How would you feel if it seemed your holiday traditions were set by the wayside?

I would understand it’s my children’s turn to make, potentially, new traditions.

I don’t mind at all because I am happy to be celebrating. I spent years doing all of it, now I am delighted that others do it and include me. Fun to try new stuff.
Being absolutely wedded to tradition causes more problems than it solves.

I think its a shame, but from what you’ve said, its DIL’s way or the highway. Sometimes we have to bend to make it work.

Are you allowed to make it in advance and give the babies a gift for later?
Their canned stuff sounds awful btw, who does that when you have grammys stuffing?!

Well she just doesn’t have most well developed social skills @KNOWITALL. She’s insecure so she has to take that my “way or the highway” attitude to forestall disagreement or being told she’s wrong.

@Rebbel, I appreciate that. I’m not trying to stop them from creating their own traditions. But they aren’t mutually exclusive, are they? I mean Gramma’s stuffing or Stouffer’s from a box? Gramma’s bread or generic frozen store bought bread dough? How put out is she by me bringing 2 out of 10 items and why?

But it’s her call. I’m certainly not going to argue. My son knows me and knows how I feel.

@Dutchess Bringing food at the holidays is normal though, thats an odd boundary for her to have. Does your son know why?

As I said she has some emotional issues stemming from her whacked out upbringing. That’s why she doesn’t “get” normal social norms.
I was ready beat the shit out of her mother at the 2017 Thanksgiving. She was physically abusing Cooper who was just 2.
I waited a couple of days to cool down, then told my DIL that if she ever did that again I’d call the police and file charges and I meant it. Her mother is the weirdest person on the planet.

I can understand why you’re disappointed, but I agree with @rebbel that it’s now time for the son and DIL to make their own traditions. Plus, as she gets more comfortable with hosting and having people over, she may loosen up the restrictions. I say, be patient and enjoy the day.

As for me…I’d be fucking thrilled if our holiday traditions would change, particularly regarding who’s hosting.

23 years ago we announced that we would host all the holidays because my wife is an excellent cook who loves to entertain. I was fine with it for the first ten years or so because I assumed that someone else would eventually pick up the ball and host. A niece, a nephew, a cousin, an aunt, an uncle — SOMEBODY!!!

Nope. Not a single person. Do you know why? Because my wife is an excellent cook who loves to entertain — and they, THEY, THEY, are not and do not.

Fuckers.

S’okay, I’ll rest when I’m dead.

“Plus, as she gets more comfortable with hosting and having people over, she may loosen up the restrictions.”

She really is starting to loosen up to the point she’s starting to make jokes….and that’s unprecdented!!!
The wind kicked up a couple of hours ago and it is wicked. 40 to 50 mph gusts.
Four year old Copper lost his cat pillow and they’ve been looking high and low for it.
My DIL texted asking if I’d seen it Sunday when we visited.
I said I hadn’t then said “Garage? Outside? But if it’s outside he’s in Nebraska by now!”
She says “IKR? We noticed your pontoon boat in the back is gone.”
I yelled back “SHUT UP!!!!kjikjgtj!”

That would been unheard of 2 years ago, using her imagination to make up a joke. It’s really wonderful so I certainly wouldn’t endanger her progress over stuffing.

I’m calling dibs on TG next year.

Invite the kids over sometime during the Thanksgiving weekend and make the beer bread. Do a small turkey with stuffing for you and your husband.

We’re gonna do a Cornish game hen for us on Saturday with ALL the fixens.
There will be other times through the year for bread.

It’s difficult dealing with her because you never know what’s going to trip her trigger. 2 years ago we almost got banned for life because I cracked a sun flower seed and gave the meat to Cooper.

No he’s not allergic in fact, the heat of that battle she said she gives him whole sunflower seeds and he eats them, shell and all.
Why did she flip out? No clue.
She had started a part time job and the fall out from that freak out was they lost the most highly trained, experienced babysitter who worked for free AND came to their house. And did dishes. And windows.
She chose to die on that hill but didn’t think it through very well.

I bet the grandkids will raise hell about the missing bread this year! You will just have to make bread on other occasions when you have them. See to it that they all have the recipe. Those kids will remember your bread. Don’t worry.

I find a reason to make bread throughout the year! I know they won’t forget.
It was such a sterile amputation of my involvement in Thanksgiving….I guess I just don’t understand.
As @KNOWITALL said, it’s traditional for people to bring different dishes….I guess I have to chalk it up to her odd upbringing.

I’d buy a turkey and do it the week or two weeks after Thanksgiving, and do it with all that you want and make, and invite everyone over, if they want to come.

Also, do you get to have Christmas at your house? If so, you can look at it like your son does Thanksgiving, and he does it his way, and you do Christmas, and you do it your way.

The one hosting has the right of doing things how they want to do them. No matter how put out that may make someone else feel.

I know that @Darth_Algar. And I concede.

It’s too convoluted @jca2. Over the last 17 years we almost always went to Rick’s dad for Christmas. I have no Christmas tradition, really.
And it isn’t my son doing his this. It’s his wife.

My holiday traditions were set by the wayside a long time ago. Currently thinking about how to re-invent a new tradition for the winter season.

You just need one tradition.

Make the mini loaves, wrap them in plastic wrap, and then gift wrap. Make tags for them to everybody who likes them. Wrap something else of similar asize for son and DIL. Hand them out as you are leaving, or if others leave before you, give those out then.

Maybe this year she plans to try making some things from scratch, and wants it to be liked without being compared to your tried and true recipes.

Myself, i have had to make adjustments to my various traditions down through the years. When my daughter was young, she declared she wasn’t wild about turkey, and could we plan something else. We had salmon one year, and buffet the next. She then decided she wasn’t wild about the whole big meal idea. I started getting sliced turkey to make sandwiches for me, and let her figure out her own meal. I finally gave up on celebrating aany holidays. Now I’m completely alone, and holidays are just another day.

Enjoy family. That’s the best tradition.

I agree @Patty_Melt. Family is the most important thing.
Salmon??

She had recently learned she loved baked salmon. I got a great deal so close to Thanksgiving when everyone else was buying turkey.
It was a full one side steak, abut four pounds. It was about ten dollars! She stuffed herself, but traditions to her are like reruns.

I’d be disappointed if I were you, but I’d do what she asks.

I’d make the bread for some other occasion or holiday so it continues to be a special thing to do with you, or if you make it in advance it will still be the special bread you make even if it’s just a random day you decided to make it.

I was also going to suggest lunch or dinner over the weekend with you, and you can make the bread. I’d have a ham, or some other roast, because I’d be turkeyed out, but you mention the stuffing too, so maybe that specifically goes with turkey?

Or, make the bread and stuffing on a totally different holiday. Start a new tradition.

If you haven’t done it yet, I think you should put together a small recipe book for your family. You can ask others to contribute recipes, or just do your own. Give it to the relatives so when you’re gone the family still has the recipes. One of the things I wanted when my grandmother died was her recipes for some of the foods she made. I have some of them, I wish I had more.

Great idea about the recipe book, @JLeslie. I was considering doing this a few years ago, with my family’s recipes. Making some copies of their hand printed recipe cards, typing up most of the recipes, adding photos and personal anecdotes and memories, and having it printed at one of the printing online places, like Shutterfly or Costco.com or whatever. I never did it but maybe one day.

I have some of my grandmother’s recipes and we have her recipe box, which is priceless. There’s one recipe that I wish I had, for an apple cake. It was very moist, almost like a pudding that you can cut. I looked in her recipe box and it’s not there, not that I could see. A friend made a “one bowl apple cake” and gave me some recently, and it was very similar to my grandmother’s cake. Not too sweet, and just very moist. I got the recipe from my friend. Of all the apple cakes I have had, this one was the closest to my grandmother’s.

If you can save your family from having to search or wish they had your recipes, that would be great, Dutch.

What are you doing for Christmas? Is it your house or their house or somewhere else? Maybe you can do a New Year’s Day dinner, if Christmas is not going to be at your house. Or a New Year’s Day brunch.

Another idea with the bread is you can invite the kids over for a day of fun with Grandma, and you can have them help you make the bread. Then you can package it all up like little gifts and they can give it to family for Christmas. You can sell this idea of “Day with Grandma” by making sure the parents know that this is time they can use to decorate or shop for presents or whatever.

^^Love that idea.

As I said, Thanksgiving is not the only day of the year I make bread. I make it at random times. through out the year so there will be other opportunities. But this is Thanksgiving! In my world, everyone is welcome to contribute, especially the older people who have recipes no one else has. “Gramma’s cherry cobbler!” or whatever.

I shy away from making bread and sending it home. Even if it’s months later, she’s real quick to spot an insult or chastisement, even where there is none. Have to walk on egg shells around her. :(

But they’re here very often through the year. We make banana bread and all kinds of stuff.

My cousin posted her mother’s stuffing recipe. It was in a hand written letter from 1975. I’m going to ask if I can share it.

I’m just curious, does your DIL make bread also?

I ask because I like my green been casserole and my cranberry mold, and I usually don’t enjoy other people’s recipe fir those things, so I prefer to make it. If I’m going to someone else’s house, then I’m absolutely fine with eating whatever they serve, but at my own house if I’m hosting I’d probably prefer to make those two things. Although, if my MIL wanted to bring her version that has been passed down through the family I don’t think I would say no, I’d probably just go along

We’ve stopped serving bread at Thanksgiving. There is so much food, we don’t find room for a filler like bread. I love homemade bread though.

No. She buys the frozen dough and makes clover leaf rolls. She lets them rise, then bakes them. It’s good bread and makes the house smell good. But half of what my bread making is all about is the kids helping me. (See the pics in the details.)

OMG. Her mother will be there. This will be the first time we’ve been in the same room since the 2017 issue with Cooper. I told Rick that if she puts her hands on one of the kids I WILL react. Not necessarily like an asshole, but I won’t let it ride like I did.

@Dutchess_III I understand the bread making ritual is part of it, but I guess your DIL doesn’t understand that, or she doesn’t care. I think the ritual is very nice, and I completely understand why it bothers you that you are being asked to forgo making the bread.

Maybe she just wants control over the day. If her parents are coming maybe it’s more pressure for her.

I hope making the bread a different day will help make up for it for you. So much pressure on one specific day of the year is hard for a lot of families as children grow up and start to get married.

If I were you I would have hoped my DIL would have wanted to learn how to do the bread with me to be able to keep the tradition going.

She doesn’t understand. As I said, she has no social graces. She has a lot of emotional issues.

Also, I make bread at different times of the year. Probably 8 times a year. Sometimes I have kids with me, sometimes not.
No, it won’t make it up to me. Nor would making my stuffing on the 4th of July make up for the loss of that Thanksgiving tradition.

I’m just going to have to deal with the disappointment.

Here is that FB post my cousin posted. Timing was perfect. No, we were not in cahoots! I don’t think I’ve ever even chatted with her, or talked to her IRL.

@Dutchess_III: You can hold on to that anger and resentment about it, which you are entitled to do but it won’t help you personally and it won’t help your relationship with your DIL or your son. Or you can choose to deal with it another way, like making those things another time, and move on with your feelings.

Another thing you can do is host Thanksgiving next year. You can say to them today “next year, my house. It’s a lot for you to do this every year, DIL. I insist.” And see what happens.

Salmon dip is ready!

I’m not angry or resentful, just very, very disappointed. I’ll get over it. She’s done far worse, and I got over it for the sake of my relationship with my son and grandkids.

♥♥♥♥♥ ♥♥♥♥♥ ♥♥♥♥♥ ♥♥♥♥♥ Happy Thanksgiving y’all! ♥♥♥♥♥ ♥♥♥♥♥ ♥♥♥♥♥ ♥♥♥♥♥ ♥♥♥♥♥ ♥♥♥♥♥

BTW @jca2 and @JLeslie , I know my post was really long, so I don’t blame people for not reading it, and I’m patiently answering questions that were answered in the details. I posted This is Thanksgiving 2007. Seven of the grandkids hadn’t even shown up yet! I simply don’t have the room for a full fledged Thanksgiving for the whole family. As I said in the details, my son and his wife got a hell of a deal on a foreclosed house. I bet it’s all of 3000 sq feet, if you include the finished basement.
Now, if next year it appears we’ll only be getting together with Chris and his family, we can easily make room. But I won’t know if that’s the case until very close to the time.

It’s the job of the younger generations to replace the traditions of the older generations. So many things in my life has been changed in my lifetime that I’ve learned to adapt. I don’t have to appreciate it in order to accept the new ways!!!

How about we wait until I’m incapacitated or dead to replace my traditions? It’s not just about me, you know. It’s about my son, too, and my daughters, when we can all gather at the same time. They want the familiarity of Thanksgivings past.

I think a cook book is a pretty cool idea, though.

Does anyone want the recipe for my Top Secret stuffing?

“It’s the job of the younger generations to replace the traditions of the older generations.”

@LadyMarissa: Could you please pass this along to the my nieces, nephews, and daughter?

Poor @cookieman!

@Dutchess_III That may not be for another 30 years and your children will not have had the chance to create their own traditions.

@Dutchess_III: Ahh, it’s okay. I complain, but it’s better than being alone on the holidays.

Now excuse me while I go baste my 30lb. bird.

I would argue that part of the job of the younger generation is to carry on the traditions of the older generation, or at least allow the older generation to still do some of their traditions while they are still with us.

The DIL might have her limitations and reasons. As the OP said she just needs to live with the disappointment regarding Thanksgiving, but I don’t accept the idea that the younger generation completely replaces traditions with their own. They can if they want, but what a shame to lose all the rituals like that. Unless, it was some sort of horrific experience. Just celebrating holidays in any way is carrying on a tradition.

I worked with a woman in Tennessee who complained to me that she didn’t know where her people were from (she was African American) or know any of the traditions or rituals of her ancestors that she could hand down to her children. It saddened her, she felt robbed of that connection. I told she can start her own traditions for her family.

Anyway, I just find it interesting how one person might mourn for a lack of traditions, and another has not affinity for these sort of rituals.

It was a very good day. Food was vastly improved from last year.
Her Mom and dad came. Her dad and I taught the kids to play poker.
Her Mom stayed to herself. The kids, except 12 year old Jayden, avoided her so there was no bloodshed.
Overall a very, very good day!

Great!

The food was well improved over last year. The gravy was still from a foil pouch, but at least it was chicken gravy! Not Rick’s to-die-for rich gravy, but acceptable.
The stuffing was again from a box. When we got in the car to go home Rick said, “I miss your stuffing!”
I said, “I miss your gravy!”
It was fine. Just not the rich, unique tastes I’ve come to adore once a year.
Oh and the bread was, of course, the frozen little balls of dough that she thaws and lets rise. She put two to a cup in a cupcake pan. The result was…“Butt Rolls”! LOLL!! I wonder which of the kids came up with that! My son is included in that list.

This morning Cato decided that noon was quite long enough for us to still be sleeping…..

Getting ready to head over to my son’s to build a ginger bread house.

SUCCESS!!! My DIL hates salmon. While working in food services at the retirement home, she dreaded making salmon patties.
Some how she ended up sampling my salmon dip…and you couldn’t keep her out of it after that! Then 8 year old Onna tried it….and you couldn’t keep HER out of it! My DIL texted me today that it was ALL gone. Even 6 year old Zoey ate some.

I sent her the recipe. :)

I kinda have tears in my eyes and I don’t know why. At least one tradition (that is impossible to F up) has made it onward.

My mom got the recipe from a friend of hers in the late 60s.

@Dutchess_III I’m really happy for you. I think I can guess why you teared up: It’s incredibly painful to feel redundant, even if you know you aren’t. Maybe the salmon dip took some of that sting away.

A little.

I keep reminding myself that these are huge steps for his wife. HUGE. She actually made another joke yesterday. Rick was going to bring all cracker home, but I said, “Just pull one sleeve and leave the rest.”
Jenna reached over and started pulling on Rick’s sleeve and Chris was pulling on Jenna’s sleeve. :D :D :D