Would a shift in responsibility reduce unwanted pregnancy?

If a child is born, the man is responsible financially, so I don’t see what you’re saying.

@jca2 Doesn’t that incentivize the man to pressure the woman to have an abortion? Also, I think child support is woefully underpaid, still shifting the burden largely to the woman and to a lesser extent society.

I’m also saying to shift the responsibility to before the fact instead of after the fact.

Thoughts of responsibility in the heat of the moment???
NAH!

It would be vastly more effective to just forcibly sterilise all males at birth, and if they want to have children later in life, extract the sperm cells from the testicles, and perform a fertilisation in the lab.

@jca2 “If a child is born, the man is responsible financially”

In theory. The reality is often much different.

@Darth_Algar: I totally understand that.

In the “old days” a man could deny he was the father. Now with DNA there’s no denying.

I understand that it may be a court fight and constantly bringing the father to court for higher payments, and that dads can hide their income if they want to play that way.

There’s also enforcement, which now, at least where I live, the dad will end up in jail and/or with his driver’s license revoked.

I totally understand all of it. I work for an agency that deals with getting child support payments from dads in denial.

The responsibility is not only on ONE partner but both involved.

1. Protection was used or not? ( be responsible).

2. If a mistake or accident occurs such as a condom braking etc both are to take precautions and responsibility.

3. When CHOOSING a mate make sure that its with someone that you actually care about rather than just a romp in the hay.

Confession: Yes I had an abortion after been married for over 11 years to a irresponsible partner who “forced me” to have this abortion and blamed me?

After much confusion, manipulations by him” I realized that HE is the problem” in that marriage and had decided to go through with the abortion and six months later filed for Divorce!

He: Acted as if HE was the injured party???

After years of ignoring his wife HE woke up to that fact that partners soon leave such an ignorant partner!

It took years of guilt to finally accept that pain and suffering inflicted that resulted in a break in our family dynamic.

SOOO if you don’t want that pain in your life BECOME a respectful. loving partner and share the responsibility of children born by your ignorance or lack of preparation ( condoms).

@jca2

I’m not even talking about denial. I’m talking about the state just straight up not enforcing. My sister’s ex-husband owned tens of thousands of dollars in child support by the time their sons turned 18. The state never made any serious effort to collect. Same with an aunt of mine. After a couple of decades they finally made a real effort to collect the child support owned. By that time my cousin was a grown adult (and brilliantly they were trying to come after him for it, being that he had the same name as his father they mixed up the two), and his father had died of cancer a few years before that. A friend of mine has never received a dime in child support. Her daughter is now 17.

@Darth_Algar: Gotcha. I guess it depends on the state.

By the way in the 1990’s ” Deadbeat Dads” were finally corralled into making SURE that they

paid for there child’s needs by taking the responsibility of collecting away from the spouse and

the Social Services took over the legalities by “Garnishing” the offenders and paying the

spouse/children directly instead.

Those that ditched there responsibilities were tracked by there Social Insurance numbers

and sent to Court to settle it with Social Services, since they refused to look after their

children’s welfare.

It was unbelievable how many were taken to court as it ended with multiple class action suits.

This was imperative as many ex husbands renegaded ,moved away,caused numerous court

battles that delayed the children’s needs for security,food, stability,and a loving home life.

Its too bad that the Courts HAD to enforce men to become responsible, but in most cases the

men caused late payments or no payments as a abuse to there ex wife’s??

@Inspired_2write: Yes that’s what happened in my state. Social Services took over the deadbeat dads issue and many ended up in jail or with no drivers’ license.

I do think there is a bit of cognitive dissonance at play in that we simultaneously say that men should pay to raise a child they don’t want and take more responsibility for the pregnancy and also have absolutely no say in whether the child’s life is ended before birth. Do we want men involved or not?

@jca2
I believe that this should be taught in school to both sexes.
To take responsibility and to take precautions etc
At a young age its imperative that they both learn of conseqences.

@Demosthenes

” Do we want men involved or not?”

Unfortunately most men would not get involved and just want the women to take care of causally disposing of a life.

The only way my ex was involved after was to go to Planned Parenthood and insisted quite

arrogantly loud for everyone to hear “To get rid ” of his child and then he walked out leaving

me to make the preparations, and every other female present in the waiting room upset.

Like I stated there should be more education on prevention and responsibly earlier in life for both parties.

I am sorry for ranting on this topic as it had hit a nerve and reopened an old wound.

I just had to state my views from a painful experience in my life.

@jca2 In my experience the man can find ways to wiggle out from under that financial responsibility.

I’m arguing that the man should have more responsibility for preventing an unwanted pregnancy in the first place and that laws should align more that direction. I’m not particularly interested in debating what should happen after the pregnancy has occurred.

The burden of pregnancy falls on women for the obvious reason that men cannot conceive. If there is any lesson thus far regarding attempts to legislate legal ramifications to sexual behavior, it is that enforcement of said rules is as ineffective as the cases are varied. To suppose that justice might result through regulation of ejaculation is an impossible concept to grapple with, let alone enforce.

No. Free and ubiquitous contraception and healthcare (including abortions) would reduce unwanted pregnancy.

Well there can be a law about having premarital sex or sex with a person you are not married too where it results in an unwanted pregnancy and fine the male let’s say 10,000 dollars right off the back. So if the man is identified through DNA, that will be the most expensive screw of their life. The money can be used to support orphaned children. And if its by rape and the culprit is found, he can be castrated. Bet that would knock down the number of unwanted pregnancies. Do that and unwanted pregnancies would take a serious dive. Or better yet, 10 percent of your annual pay should be the fine.

You cannot make laws controlling what 2 consenting adults do in the bedroom! How would you go about enforcing them?

@Dutchess_III: I know that men can wiggle out of their responsibility to the child. I listed a couple of ways above.

No. Realistically you could never enforce such a law and it would be ridiculous to even try. As a couple of others stated above, the most practical way to prevent unwanted pregnancy is through early education and free all-encompassing contraception.

I think that the idea of a negligent ejaculation law is a bit nebulous. I think that responsibility has to play a part, though. When a man and a woman have sex, they could easily take precautions. Condoms are a relatively cheap and easy way to avoid a pregnancy. Yes, I know it isn’t 100% effective, but it would certainly help. And it would help prevent STDs. But if the woman gets pregnant, I think she ought to have to at least have the conversation with the father before running off for an abortion. When I got a vasectomy, I had to have a form signed by my wife saying it was okay. Why is it not my body, my choice, but if a woman gets pregnant it’s suddenly her body, her choice? And I think the father needs to be informed. It makes him more responsible for the actions. That isn’t necessarily saying he has the final say or anything…just that they need to have that dialogue.

I don’t think you can make laws regarding sex of two consenting adults. All you can do is put in laws to discourage unplanned pregnancy. Most states when a baby is born out of wedlock the father has a financial obligation to the child and zero visitation or custody rights. That should be discouraging enough if they give a damn.

The way to discourage unprotected sex is sex education and changing cultural mores. The pro-life group has didn’t so much time talking about every life is precious they actually have moved from shaming unwed mothers to practically rallying around them and raising them on a pedestal for not aborting. Some parts of society men feel more macho if they have children, even teenage men. Get rid of that in our culture and that would be more productive. I don’t want to go back to shunning someone who gets unintentionally pregnant, things happen, and especially I understand how young people just aren’t always realistic or prepared, and I’m reluctant to be very critical.

@JLeslie: You can make laws regarding sex between consenting adults, which is why there were laws on the books regarding homosexuality and sodomy. Those laws are being repealed now, of course, but in some countries, those laws still exist.

Yes, penalizing men for impregnating women who did not want to be impregnated would reduce instances of unwanted pregnancy. But it’s also a completely unworkable and awful idea.

At any rate, it would never make the issue moot, because unwanted pregnancies and abortions will always happen, and people are pretty dug in politically on both sides.

@jca2 Yes, I know, I just meant at this time in history in America I don’t see laws like that happening. Not new laws.

The only way this issue will ever be diminished is through better sex education (including less stigma surrounding the topic) and better access to safe, effective contraception. Until that happens all the after-the-fact punishment in the world isn’t going to change things one bit.

Not in my 90s @Inspired_2write. The kid’s dad just left the state.

It always just blew my mind the first time I had sex with a guy, and not one asked if I was using any contraceptives. Not one.