Why are people acting like showing the longer video somehow shows "another side," to the altercation between MAGA kid and Phillips?
I’ve seen it. All it shows is the black religious extremists hurling insults at literally everybody, calling blacks, “niggers,” calling women “bitches,” yelling at the Native Americans that their land was taken from them because they worshiped totem poles (smh.) You don’t see any of that in the short version….but it still doesn’t justify what MAGA kid did. Phillips had nothing to do with the aggression. It was all on the religious extremests.
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To me, it explains MAGA kid’s aggression, but underscores Phillip’s innocence.
You’re saying it was the black extremists that shouted “Go home, nigger!”?
They shouted a lot of nasty things. I don’t remember hearing anyone shout “Go home nigger.” But the black extremists were shouting the word “nigger,” and calling people Toms and stuff. They were just nasty to every single person they laid eyes on, black, white, brown, male, female.
“To diffuse the situation, all Nick Sandmann had to do was step aside and let Mr. Phillips through.” But he didn’t. He stood there, right in his face, smirking, while his buddies let out war whoops and made tomahawk signs and started dancing around, mocking Native Americans.
I think the reason people are claiming the video exonerates the kids is that Phillips approached them, rather than the kids descending on him. Also the kid at the center says nothing.
I think the longer video does make the situation look less awful. The shouting kids were rude. I would be disappointed if they were my family. But the tone was set by the ostensibly adult Black Hebrew Israelites
In a radio interview this morning, Phillips called the Israelites “the black Westboro Baptist Church”. Westboro being the fundamentalists who show up at funerals (among other places) shouting “God hates fags”. They’ve heckled military funerals and a memorial for Mr. Rogers. They insult everybody. They’re like the Don Rickles of protesters. I think they’ve been left out of the controversy because nobody expects decency from them.
@Call_Me_Jay Yes, that is the gist of what I’ve been trying to get at by posting other videos of the situation.
The media had a specific narrative it wanted to push: awful Trump-supporting teens harass Native Americans. The image of the “smirking kid” made it even worse: white invaders laughing at the most oppressed demographic in this country.
Then the videos show that the teens did not approach the Native Americans, that the “smirking” teen was simply trying to say nothing and stay calm in an already nasty situation that had been made nasty specifically by an extremist group called the Black Israelites (and Philips was banging a drum in his face; if someone was doing that in front of me, I’d probably smile too. It’s awkward. I laugh in awkward situations). There were reports that the teens shouted “build the wall” and ganged up on Philips, which is not what I see in the videos. People formed their own stories about what happened, not based on facts, because they wanted it to be a certain way. I admit I got played. But many people are continuing to double down on the lie. Because the lie is pleasant for them so it doesn’t matter that’s a lie.
This was not good reporting on behalf of the media this weekend.
https://youtu.be/t3_RiUB7R1w
Oh, for fuck’s sake. I haven’t seen any media coverage of this – only the raw videos released as they came out. There are no circumstances that make this any more complex.
Even CNN is trying to save face by posting the teens remarks about what really happened. Another example of the media bias against conservatives. What the long video shows is it just takes a small spark to ignite those who are already polarized. I did not see any innocent group in the video, they were all guilty in their own right. The kid in the MAGA cap and the drummer would probably get along quite well if they were just chatting over coffee. The widespread call for violence against this 16 year old kid makes me loose all faith for American politics. Seriously, they were just kids acting like kids and I’d say they responded to the heckling quite well. The kid child did not know what the fuck he was doing or how it would be interpreted. I believe his claim that he was trying to diffuse the situation. In any sense the fact that this is even news pisses me off more than you could even begin to imagine. Anything that underscores hate or polarization real or not gets headlines. What does that say….
@ARE_you_kidding_me: “Seriously, they were just kids acting like kids and I’d say they responded to the heckling quite well.”
Ah, yes. The I remember those days well. When I was 16, I too wore the contemporary equivalent of a swastika or white hood, gathered in large groups of aggressive men in public in and attended political events to advocate for the elimination of personal body autonomy. Then, when my tons of bros were swarming around and being scolded by a couple of Westboro Baptist Black Hebrew Israelites, we’d swarm and chant and get all pumped on our white rich privilege. And when a couple native americans, who we literally exterminated and stole their land, approach, we’d don punchable faces and stand in opposition while mocking these losers. Good times.
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The Hebrew assholes and the MAGA assholes got all fired up with rage and testosterone.
Phillips stepped in, trying to calm the kids down, not realizing he was dealing with wild animals, not thinking humans.
The MAGA kids were pissed at the Hebrew men and turned on th first stranger that came in range, which as Phillips. The fact that he had nothing to do with the Hebrew assholes made no difference. They were enraged and turned on him, the stranger, like the pack of wild animals they became.
@Demosthenes Your upper class privilege is showing. As a gay man you should be happy @notnotnotnot is in your corner. He has more guts than you.
@Stache Yeah it takes immense intestinal fortitude to curse out anyone who disagrees with you even slightly. You don’t need to tell me how I “should” feel. I don’t respect the way not treats many people here.
Kids weren’t in the wrong. Smiling or chanting school chants is fine. Yelling extreme remarks and getting in peoples faces with drums as the other people did, not fine.
Those “kids” (sorry, but 16–17 is old enough to understand consequences, old enough to take responsibility) wore those fucking MAGA caps for one reason: to provoke others. They knew exactly what they were doing. Fuck these smug, privileged shitheads.
Those red caps are not the equivalent of kkk hoods or neo nazi symbols. They are just pro-Trump and being pro-Trump does not mean you are a racist or a Nazi. Those kids were there waiting for a bus after a pro-life rally. Their pro-Trump is not likely hate related but Catholic, pro-life related. For 16–17 year old boys being taunted like that they showed a considerable amount of restraint. People who think they have “punchable” faces need to look at their own sons or daughters and see if they still feel that way. What a sorry state people are in now. It makes me sick.
Ah, yes, pro-Trump. Pro the man who has bullied others, made fun of others, boasted about sexual assault, who has thrown out every dog whistle under the Sun to white supremacists. Pro-that guy.
Frankly I think it’s overblown nonsense. Some adults acting poorly, not sure why the native man was in anyone’s face with his drum, that is very atypical and highly suspect to me (and my family are card-carrying natives.)
The kids go every year, it was a Pro Life march and they looked to me to be having fun with the drum beat and not understanding that this was some kind of political stand off they were in the middle of. Remember, these are kids, and they should have had an adult there running interference. Also, he’ll probably be punished for simply not knowing what to do but stand there and smile, Catholic schools do not play, no tolerance-even if he did nothing. Not cool imo.
As far as the Hebrew group or whatever they called themselves, they were out of line but free speech and all that.
@ARE_you_kidding_me: “Those red caps are not the equivalent of kkk hoods or neo nazi symbols.”
Yes, they are.
@ARE_you_kidding_me: “They are just pro-Trump and being pro-Trump does not mean you are a racist or a Nazi.”
Yes, it does.
@ARE_you_kidding_me: “Those kids were there waiting for a bus after a pro-life rally.”
Disgusting.
@ARE_you_kidding_me: “People who think they have “punchable” faces need to look at their own sons or daughters and see if they still feel that way.”
I have 3 kids. And that is one of the reasons I do feel this way. Those “kids” are a threat to many people, including my kids. They were there to tell my daughter that they should have the right over her body.
@ARE_you_kidding_me: “It makes me sick.”
Me too.
Sorry to inform you, but you are allowed to wear a hat.
People can wear things with honest intent. They weren’t trying to start anything, you are making something out of nothing.
@SergeantQueen
Sure. You’re allowed to wear whatever you want. Doesn’t mean people won’t react to what you’re wearing.
@ARE_you_kidding_me: “Those red caps are not the equivalent of kkk hoods or neo nazi symbols.”
Yes, they are
No, they are not. They are nowhere near the same in terms of symbolism and meaning.
@ARE_you_kidding_me: “They are just pro-Trump and being pro-Trump does not mean you are a racist or a Nazi.”
Yes, it does
No, it doesn’t. That’s an ignorant viewpoint that should’ve been left in 2016
@ARE_you_kidding_me: “Those kids were there waiting for a bus after a pro-life rally.”
Disgusting.
It isn’t disgusting, it’s a perfectly normal and acceptable view to have
@ARE_you_kidding_me: “People who think they have “punchable” faces need to look at their own sons or daughters and see if they still feel that way.”
I have 3 kids. And that is one of the reasons I do feel this way. Those “kids” are a threat to many people, including my kids. They were there to tell my daughter that they should have the right over her body.
They aren’t a threat to anybody if you believe that, you need to reconsider your life. If you are threatened by 16–17-year-old kids something is wrong with you.
@ARE_you_kidding_me: “It makes me sick.”
Me too.
You are ridiculous.
@Darth_Algar reacting violently or with racial slurs/ extreme names is wrong. It’s fine to disagree, never fine to get violent.
@SergeantQueen I kind of feel like the native guy was wrong for invading the kids personal space. To me, that’s aggression as well. Especially to a minor.
@SergeantQueen
I saw no violence. As for any slurs/extreme names – just words, right? What’s the real harm? The kid’s might get their feelings hurt?
@Darth_Algar The kid will probably be expelled. Catholic schools are zero tolerance in most areas. Not to mention his face being spread across America in connection to a false hate crime.
@KNOWITALL
Yeah. From all I’ve seen “zero tolerance” seems to depend greatly on one’s socio-economic status.
Pregnant, unwed teenager (just like Mary, the Holy Mother of God): “You’re outta here! Zero tolerance!”
Rich white boy who impregnated that teenaged girl: “Well we wouldn’t want to ruin someone’s life over one mistake”.
@KNOWITALL That’s what I said
@Darth_Algar Was talking in general
The kid was not in the wrong. What did he do? Smile? And he’s going to get expelled for that? Fuck off
@Darth_Algar I’m not a Catholic apologist, but in this case, I think it would be wrong to punish this kid. He literally kept his composure better than most adults at that gathering, imo.
Wasn’t he waiting for a bus stop????? WTF!!! You guys are literally asking whether or not a kid who literally did nothing, is going to get expelled? He shouldn’t. He won’t. Stop harassing a kid over a Trump hat. You can wear what you want it isn’t right ruining someone’s life over (Talking about the dumbasses trying to DOX him)
No, I doubt the kid will be expelled (and I really don’t think he did anything expellable anyway).
Yes, I believe these boys wore those hats with the intent to provoke. As such, they cannot claim innocence when they do get a reaction out of people. But no, I’m not arguing for expulsion (so I’m not even sure how @KNOWITALL got on that train).
I don’t think being Pro Trump had a thing to do with it. The kids were just white privileged assholes. Phillips was just trying to walk through the crowd in the mistaken idea he could deescalate the situation the Black Hebrews caused. He was wrong. Everyone stepped aside to let him pass, except the one kid, who “stood his ground,” smirking. Phillips didn’t go in there to deliberately confront anyone. The kid deliberately confronted Phillips.
I wish Phillips had turned to go a different direction. I bet the kid would have moved to block him that way, and then who the aggressor was would have been much more obvious.
@Dutchess_III I call BS. You don’t create “peace” by getting up in a minor’s face.
He did get frustrated, that much is obvious. And he should have changed directions instead of standing there. My point is, he didn’t go in to be confrontational. Tensions were already high when HE he was confronted and his temper rose.
Lawsuits are flying already. Well, just have to watch the news.
@Dutchess_III The kid did nothing wrong imo, more class than half those people in the back screaming hateful things.
“Be peaceful, be courteous, obey the law, respect everyone but, if someone puts his hand on you, send him to the cemetery.”
– Malcolm X
Malcom X and his hatred is no kind of philosophy to follow @KNOWITALL. I am surprised you quoted him.
I find it very interesting that the conservatives (and you aren’t the only one) see something completely different than what happened. I’m guessing your opinion is being swayed by the fact that the kid was wearing a MAGA hat, therefore you are on his side. I only call him “MAGA kid” because I don’t remember his name. I, personally, don’t think the fact that he was wearing the hat had anything to do with it. He would have been the same little asshole if he was bareheaded.
It’s not about being on anyone’s side. But certainly the fact that he was wearing the hat is why the media freaked out and distorted the story.
When I first saw this story, I was 100% against the kids. I didn’t set out to be on anyone’s side. The more evidence that’s come out, the more I’ve come to see how the media played everyone like a fiddle. The fact that the media is retracting and commentators like Philip deFranco and others are as well tells me that I’m not crazy for thinking the media’s initial story was bogus.
@Dutchess_III I like that quote, and agree with it.
I watched the long video, it wasn’t hard to see all the space around the boy in the end. I don’t think he was being an ahole at all, I think he stood his ground in a peaceable, polite manner.
Like @Demosthenes I think the hat is the only reason anything was even said. Now Mr. Phillips is going to the school to have a discussion.
And the kids were there for the March for Life, a pretty worthwhile cause imo.
It’s none of a damn 15 year old boy’s business what an adult women does when she has a decision of that magnitude to make, and who the hell put it in their head that it was? They’re just being brainwashed, as usual.
^^ I think getting into a discussion of abortion rights and beliefs is a topic that has been and is best left to other threads. It’s not really pertinent to the situation discussed here.
@Caravanfan Yep, good article. This I think is an especially good takeaway:
In this technology, stereotype is more salient than persons. In this technology, a single moment is more important than a life story. In this technology, a main activity is proving to the world that your type is morally superior to the other type.
This whole incident has become a Rorschach test.
That rorschach comment has been making rounds. It’s more of a litmus test.
Still, it’s very interesting how two people can watch the same video and come away with two completely different opinions of what they saw. I guess that’s why we have courts of law.
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One thing I’ve learned from all this is how both sides are hypocritical when it comes to kids in the political spotlight.
Look at how the Right slandered and attacked the Parkland teens, because they disagree with them politically. And look at the Left with the Covington teens.
Both sides say “they’re just kids!” when they agree with them. And both sides attack them when they disagree with the kids. Hypocrites all around.
^ Strange interpretation in service to both-sidesism.
@Demosthenes: “Look at how the Right slandered and attacked the Parkland teens, because they disagree with them politically. And look at the Left with the Covington teens.”
In what way did “the left” slander the Covington teens?
@Demosthenes: “Both sides say “they’re just kids!” when they agree with them.”
In what context was “they’re just kids” used in re: the Parkland teens. I have never heard this.
There doesn’t appear to be hypocrisy here at all. But more importantly, even if there were some, claiming hypocrisy is in no way relevant to the nature of what the Covington situation is about.
Well, the right did say, “They’re just kids,” about the Parkland survivors as a way of discrediting them. I am proud of them.
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“Just kids” sure, but people forget what the young are capable of. The wheels of change are always driven by the energy of youth.
Those Parkland survivors are making a dent in the gun control world, too. Go kids!
THESE KIDS DID NOTHING BUT STAND IN ONE SPOT!!!!!!!!!!!
^ One more exclamation point and I would have been convinced.
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@Sergeant They wore MAGA hats, were white Pro Lifers, you cant get more guilty in 2019 haha!
I agree with @KNOWITALL. The Covington dudes wore racist hats, are rich, white, privileged private school religious fundamentalist settler colonialists mocking a native american while in DC for the purpose of controlling my daughter’s uterus.
@chyna
“They were angels .”
Tilde understood. ;-)
@notnotnotnot Um well, the reason I come here is to learn how other people think, to get in your head. Being successful at understanding your thinking does not mean I agree. Try not to be too disappointed haha
PS Pretty sure everyone else here knows how I feel about equality. No race is inferior or superior. Now putting myself in this kids place, without being there bit seeing the whole video, is difficult. I respect my elders when possible and have some native dna. I’m not certain I would have done anything different than the kid. Backing down from someone in my face is not my style.
Someone posted some video of one kid yelling, “It’s not rape if it feels good!” That was at some different point in the day. I couldn’t be 100% sure it was one of the darling Covington boys or not so I didn’t pass it on.
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