Was withdrawing from Syria the right decision?

I have opinions but I defer to General Mattis and several other national security experts that it’s a bad idea. Imo, trump made the decision to help himself personally for reasons not yet fully known.

I have a guess as to why he did it. That’s what Putin wants. And what Putin wants can’t be good for the US in the long run.

trump’s argument that it is to end endless wars is thin and even suspicious coming from him. He makes a seemingly complicated thing ever sound so simple because he on his own couldn’t explain a complicated issue to the American people and he knows his simple minded approach works to most voters who have other more pressing personal concerns than thinking about the likes of Putin and Erdogan.

trump knows this. So when he says the US is being cheated spending more money than the EU he is effectively manipulating his voters to stop thinking about anything else but themselves.

We stabbed our allies who helped us control ISIS in the back. It is shameful and disgusting. It hurts me to be part of this.

^^Democrats should do what Republicans would if trump was a Democrat. Open an investigation on what exactly made trump issue such a hasty order with its timing highly suspicious.

He might be impeached so he needed to do the bidding of Putin and Erdogan while he still can?

To me it’s obvious trump is already paving the way to enrich his personal business after he leaves the WH. Look forward for several trump hotels all over Turkey.

It seems to me none of us have all the facts that go along with security clearances, so guessing is the best we can do.

Obama said no new boots on the ground, both parties have wanted out. We have stayed in an endless war that will never be a good time to leave.

My opinion is that this is a re-election play and nothing will change. The poor Kurds have never had much of a chance, sad but true.

No and yes it will cause the insurgence of ISIS as the prisoners held there escaped .

Who do you think would be there prime target now?

It is the innocent children growing in that environment that suffer the most and is the UN helping?
I last heard that there was 60,000 refugees fleeing Syria ..to where?

IS any country helping them?

I agree with @mazingerz88. “I defer to General Mattis and several other national security experts that it’s a bad idea.”
What do the facts that go with security clearances have to do with pulling out of the war against ISIS @KNOWITALL? Besides, under the trump regime, the facts don’t matter.

Turkey’s Invasion Of Syria Worsens A Humanitarian Crisis.

@Dutchess_III

Thank you for updating the bad situation that is made worse according to that report.

Pray for them all..especially the innocent.

His reasoning of being involved in an endless war is bs.

https://www.commondreams.org/news/2019/10/11/less-24-hours-after-saying-time-bring-em-home-trump-orders-1800-us-troops-saudi

No, it wasn’t the right decision. The Kurds fought a long and difficult battle against Islamic State on our behalf losing around 11,000 men while US losses were just 6. And now the war is over we throw them to the wolves. How can that be fair? What kind of country is the United States becoming? Can anyone trust us again?

Right @flutherother ? I am so ashamed of my country at this point. I thought we were making some headway when we elected a black man to lead us….but I guess that freaked somebody out so bad they gave us…..the orange, disgusting, fat, stupid pussy grabber. But at least he’s whiteish orange.

Remember that the Kurds were not fighting for us, they were fighting for themselves. Trump has said from the beginning that he wanted to end these wars. He has said he didn’t want to be the world’s police force. The Kurds and the Turks have been fighting each other forever. Given those circumstances, how long should we have stayed in Syria? Frankly I could go either way on this one. I can see reasons to stay and reasons to go. What I really find surprising is that Democrats are arguing for longer wars. I guess it’s not about facts but rather hatred of Trump.

@Jaxk No, as I stated above, it’s about not stabbing allies in the back. You can twist the facts as you wish but that’s what Trump has now done. And I’m out.

We were both fighting ISIS for our own reasons. That’s why we were “allies.”

Trump is just saying whatever somebody promised him money to say. He does not have a single, original thought of his own. He doesn’t have the intelligence or the creativity to have thoughts of his own beyond grabbing women and sexually molesting them.

@Jaxk We were not in an endless war. The war against Islamic State was won. We had a token force along a border that was peaceful. No one is arguing for longer wars, but that’s what we, or rather the Kurds, are now getting.

” We were not in an endless war. The war against Islamic State was won.”
So why is it a bad idea to bring the Troops home. You seem to be advocating a perpetual police force where ever conflicts could arise.

^^The price of existing with the rest of the world and fighting evil is to police the world smartly. Go when needed and disengage when it’s time.

Using the term “perpetual policing” is shallow and cynical. It works for simple minded Americans but that shouldn’t be the case.

The issue here is America right now has a corrupt psycho in the WH.

@Jaxk Trump ordered 1800 troops to Saudi Arabia the day after he said he wants to bring troops home out of the Middle East. He’s a liar and a hypocrite.

@Stache – Different issues. We have a strategic interest Saudi Arabia, we don’t in Syria.

The die was cast with the invasion of Iraq. THAT is the gift that keeps on giving. Our decision to disrupt the power balance in the region and the resulting vacuum with the elimination of Saddam and Khadaffi has given rise to all of it—Isis, refugees, terrorism —all of it! The ridiculous illusion of controlling the region’s oil through establishment of democratic principles was so unforgivably preposterous that there is no excuse for our mistakes beyond the fact that we are a country truly ignorant of the realities of the region and the peoples inhabiting it.

The only strategic interest we have with Saudi Arabia is financing Trump’s business interest. Ant Trump gave Erdogan the go ahead to invade Syria. Why didn’t he say, “ we’re leaving, but Turkey has to stay in its border?

I have mixed feelings on this issue. On one hand, we had “allies” that we just walked out on. That sends a really bad message, especially when someone else has already said they will attack our allies if we leave. On the other hand, we didn’t really have that many soldiers in that area to pull out. I know that in January, we had 2000 and Trump started to pull them out. I have heard we were down to 50 or so. So if us pulling so few troops in this region out causes this much upheaval, there is something much deeper going on. Additionally, I didn’t like us going into that region to start with. I felt Bush II going into Iraq was wrong and I felt Obama going into Syria was wrong. In both these cases, the end game was vague. We had a plan to go in ostensibly to “stabilize” the region with no clear picture of what that meant. Dates for withdrawal came and went. At some point we have to stop the insanity. I pretty much feel the same about having troops in Poland, Afghanistan, Germany, or any of the 74 countries we maintain a military presence.
So I guess my feeling is that withdrawing from Syria was the right decision, but I think it was handled extremely poorly.

It is a grave strategic blunder. If nothing else, it amounts to de facto permission for the Turks to slaughter our erstwhile allies who did our fighting where Trump dared not venture and thus liquidate his political viability toward reelection. What the fool has done effectively is cede control and the fate of the region to Russia and Iran, which was pretty much the inevitable result of the decision to invade Iraq. But the consequences go beyond the embarrassing distinction that ours is once again a President without a shred of honor; the assured upcoming volatility in oil prices combined with the fool’s trade wars already hobbling the world economy spells world wide recession as a defining reality of the 2020 election. But then again, it appears that a major economic downturn will be the least of the problems confronting Russia’s “useful idiot”. The Congress and the courts are well on the road to rendering the man’s life unbearable. It is quickly growing apparent to even the most recalcitrant among us just how catastrophic a mistake we have on our hands.

The Kurds were fighting for a “Kurdistan.” Thayer weren’t fighting for the US. That’s admirable, but served no interest in the US. I see little, to reason for us to back them. I know that sounds cold, but it isn’t worth our young men dying over. Period…
If we helped them form their own caliphate, what would it have really accomplished?

The Kurds, are a formidable opponent. If they want to take advantage of a war in Syria, that’s fine. Realistically, we have seen what happens when the US gets involved in this region. Nothing good.

Let them, or European countries, deal with it. The US, has no business there, and we were risking an unintentional war with Russia. We don’t need that.

I understand that it seems bad. And yes, the Kurds have little chance, without US support. Turkey, has already hit them hard. But that’s because they want a buffer zone, between them, and the Syrian conflict.
I get that…

Trump, is a loser. But I support him getting the US out. What were we supposed to do, stay there for 30 years? Do you want your son, to die there?

You’re right. He had NO good choices. But THIS choice is IMMEDIATELY catastrophic, with clear consequences assuring the fool’s certain election year destruction. But as stated, he would be fortunate INDEED if it were merely his policies in the region which eliminate his chances at a second term!

^Trump sucks. But he’s not a war mongering fool. If Trump wanted to, he could have us in several wars. Give him something… He could have nuked North Korea, and started a war with Iran . He could have us still on Syria, and could have us at war with Russia, and China. But. He hasn’t. He’s a fuck up. But he isn’t getting us further involved with lots of foreign wars. Give him that….

@stanley Do you believe Trump voters care more about the Kurds-Middle East than Americans coming home?

No. But Americans WILL care about six dollar a gallon gasoline in the midst of a galloping recession!

@MrGrimm888 Agreed. Which is why I’m wondering how much of this is political and how much is not. What happened to “no blood for oil” Democrats? Now all of a sudden they want troops involved in Middle Eastern conflicts? Is it just because it’s Trump? (And the reverse: how many support this just because they support all of Trump’s decisions—do they also support his decision to send more troops to Saudi Arabia?) I don’t think it’s all partisan and political, but sometimes it seems a bit inconsistent. It’s strange to see liberals agreeing with neocons.

If being a war monger made him money somehow, he’d do it. I’m sure putin paid him a few million to pull out.

@KNOWITALL do you believe the Kurds-Middle Eastern people’s lives do not have as much value as American lives? Don’t forget, Jesus was one of them.

The Americans were over there the doing what they were paid to do. They all volunteered when they joined up.

@MrGrimm888 wasn’t there assured doom predictions at one point that Trump was going to jump into a war with N. Korea, Iran, and China?

Sometimes you might argue for intervention in other situations you might argue against but once you are involved you should consider carefully before disengaging. There was no pressing need to bring these troops back home. The United States has forces stationed all over the planet, why bring these few soldiers back?

The president seems to have inadvertently given Turkey the green light to move into northern Syria without giving thought to the consequences. So far it doesn’t look like a “smart” move. It certainly wasn’t an honourable one.

Also, @KNOWITALL, what happened to your prolife stance? Would your thinking be swayed by the thought that many of the casualties will be pregnant women?

He made money off of it somehow @flutherother. He’s got to be the easiest politician to bribe in the entire history of the United States.

@flutherother I agree. However, our problem in the USA is that for the past several decades, we have gotten involved in situations and had no clear end point to our involvement. We sort of go in and don’t know what “done” looks like. That is where this went wrong. When we got involved with Syria, we didn’t set an end point.

@Demosthenes . I honestly don’t know WTF, is going on with America anymore. We’re a dumpster fire.

@seawulf575 . Yes. The way Trump was talking, I thought he would unleash the military, on several occasions. However, I have already given Trump credit for not doing this. So far. I concede, that I was apparently wrong about this subject. And I am VERY happy that I was. I don’t like war. I thought the Iraqi war, was pathetic. The US killed a LOT of people. I remember one particular incident, where the Iraqi army was retreating, in a large convoy. We slaughtered them all. Our A-10s, and attack helicopters, made short work of all those people. It was more like shooting fish in a barrel, than a battle. The American military, is formidable, and often they are deployed against far inferior opponents. I am proud of Trump, for not using our military, the way he uses his mouth… And, whether it’s ethical, or not, I’m glad he pulled us out of Syria. I’m truly sorry for the Kurdish forces. But that’s life in the ME. Ethnic groups, are systematically attacked, all the time. It seems like that will be the case, for the future, as it has been for thousands of years. I don’t think Trump expected Turkey, to do what they did. His advisors, probably warned him.about it, but he didn’t remove our forces, because he wanted the Kurds wiped out…

As with many situations, in life, there is no “right” decision to make. This is one of those situations.

I know this isn’t a fair question, but if America was involved in a civil war, would the Kurds be trying to send help to us? Hell no… They’ll have to make due, with the scenario, as best they can. Good luck, to them. They’ll need it…

@MrGrimm888 You are far more realistic than many. And it certainly wasn’t just you or even mainly you that swore up and down we would be in nuclear war by now. I agree with you that the Iraq war was wrong on just about every level. We should not have been there unless it was to support a UN action.
This action going on in the ME is just a continuation of all the strife that has existed for thousands of years. I think there is a lot going on that we are not privy to. But in the end, Trump is pulling our forces out of the area. This is an action that is, in my view, long overdue. For those that feel bad about us leaving the Kurds, I get it. But there will always be some group that we have to “support”...there will never be a good time to leave. So I guess the question each of us has to ask is: what should our role really be?

Y’all realize the US is a major target for ISIS. We weren’t over there for absolutely no reason.

^Our role is simple. Keep ourselves out of the region. None of the conflicts, will put us in a good light, and we clearly don’t understand their cultures. We just make things worse, when we get involved. There is no strategy, that will please everyone, and in the mean time, we are killing people for no reason, and fucking up our own. If we could get off of fossil fuel, we would have NO interests in the area. And that would help the US, and the entire world.

The ME people, are straight different from us. We cannot simply install democracies, and overthrow leadership there. That has proven to be a disaster.

The fact that we don’t want to pay $6/gallon for gas, is a PATHETIC excuse, for the US’s actions there. We have to let those people handle their own business. Whether we agree with what happens, or not…

Unfortunately for “those people”, anyone anywhere living on top of ANYTHING determining the possibility of $6 a gallon gasoline will not be allowed so naive an option as “their own business”. For the United States, this was unwritten, yet universally recognized gospel. It would be interesting to speculate on the wasted trillions of dollars, death, suffering and disruption we fomented and the staggering tar baby we have conjured—to think that all of it might have been avoided had the fracking revolution arrived here a mere 10 years earlier. Too bad!

^The US, could affect the price of gas. Saudi Arabia, just stops production, to increase the price. If we sanctioned them, the way we sanctioned Iran, for driving up prices, we would be ok. But we don’t. The US, and other countries, have the power to effect the prices of oil. But they don’t. They kiss OPEC countries asses, and the consumers pay the price. The US itself, could get out of this situation, by going full steam into alternative fuels. But nope. Too much money to be made, by a very small part of the population, that basically runs the country. And THAT doesn’t matter if the D’s, or the R’s, are in power….

You could solve the problem for yourself by buying an electric car. The price of gas would no longer be an issue.

It all comes down to our reliance on fossil fuels. No way does trump want to find alternate power source. Too much money in fossil fuels for him.

The kurds must simply be sacrificed for the logistical necessity of Turkey as our more or less assured reliable access to the region. WE may no longer require the region’s oil, but that $6 and up price at the pump spells certain near term disaster for the political ambitions of any and all exposed. It would also immediately intensify the accelerating abandonment of fossil fuels, and provide the stiff whip to accelerate the acquisition of alternative power options. There are powerful interests world wide opposed to such notions, including our gutter mannered criminal nitwit.

Couldn’t Trump just invest heavily in alternative energy sources, and then push them hard? Or is that a conflict of interest?