Do you think Colin Kaepernick has paid enough of a penance, and deserves another shot at his NFL career?

He has nothing to apologize for.

Unfortunately, his protest coincided with deterioration of his skills. He had not had a good season in a couple years.

He would be good as a quarterback coach.

He was not that good of a player.

There are better and worse players, sure.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2017/sports/kaepernick-tracker/

So no patriotic fervor is involved in your decision/comments, just that he stinks as a player so he should move on and find something else to do with his life?

I’m with @zenvelo – he was showing honest emotion, and that is not to be apologized for. He has done nothing wrong.

The NFL should apologize, and it should have done so 3 years ago.

It would have died on its own if Trump hadn’t made it a national issue.

In my opinion no one should have been fired for taking a knee! A non-violent protest that disrupted nothing. Just trying to make a point that a player, or in the end it was multiple players, were troubled by some things that were going on in the country.

Just last week a friend of mine was complaining about a few people not standing for the pledge at a work meeting where I live. She found it very disrespectful. The people who didn’t stand also were not disrupting anything. Everyone who wanted to stand could. One of them might have an injury, one might be making a statement, one might have been distracted, or have a religious reason, or not be American and feel odd about it for some unknown reason.

We don’t always know why someone doesn’t participate.

I personally do stand, put my hand over my heart, and if it’s the pledge I say the pledge, but I don’t require it of others, and probably there will be a time I don’t do it for some reason or another.

Let’s compare taking a knee to Michael Vick’s dog fighting and abuse. Not even close to similar and Vick is welcomed back. There are just so many horrors overlooked, I don’t understand why Kolin is still black balled?

Any of you football fans, know why? Because he dared to protest? Because he dared to take it to court? Because he dares to continue to harass them?

How is he harassing them, @KNOWITALL ?

All he wants is to play football, and he has taken all sorts of shit (and not been hired) because 25 of old white guys didn’t think a black dude was showing respect.

It sounds to me like @KNOWITALL thinks he should be allowed back into the NFL. Am I misinterpreting?

@JLeslie I think three years is too much, yes, considering the people they have let back in.

@elbanditoroso He’s still asking to come back, like in the link in the OP. I’m not criticizing that at all, but seems like everyone’s turned their back on him for the most part.

And just to clarify, ya’ll know I’m a flag-flying patriot, and I understand he made a choice and has to deal with the repercussions. But this seems like it’s going way too far at this point.

@KNOWITALL I agree – it’s beyond silly for it to have gone on this long. If he can’t make it as a player, then let his abilities determine that.

Patriotism, as you know, includes the right to protest against grievances.

@elbanditoroso I sure do. Ya’ll don’t even know how far my disillusionment has spread.

I’m just not sure why no one has offered him a job? Not one of those coaches or owners has the nads to say ‘oh wth, let him play.’ ?

One owner who might have had the cajones to hire Kaepernick was the late Al Davis, of the Oakland Raiders.

He kept Jack “the assassin” Tatum on the roster, after Tatum paralyzed Darryl Stingley in 1978.

He was constantly defying the NFL commissioner (Peterless Rozelle) and the other owners. He might have hired CK even if his skills were doubtful, just to stick it to the commish.

Is this just what he deserves for protesting?
No

What are his other options at this point if the NFL continues to black ball him?
He could go play in the Canadian or European football leagues.
Or do anything else with his life.

How can the NFL gracefully remedy the situation and do you think they should?
(Lord knows many other players are still in the game after very poor behavior.)
Yes, the NFL is a very messed-up organization, and one of the aspects of that is the dysfunctional authoritarian behavior with so little integrity or actual moral standing.

What I would say they should do, is have someone with a good sense of what actually makes sense re-write their rules and stick to them. Actual serious violations (e.g. crimes) and necessary rules (e.g. cheating, gambling) should have consistent significant consequences, while acts of conscience during a ritual such as not complying with the flag/anthem ritual, should be recognized as not something they should try to mess with.

It seems to me that anyone who actually values American principles such as free expression and honesty, should have no desire to compel other people to conform during the flag ritual if they aren’t feeling it.

That so many Americans have tried to attack someone for kneeling during the flag ritual, greatly offends my sense of what this country is supposed to be about. I think that is the terrible and upsetting behavior, which I’d say should probably be protected against – employers should not be able to compel a facade of allegiance, even during the flag/anthem ritual.

Do you think this is all a political stunt?
I think the various objections to taking the knee are mostly reactionary and ill-considered, trying to compel conformity. The NFL I think is afraid that many of their viewers will be upset about the kneeling and are worried their profits will go down, and (foolishly) thought what they did made sense. And because of that dysfunctional authoritarian mindset I mentioned, they think the thing for them to do is exercise their authority and punish and so on.

They could have used their influence to just have the cameras and reporters and editors ignore the one kneeling guy. Or show it but just not pay whoever’s kneeling much attention.

But because they are over-obsessed with maintaining their perceived authority position, etc., they overreacted, and don’t want to “lose face”, or whatever. They are yet more examples of insecure authoritarians unwisely overstepping their authority over something.

Should he apologize and come back or stick to his guns?
Apologize? Wow. No, he should keep his integrity. I think his display of conviction and integrity did far more good than sports participation would do.

@Zaku What do you think his best move is? For him?

He was within his Constitutional rights to kneel in protest. He has nothing to apologize for.
I am not a fan of football, so I defer to those who are saying his skills were in decline ant that’s a bigger reason for him not playing.

@Dutchess_III The link I provided above (3rd post) shows other players better and worse, are still playing though. I’m no football expert either, but it seems pretty clear he’s still being black balled.

There are a couple teams that could use a quarterback, and a bunch more that could use an experience backup QB. So I think there are employment opportunities.

Two questions:

- after sitting out the last couple of season, how good will he be? How is his timing? (Hire him and find out!)

- if one of the owners hires him, how much shit will come down from the president? And the fans? And do the owners have the spine to endure the criticism?

@KNOWITALL I think his best move is up to him to choose. I think life choices are personal decisions up to the person, and I don’t know him well enough to make even an educated guess, except to say that he clearly would like to play football, and he’s not willing to betray his conscience, which is what I based my suggestions above on.

If I were him, I might consider escalating the public conversation, keeping calling it out for what it is, to try to shift public opinion to realize he is a patriot, and that it’s actually hypocritical and unpatriotic and pointless to try to force people into false displays of alignment in flag/anthem rituals, and that the NFL should not be so strict trying to deny people the right to behave as their conscience demands during anthem/flag rituals.

I don’t know what he actually wants to do though.

Well, that’s a demonstration of the power of a dictatorship then, @KNOWITALL. They have the ability to ruin your life on a whim.

@Zaku That may work with the Left but not with the Right. I tried talking to a military wife about it and she is fine with him never playing again for the disrespect.

He has a right to protest our government.

These arguments remind me of a meme I just read: “Respect the flag…of the government I’m stock piling arms against.”

@Dutchess Only when Dems are in office lol

I have a feeling if a good ol’ boy from Texas didn’t stand for the national anthem in protest to the caravans of people coming across our border illegally (to use Trump’s words) and Trump said, “our citizens are using their freedom of speech and right to protest in a calm and non violent manner while the Democrats are blocking streets, setting fires, and not letting conservative view points be heard on our college campuses,” the right wing would be all over Facebook saying, “I fought for this country and our rights as a free country, taking the knee is ok.” Lol. Everyone is totally manipulated and sucked in by peer pressure. Ok, not everyone, but a huge portion of the country.

I think there are some misconceptions from the OP. Kaepernick had a couple good seasons, but then his play really slacked off. He wasn’t the great QB he likes to pretend. So to start with, he might not be a desired addition to a team.
His case against the NFL was settled and there is a confidentiality agreement that neither side will discuss it, so we don’t know the details.
So the situation now is that (a) he was a so-so QB when he was playing, (b) he hasn’t played for several years, having last played in 2016. He wasn’t the starting QB for that season and only came in part way through the season where he led his team to a 1 win/10 loss record for his efforts. (c) He has a record of disobeying league rules for he entire time he played. (d) he is 31 years old which isn’t over the hill, but is getting a little long in the tooth for the NFL.
Given all that, he might find a team willing to take a chance on him, but he is an unknown because of his age, his lack of play for several years, and his aversion to following the rules. He could easily be a disruption on and off the field which might not be something a team is looking for.

Wonder what happened to his lucrative career with Nike?

@seawulf I posted a link that puts him on the lower end, so I get that.

But we want to ruin his life, like they did Roseanne? Or tried to do to Kavanaugh? I dont think its right. You’d think one team would give him one chance at least!

Mind you, I dont respect his choice to kneel, never said that.

He’s too hot to touch. Controversy is one thing, but anyone who dared to pick him up would be doomed to the impossible task of defending the choice while enduring the open and fierce destruction of their bottom line economic viability.

@stanley Its hard to believe he’s still that hot. I’m no Democrat and love my country, I think he deserves another chance. Although if he still has an agenda other than football, which may or may not be the case, it makes sense. The NFL ban by some didnt last long.

A public relations catastrophe awaits any team daring to hire him. He can kiss his professional football career goodbye. Though I’m convinced he will do alright financially elsewhere. There are those of means who will not allow such courage to stand unacknowledged.

@stanleybmanly “There are those of means who will not allow such courage to stand unacknowledged.”

Exactly my thoughts. Where are they right now?

So…you also think that taking a knee was a courageous thing to do @KNOWITALL?

@Dutchess_III Of course I do. He risked his entire career (maybe even his life) for something he believes strongly about, not many people have that kind of dedication to foment change.

This article a friend of mine just posted on Facebook I think is relevant to this Q.

https://www.azcentral.com/story/opinion/op-ed/2019/08/17/cancel-culture-spreading-left-right-perpetually-offended/2009132001/

@JLeslie Good article.

What’s your takeaway from that, if I may ask?

@KNOWITALL I’ve said all along that some of the attacks on humor have been too extreme. I also feel there is constant twisting on the intent of statements people make and actions they take. The blackface is a perfect example.

I have commented on some Q’s that I don’t think darkening one’s skin to look like a character on TV is necessarily racist, but in this climate people need to be aware and respect it isn’t acceptable right now.

I have given an example of a little girl (white girl) in Toddlers in Tiarras who for her talent was mimicking Beyonce. She was dressed up like Beyoncé and lip-syncing and dancing. The little girl kept asking her mom for more spray tan to be darker like Beyoncé. How could anyone call this girl racist? She loved Beyoncé and wanted to be just like her. She has no concept of “black face” being offensive. I guess the argument is she could just as well done the performance without her fake tan.

Certainly, blackface as it was done in the past was racist and awful. It was demeaning and disrespectful. Present day if it’s done to make fun of or demean African Americans it still is racist to me.

I’ve also defended Roseanne Barr. I don’t think she necessarily should have been fired, but I do think her Nazi baker was disgraceful! She did seem to lose her ability to filter. The new show wasn’t good anyway, but that’s beside the point.

I can’t forget that Barr did a tremendous amount for civil rights for all minorities. She went up against the network to discuss gay fights, racism, gender, sex, all sorts of topics. She is one of the leaders for equal rights teaching the average American who were both liberals and conservatives politically. To completely erase what she contributed is unfair and wrong.

@JLeslie I agree. And as for me, even with Kathy Griffin, there are allowances that used to be made for comedy, but society now is to the point, that isn’t even allowed.

I just read about a black guy who wore a MAGA hat in the airport in Cali, and said he was getting all kinds of looks but no one said a word, he thought it was funny.

Everything is so convoluted right now, sad.

(What is sad is that people are actually mimicking trump’s convoluted, immature speech patterns.)

@KNOWITALL Actually, Kathy Griffin I took real issue with. I consider that a threat to the president, which is against the law. It isn’t different than people in protest crowds when Obama was elected holding up posters of nooses. Also, when Madonna said something about blowing up the White House. unacceptable. All of those situation I wouldn’t have blinked if they had been arrested. Not that I am looking to throw them in jail, but all those situations are not simply free speech. It also, is not meant to be funny, because all of those people really were disgusted he was president. whichever he we are talking about.

@JLeslie I’m used to comedy being a free for all, its optional.
I dont really take those seriously, maybe I should.

Tbh, never crossed my mind that Kathy was serious, she never is.

Roseanne really got a raw deal, she’s a pretty amazing person. Very liberal in many ways.

@KNOWITALL I don’t think Kathy was seriously threatening the president, but I just find it in bad taste and irresponsible. The only reason we don’t take it seriously is because she is famous, or because she is a comedian. Does that make it ok? I don’t know the answer to that. For me I don’t like anything that is violent or threatening.

Nothing is as fickle and volatile as celebrity which always rests on the emotional manipulation of those at the altar. Those relying on such adoration for their living should invest every dime in more reliable revenue generating prospects, because whether they know it or not “the wolf is always at the door.”

@JLeslie Quite frankly, she’s bad taste personified. Like a female Andrew Dice Clay. Time and place for all kinds I suppose.

But in the end, we are each responsible for the energy we put in the collective, true enough.