactly what went down or why I’m hesitant. She chalks it up to a night of drinking that went amiss, but it’s more than that—it’s a fundamental lack of respect and an unwillingness to take responsibility.

Would your life be better if you all made up and were hanging out with your friends again? If yes, then it might be worth accepting the help.

I will give you an example from my own experience. I belong to a support group. Some of the more unfortunate guys are on various forms of radical hormone therapy – and worse. Their thinking changes and they become extremely emotional – both easily offended and offending. It can be like walking on egg shells if we let it.
We healthy guys cut them some slack. When they offend us we consider the source and either just ignore it or let it roll off. We all silently think: “It’s the XYZ drugs talking. He can’t help it.” We do not go out of our way to help the guys or associate with them but we do act civilly, even when they do not.

If this is the same ex-friend about whom you have spoken often, here, I would recommend letting it go. It doesn’t sound like there is a possibility of reconciliation. I don’t recall you ever admitting that your behavior might have been unacceptable from the ex-friend’s perspective. What rules of hers might you be willing to follow?
The friend that wants you guys to reconcile really doesn’t have a say, here. I think it would be a poor idea if you still feel that you did nothing wrong or hurtful and put all the responsibility for the break onto the other person.
Sometimes we lose people and we just have to grow beyond it.

You have already tried a reconciliation, it didn’t work. You have told us how badly this ex friend has treated you while you were still friends. I’m not sure why you would want to remain friends with her unless she went through some kind of therapy and realizes how bad she behaves toward others that have a seemingly better life than she does. At some point in your life you have to quit thinking of yourself as the stable one that gets along or goes along with everyone and every suggestion your friends make. Being stable also means making decisions that ensure your life is as drama free as possible.

@canidmajor When the former friend and I tried to hash it out over email some months back she was incredibly defensive and said that the main way I offended her was by talking about my boyfriend too much and not being 100% on board when she did very risky things.

I’m trying to be as objective as possible, but whatever I did to offend her pales in comparison to how she treated me. She can try to convince others whatever she wants, but I know the truth as does the other friend who was there.

Then it seems, as I said, to be settled and done, and letting go is probably your best option.

@LuckyGuy I see what you’re saying but there’s a fine line between accepting people as they are and being an enabler.

The former friend in question has always counted on people enabling and making excuses for her for the past decade or so since her father was the victim of suicide our senior year of H.S.

Nobody gave me that luxury when I watched my mom choke to death on her own blood after a pulmonary embolism, lost my childhood home, and went no-contact with the father who abused me and literally tried to choke me to death. Perhaps because I put on a strong face and never asked for it. I’m always expected to be the strong one.

The ones who have accepted this behavior have simply not had the experience of being her target yet because they’ve never been as close to her as I was. But if they ever have a similar experience, even years from now, I think a little lightbulb may go off and they’ll say, “Ah, so THIS is what LeavesNoTrace was talking about. Ouch…”

Tell your friend to mind her own business.

I find it odd that your group is being kept apart by your relationship with one person. Isn’t there some way you can get together without her? If she wishes to be included then you need to tell her how hurtful her behavior was and, although you are willing to provide her with support, she needs to reciprocate.

And doesn’t this ex friend live in another state?

@chyna About six months ago she bought a home about an hour from our hometown and I live about 3.5 hours away.

However, only two people have gone to see her one time each. I don’t think she got the returning hero’s welcome she anticipated.

@LeavesNoTrace When our guys start acting up we know it will be temporary. In 2 or 3 or 5 years, they’ll either be off the meds and back to normal – or they won’t. Your friend’s situation seems permanent.
It sounds like she is not as resilient as you. She appears to be an emotional drain on your life. You’ve already given her an ample amount of time, energy, and effort so there is no shame in finally just phasing her out and moving on.

@LostInParadise

I mean, I would love it if we could reconcile and get the group back together. I love these people dearly and yes, of course, I still love my ex-friend in spite of her hurtful behavior. You can realize someone is damaged or a jackass and still care about them.

I guess the consensus amongst the friends is that it’s very sad that we cannot all hang out together and that things feel less harmonious with two important people in their lives not being able to communicate.

@LeavesNoTrace The question becomes: is getting together with the group of interest to you and if so, could you be with her in a group while not being reconciled?

Reaching out in friendship is never wrong. Be open minded. Give it a chance. She what she has to say before deciding. (If you decide to reconcile, it won’t mean that you won’t always be leery of her. “Once bitten twice shy.”)

@janbb I’m really divided, otherwise, I wouldn’t have even asked. On one hand, I would feel a lot more at peace if we could reconcile and let go of our negative feelings and pain. About once a week I dream about my old friend. Sometimes we rehash the same argument and other times we embrace and there is a huge flood of happiness and relief.

She can be very sweet and kind but she can also be volatile and tends to hold grudges for years. I mean, it’s been 10 years since HS and she still nurses her hatred of her adolescent rivals like it just happened yesterday. I know she cares about me as she’s expressed it to other friends.

But she’s very stubborn, hates being called out or corrected and can never be wrong in any situation. She’s also convinced one of our other friends that I’m crazy and a liar, which is incredibly hurtful and untrue. She’s very good at playing the victim and has benefitted immensely in getting people to pity her and overlook bad behavior. Nothing is ever her fault and the world is against her, is her prevailing mindset.

She does have wonderful qualities too. She can be kind, altruistic, she likes to fight for the little guy (although sometimes it turns into attention-seeking). She’s hardworking and smart and was my closest friend for 15 years. We went through a lot together. Both of us lost beloved parents at a young age. Both of us went no-contact with our surviving parents for our own reasons. Both of us lost our childhood homes and experienced the feeling of orphanhood. These shared experiences made us more connected to each other and there were many times when we felt like we were the only ones who could understand one another. I think the loss of this friendship has been devastating for both of us and others have told me that she asks about me.

The good things make me miss her, but the bad things make me wary.

What I’m suggesting is not a total reconciliation but maybe achieving the comfort level where you can be in the group together. It probably won’t be able to happen without some personal communication but if you want the group to survive, maybe you can establish some boundaries of what you will and will not do with her.

@janbb I think, for one thing, I won’t be comfortable with her when alcohol is present. When she drinks, it seems to interact badly with her meds and makes her more inclined to act unreasonably. I’m starting to think that she truly doesn’t remember how she acted the last time I saw her and can’t understand why I’m so upset. She denied the things she said and did but I remember clearly.

I for one, am a big believer in knowing your limit. If drinking makes you act like a jackass or lose control—don’t drink. I don’t think I’ll ever go to a bar with this person again if a few vodka sodas turns her into a whirling dervish of sh*ttiness.

I think Jan bebe is on the right track. It may not be so bad being around her within the group. You don’t have to be one on one. Over the years, she may respond to therapy or whatever and things might be better between you two, but in the meantime, the group of old friends survives—people who know about each other from the time they were in school, through college, careers, marriages, kids—that is invaluable. I, personally, wouldn’t toss that because one relationship went bad.

And, hey, you wouldn’t be the first person to shake hands after a fight and still have a shit load negative feelings for the asshole you’re shaking hands with. You do it for the people around you. And then you have an arms length relationship with the individual. And one day, you might surprised. They might do something really nice, or really brave like sticking up for one of the group at a horribly bad time in their life and you become impressed and decide maybe she isn’t such creep after all.

It sounds like you’re the cohesive force here. You’re the leader, the example, the one they look to for stability. For you to break off with one of the group scares the shit out of them and group morale has taken a dive. This is your fate. Accept it and, I say, keep the group together. Twenty years from now you will be happy you did.

@LeavesNoTrace It sounds to me like the best solution is for you not to try to see her; too much toxicity possibly on both sides. Why can’t your group get together with you at times and her at other times?

@Espiritus_Corvus Your last paragraph pretty much expresses what the friend who called me told me. I was the glue that kept the group of friends together and the one people looked to for comfort and good vibes. I also used to be kind of a doormat though.

I would love for this to be made right, but I also can’t do all of the emotional labor.

@janbb I’m not sure what I said that led you to believe that I’m toxic.

@LeavesNoTrace I just meant with each other. Clearly in any damaged relationship there is some fault on each side.

@janbb I do regret not talking to her sooner after our falling out. I was honestly in shock and wasn’t sure what to say to her. Now it seems that things have festered for a long time and neither of us really sure how to proceed.

I think the third party friend is meddling in your business and has no place doing so and their motives are self serving. They don’t give a damn about your experience with this person they just want things to be okay for them again.
It is not up to you to make peace with the toxic ex friend just to keep the groups status quo. It’s your call but in my experience when I have chosen to let someone go I have zero desire to try and re-visit the dead relationship. You might be able, as others have said, to hang loose in the group while still keeping your distance from your unstable old friend but I wouldn’t consider any kind of reconciliation unless the mean friend could totally own her shitty behavior towards you.

Honestly, it’s almost always best to let sleeping vipers lie, if they’ve struck out at you once the odds are good they are going to go snake on you again. I would walk softly and carry a big stick around that rattlesnake.

Thanks @Coloma My boyfriend said that while he likes my third party friend as a person, he did think she was being self-serving by trying to get me to set aside my experience for the good of the group. Unfortunately, people were so used to me being “chill” all the time that they forgot that my feelings and experiences are legitimate and based in reality.

While I do care about my former friend, I’m dubious as to whether she can own her behavior. Playing the victim has always worked for her so the moment anyone steps up and says “nope”, they are the bad guy. I’ve decided to stop being an enabler and if that makes me the bad guy to more than one person, so be it.

@LeavesNoTrace Totally agree. This is about YOUR feelings and experience and it is not your job to try and fix anything for anyone, not the group of friends, not the emotionally unstable friend. You do what’s right for YOU and nobody else and to hell with their opinions. Your Q. here is similar to something I took flak for recently, saying that regardless of somebodies mental health issues there is no excusing abuse.

You can feel sorry for the person with issues but you have every right to purge them and their toxic behavior from your life. Leopards don’t change their spots so you have to stay out of their jungle. haha

@Coloma Yep. It does suck and I have shed many tears over this. The people who excuse her behavior just haven’t had the experience of being her target yet. When that day comes, they will understand.

^^You are absolutely right there. What I’m getting is that you have an old friend who is a member of a group of old friends, who has a mental health history exacerbated by alcohol abuse as she gets older. Sit back and maintain an arms-length, non-confrontational relationship with her in order to not alienate your friends. If she doesn’t cut back or stop the ETOH consumption, she will eventually alienate each of her close friends over time, one by one, and they will eventually stop wanting anything to do with her.

Substance abusers always get left behind. She will either ask for professional help, or disappear into that netherworld of lone substance abuse, or the company of fellow substance abusers. That’s the pattern. Each member will eventually reject her independently out of self-preservation, or she will understand why she is being rejected and go for help.

As for feeling like you’re the doormat, at times—LOL, welcome to leadership. Welcome to being the strong one. It’s been confered upon you, whether you want it or not.

Have a little patience, and if she comes to you or your friends for help, be generous, but firm, and offer her professional help options. You’ve given a bit of your professional background here and none of it indicates you are equipped to handle a person like this. Know your limitations and don’t shrink from delegating to the pros.

Thanks @Espiritus_Corvus I can’t say for sure that she has a substance problem. She was never a hard or frequent drinker but when she allows herself to cut loose too much, she goes from “normal pain in the ass drunk person” to “flaming nightmare person” in 3.5.

I was the person in the group who was closest to her so I got the most exposure. That, plus the fact that she felt “comfortable” enough with me that she could push my boundaries. I think it’s been a rude awakening for her that that won’t work anymore and she has likely hoped she could make me look like the bad guy by putting her creative spin on the story.

Worst of all, I think she believes her own story. When we emailed about this last year she said that everything I said was “unfair and untrue” when I remember her very clearly disrespecting me, and telling me to “lighten up and go with the flow” when a coked-up club owner put his hand up my dress.

Oh, yeah, I remember that. She’s obviously is in denial about her poor behaviour which indicates she is not ready to accept change. Whether it’s MH exacerbated by ETOH or just a personality disorder, your modus is the same. Just be patient.

You know all those old ladies you see sitting together in sun chairs lined up on South Beach? Some of those friendships go back to high school. They know each other like one else, not even their spouses. They were there during all the fuck ups, recoveries, marriages, kid raising, financial disasters, divorces, lovers, deaths—everything. They’ve had falling outs, and they also know the poignancy of reconcilliation. They know each other. They are the survivors and in this is a strength that makes all the fucking pain-in-the-ass infirmaties of age trivial. There are the truly lucky ones who aren’t locked away alone in a dingy apartment and forgotten.

Like everything of any value, it takes hard work and sacrifice. LOL. You have a good forty or fifty years to go. Take it from an old man (to you, anyway) whose oldest friend only goes back twenty years. Who has lost all the old ones to heart disease, drugs, car accidents and cancer:

You really want to hold on to this group.

@Espiritus_Corvus Thanks. She’s had her fair share of interpersonal troubles the past ten years.Hasn’t had a long-term relationship since college, and that guy she stabbed in the hand and cheated on. Tons of one night stands and freaky-ass hookups but every potential relationship turned into a dumpster fire. Office drama where she was always the victim. Even her roommate relationships have been dramatic and ended in discord.

Through all of the above, I was kind and supportive of her. And to be fair, she helped me when I was going through my struggles as well. However, when she disrespected my partner and my relationship, I had to draw the line somewhere. And that’s what ultimately made her lash out. She was jealous because something was working out for me that hadn’t worked out with her.

I think half the reason she finally bought a house and moved to the woods with a dog is because she can’t handle herself with people. Maybe that was a healthy choice for her, but I don’t know if isolation will help her.

I have to go, LNT. I enjoy reading your stuff—the loves and trials of a young woman wending her way in NYC—a world very foreign to me on so many levels. Please take care and continue to come back to the site now and then. You are a jewel.