Do you ever tire from deflection in politics?

I get tired of politicians refusing to answer a direct question.

I pretty much hate, all politicians and their bullshit. I watch a lot of YouTube. I’ve been bombarded with ads, from each party, that are mostly just bullshit lies, or deflection. I just want to vomit, when I see the ads.
The ads just cancel each other out.
They are all criminals, and all take money from one bad source or another….

Yes. Yes!

Why do we do that? I think it’s probably because we are a very social species. Being challenged hurts so much because we fear exclusion. So we get explosively defensive.

Childish but we all do it. The most obvious reason is that it’s easier to attack someone than it is to defend them, even if they were totally correct in their action/statement. There is also one of the ‘Rules for Radicals’, straight from Alinsky, Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.

Absolutely. The other night Trump sat down with George Stephanopoulos and a group of voters who asked him about 20 questions.
Trump deflected, blamed, redirected, and flat out lied.
Not one question was answered.

I often use “opposition” politicians to point out the hypocrisy of those on these pages. They get upset beyond belief by something they claim Trump or the Republicans did, but then ignore the exact same thing when it is from one of their people. Example: Trump tried getting a quid pro quo from Ukraine…threatened to withhold aid unless they did something for him. If that were true, it would be a horrible thing. But when you show a video of Biden bragging about doing that exact thing it is treated as no big deal. So how can it be horrible for one person and no big deal for another? To me, it isn’t about deflection as much as highlighting.

^ But it is deflection. You don’t go on to condemn the actions of both people. You brush the whole issue away as though simply pointing out that someone else also did x means that x is fine.

One way to avoid deflection – at least in discussion – is to discuss issues and principles, rather than a person or party. If it’s true that both parties have done x, that says absolutely nothing about whether x is good or bad.

Yes. Ashamed of our president too.

No not really, that’s politics.

Good grief @seawulf575 Everyone on Fluther responded that if Biden was indeed guilty of that quid quo pro he should face the charges of it, as should Trump with his but that wasn’t good enough Biden should have had the death penalty and Trump should have gotten a Brownie badge,and you talk about hypocrisy?

I hate partisan politics in general. And when politicians deflect on questions on cable news, news anchors rarely ask intelligent follow up questions. It’s journalistic malpractice. Anchors are supposed to keep politicians accountable, instead they’re just being subservient to their corporate sponsors.

I tire of politics…period.

I just want a competent president at the helm so I can relax about my future and the future of my kids and grandkids.

The problem is that they all have to “play dirty,“otherwise even a potentially great leader will get run over.
Moreover, the higher higher a politician climbs, the more money they need to run their campaign. So. They end up taking money from the uber wealthy and then, they are beholden to those people.
I don’t know how to fix that. But. The systems are broken…

Yes, but, as others have said: we all do it. It seems to be human nature to try and diffuse blame off of someone or something you affiliate with by pointing out the flaws of others. It’s certainly much easier to say “they do it too!” than examine why “it” might be wrong.

@hmmmmmm try again. Look at what I just wrote. I said that if Trump had done it, it would be a horrible act. But you just made my point. You went after Trump but not Biden. Or more accurately, you rewrote my response to make it look like I was defending Trump. You are the one that is deflecting. You will go so far as to recreate a conversation so you can deflect away from Biden. And you want to have discussions! Pshaw! You can’t deal with reality so how is any conversation on issues or principals even possible with people like you?

Can we talk about something else? Half our fence is gone and Cato hasn’t attempted to wander outside of his boundaries. Cool, huh!

@SQUEEKY2 No, what every one said was that it was just deflection because Biden isn’t POTUS so it doesn’t matter. Apparently we are supposed to wait until he gets elected (if he does) before we look at it. So tell me, what do you think of the chances of looking at his moral character are after he gets elected? You fools on the left make excuses for him all the time. And here we are on the deflections again. Apparently this behavior was bad enough to impeach Donald Trump but can be entirely ignored when Joe Biden admits to doing the exact same thing. Deflect much?

@seawulf575 – I’m talking about your entire effort on Fluther. You never advocate for or against principles. It’s all about “hypocrisy”. It’s a push for moral relativism.

It’s possible that you’re not intentionally using this technique to deflect. Maybe it’s just habitual, and you genuinely don’t feel that there is right and wrong, and it’s all an amoral game of checkers.

Also, @seawulf575: “You went after Trump but not Biden” – I did no such thing. I didn’t go after Trump or Biden. I was specifically talking to you. Please read carefully.

@seawulf575 But one huge deflection is the false equivalence of what Trump did in his quid pro quo with Ukraine, and your and the right’s attempts to deflect it by saying “Biden did the same.”

Trump withheld funds for Ukraine that had been approved by Congress and signed into law, in an attempt to get dirt on an opponent,using the money for his own personal quest. Biden’s involvement with Ukraine was to pressure Ukraine,on behalf of the United States, to get rid of a corrupt prosecutor who only pursued going after people that would not pay bribes.

But you will say, “Hunter Biden got a job”. But Hunter Biden worked for Burisma in Ukraine years after the issues with the prosecutor were resolved.

Hunter Biden received the position at least partially because his father was vice president. This isn’t good, but it isn’t illegal, either; family connections are an unfortunate fact of life. To give an example, across town right now, Malia Obama is attending Harvard. I’m sure she had excellent grades and test scores in high school, but anyone who thinks that her parentage had absolutely nothing to do with the decision to admit her is kidding themselves.

However, does that put President Obama in the same camp as Lori Loughlin, who secured her daughter’s admission to USC through outright bribery? Most of us would probably say no.

By the same logic, the fact that Hunter Biden traded on his last name shouldn’t make Joe Biden a criminal.

Finally, above all, it’s profoundly hypocritical for Trump to accuse Biden of nepotism, given the roles he’s assigned to his own children. Of course, profound hypocrisy from the White House is sort of a given by now.

@hmmmmmm And you are still deflecting. You want it to be about me. I am the one that HAS said negatives about both sides. You, on the other hand, avoid it at all costs. Now you are deflecting by trying to make some grand claim about me when you know nothing about me. AND you purposely avoid actually reading what I write. You are now trying to deflect from the fact that you rewrote my first comment so you could create a narrative.

@zenvelo The facts are there. They aren’t alternative facts as you fools on the left love to claim…they are facts. He released the transcript of the conversation. There was no quid pro quo. He didn’t threaten Zelenskyy at all with the aid. He didn’t ask for any special favor or else. So your entire comment is bogus. It is a deflection. You start with fake news and move on from there. But you, too, are making my point perfectly. You have not only NOT held Biden accountable for his quid pro quo, you are trying to justify it. He threatened to withhold funds that were approved by Congress and signed into law unless the Ukrainians fired their equivalent of an Attorney General. By his own admission it wasn’t for any particular purpose, he want the guy gone. So you are STILL deflecting.

(It was the right who started with the “alternative facts” bullshit. Kelly Ann.)

@Dutchess_III And yet, it is you fools that carry through with it. It was you on the other thread that tried making a huge deal out of only the facts and everything else is a lie. So…There are facts…and then there is the crap you fools on the left shovel.

Yeah we are supposed to accept every fright wing fact you cite as pure gospel, and you spit on anything we we post as fact as left wing propaganda just to make captain bone spurs look bad.

Plus go back to the quid quo pro thing and you will see that we did indeed agree that if Biden’s quid was a crime then he should face charges for it, like Trump should have.

@SQUEEKY2 It isn’t right wing or left wing facts…..it’s facts. You seem to miss that. I tell you exactly what I’m looking at and you try to avoid it because it is not in line with your thinking. The transcript of Trump’s conversation is out there. It can be read very easily. It doesn’t sound ANYTHING like what comes out of the MSM or you guys on the left. And no, you are trying to make an argument that isn’t true now. It was not universally agreed that Biden’s quid pro quo was a crime or that he should face charges for it. Let me help you with a few quotes from those questions:

“You got it. He wasn’t a Presidential candidate. “Hillary’s emails” was manufactured BS turned big deal issue by the GOP because she dared to run for the WH. Other former Secretaries of State did the same thing with their emails and it seems with servers as well?

Just look at the Republican voters’ choice for Presidents. Bush instead of MacCain then a big piece of human garbage called trump. This is the only way Repubs know how to win the WH, electing human trash as president. Pretty obvious.” This was not only a denial of wrong doing, it was a deflection as well.

“There was nothing to do, He was complying with the declared national interests of his government INCLUDING that of the Congress.”

“It’s not a crime so it didn’t seem important at the time”

“The thing is when Biden did it, there were several conservatives wanting the same thing and were happy as shit to get that corrupt Ukraine official out.
Now they are all up in arms saying it was worse than what Trump did.” That was YOUR response. Not only did you not condemn Biden, you deflected.

“The so called Biden scandal is cooked up bullshit—period! At the very worst, Biden’s kid’s installation in the plum gas job was the height of brain dead impropriety one might typically expect from his Republican. opponents. While Biden has a reputation as a decent and honorable man, he is by no means the sharpest intellectual tack in the Democratic box. And the reason the accusations from the right against him gain absolutely no traction is because they are 100% strident nonsense cooked up for consumption by bottom rung low information yokels comprising the heart of the Republican base.”

“If he wins he will not be impeached for the same reason he wasn’t impeached when he was VP. The charges are stupid and completely without merit as are all of those other wank job alt right accusations against Democratic moderates. The Clintons, Obamas or Bidens have not been nor will be found culpable of criminal acts. Their lawyers, cabinet members and associates are not splashed in the headlines as either under investigation or convicted. Why not look at those on their way to jail or sitting there already?”

This was all from one thread….one question. Nowhere did anyone say that Biden’s actions was a crime, nor that he should face charges for it. There were lots of excuses AND DEFLECTION. And, as I said with my first response to this question: I pointed out the hypocrisy of all those arguments. And, as predicted, I was called the deflector, even when I was the only one NOT deflecting.

@seawulf575 And this is why I admire your patience. You always explain and show examples.

You know there was a big news item today about how the left and right see ‘facts’ very differently even when they are exactly the same. Like cops driving into protesters in the street for example. Many on the left said the police were the aggressors (trying to drive down the street) and many on the right said the protestors in the street were the aggressors (blocking the cop car.)

So honestly, while I admire your efforts, I think it’s pointless to continue to get one side or the other to come together at this point, we just see things too differently.

I have never heard “alternate facts” come from anyone else’s mouth @seawulfe. Not even yours.

@Dutchess_III AND….you dodge again. Or more accurately, you deflect. What are the FACTS concerning the quid pro quos? President Trump released the transcript of the phone call. At no time did he offer anything for any favors. That is a FACT. President Zelenskyy twice said he had no idea at the time of the call that any aid was delayed. That is a FACT. Without his knowledge of any threat, the whole idea of a quid pro quo is completely moot. That is a FACT. It also shows that any and all efforts to try saying President Trump was trying to force a favor to be a false narrative. And that is where YOU keep living. MEANWHILE, we have Joe Biden bragging about how he forced the Ukrainians to get rid of their State Prosecutor. He admitted he threatened to withhold $1B in aid unless they did it within 6 hours. That is a FACT. Joe even admitted that Barack Obama was in on that plan. That is a FACT. That aid was approved by Congress and neither Joe, nor Barack, had the authority to deny that aid. That is a FACT. Joe did an actual quid pro quo and bragged about it. That is a FACT. The quid pro quo was the heart of the impeachment inquiry. That is a FACT. It was the whole point of the bogus whistleblower complaint. That is a FACT. Anything else…any denial, any argument or excuse, is deflection and/or a false narrative. And that is what all you goofy lefties on these pages are holding to. Now Joe Biden wants us to elect him to be POTUS. That is a FACT. And not a single one of you think he did anything wrong even though you felt it was horrible when Trump supposedly did it. That is a FACT. And it is also HYPOCRISY.
Once again…back to my opening statement on these pages…I am using comments comparing two identical situations to show the hypocrisy of those on the left.

Just add that quite a few Republicans wanted that prosecutor gone as well,that was fact as well.
also Biden didn’t do it for self enhancement, and Trump did.
They are not identical and you know it,does it make what either did OK, no of course not.

If you could ever provide one iota of proof to back your claims up @Seawulf that would be nice. But you can’t because it doesn’t exist.
In the meantime I’ll just leave this here

Do you need help making the connection?

@Dutchess_III I think I tripped you over the edge. Not only did you deflect, but you used some totally bizarre link to do so…one that had absolutely nothing to do with anything that has been discussed.

@SQUEEKY2 That answer sounds a lot like deflection to me. You are trying to deflect back to Trump to avoid actually admitting that Biden did the exact thing the Dems accused Trump of doing. In fact, the statement that Trump did it is patently false as well. The evidence is overwhelmingly showing that the entire thing was a construct of the Dems for political reasons. The transcript alone shows that. Go back and look at the history. The Dems toted out a “whistleblower complaint” that was false from the start. It claimed Trump asked 8 times for Zelenskyy to investigate Biden for him. That was wrong. It claimed he threatened to withhold aid until the investigation was done. That was false…the transcript shows that as well. To make sure no one could actually question their source, they claimed some mythical “anonymity” clause to Whistleblower laws. They brought out all sorts of “witnesses” who all claimed to not have first hand knowledge of anything. One of them said she never even met the President and was removed from office before the phone call. Only Vindman was on the phone call as a “scribe”. His account did not mesh with what the other “scribes” heard, but no one was allowed to question that. But even his testimony was more about how he didn’t like the President’s policies and his speculation about what may or may not have been going through the POTUS’ head. Not anything about actual facts associated with the phone call that was the focal point of the entire impeachment effort. So to claim “Trump did” is false. It is a claim that is not supported by facts. You know…a lie. The Dems did, however, make a big deal about Trump threatening to withhold aid that Congress had approved, saying it was not in his power to do this. They are absolutely right…it is not in his power to do this. And it was not done. Meanwhile, Biden DID threaten to withhold aid if Ukraine didn’t fire their State Prosecutor within 6 hours. He even said Obama was okay with this decision. That power was not his, nor Obama’s, to wield. Congress had approved the funding. it doesn’t matter how many Dems or Repubs wanted the prosecutor gone. The funding was approved and not with the proviso of the prosecutor being removed from office. Trying to make excuses is another example of deflection. It is hypocrisy when you say it is okay for Biden but not for Trump. It is wrong for either. The part you have backwards is that Biden did it and Trump did not.

Oh at least Trump’s hench men covered it up very,very well.
I know to you Trump is as innocent as the driven snow, but to the rest of us he is as clean as the bed sheets in the hotel room after the Russian hookers.
And to say you never deflect is as truthful as the Don Father himself no wonder you lover him so much.

@SQUEEKY2 Annnddd….we are back to my original statement. You are giving opinion that has no backing in facts and don’t see it as a problem. Yet when I give you facts that support my views, you don’t want to accept them, but you’d rather deflect back to your false narratives. Even saying I love him isn’t true. I think he has done an okay job and I don’t buy into the negative hype from the left. But that isn’t love.

From my link “Reporter: You have 4% of the population, 24% of Covid deaths.
White House: We use different numbers”
You don’t get the correlation between “alternate facts” and the use of “different numbers” to come up with the right’s alternate facts on covid 19? I am surprised. Or maybe I’m not.

Yeah ,yeah he has done a great job over 200,000 dead Americans on his watch, he can’t take responsibility for anything.
Over half his inner circle ,in jail or facing charges.
And yet all of your countries problems are from the radical left in your view.
I gave you a list of his LIES from politico a while back you spit on them because you disliked the nicknames they gave each lie, but you have used politico as fact yourself.yet you never deflect,WHAT THE FUCK DO YOU WANT?
Most of us have said if what Biden did was a punishable crime he should pay for it, what more do you want??
Do I think Trump did a quid as well OH FUCK YEAH! I do think it was covered up and shoved under the carpet.
Can you simply not admit you deflect as much as anyone else when it comes to your beloved fright wing comrades?

@seawulf575 .
I have already said, I think that both Trump and Biden shouldn’t be eligible to be candidates for practically committing the same crimes.

I won’t be voting, for the lesser of two evils…

@Dutchess_III Sooooo….a discussion going on about deflecting and the tie between Trump and Biden being treated differently and you come up with that? Uh…yeah….that’s called deflection. Thank you for making my point so perfectly.

@SQUEEKY2 “Over half his inner circle ,in jail or facing charges.” No…that is a false statement. There were a few that came under charges during the Mueller investigation, but not over half. AND we are now finding out that most of that was done using falsified FISA warrants which was done by…oh yeah…the LEFT!

“I gave you a list of his LIES from politico a while back you spit on them because you disliked the nicknames they gave each lie, but you have used politico as fact yourself.yet you never deflect,WHAT THE FUCK DO YOU WANT?” The list you gave me I didn’t like because most of them were complete garbage. They didn’t like one of his policy decisions so they called it a lie. He’d say he did or didn’t do something and they called it a lie…and then didn’t take it off the list when he was proven correct. IT was a crap article. Unlike you guys and gals on the left, I don’t discount articles very often because of the source alone. I think I probably have used Politico as a source before to try getting you fools to see that what I am saying is true. Know what that response I got was? Oh yeah!...like POLITICO is a reliable source! so yeah…What the Fuck Do YOU want?

“Most of us have said if what Biden did was a punishable crime he should pay for it, what more do you want??” I just called your lie on this one earlier, even pulling actual responses from Fluther questions. Most of you have NOT admitted or even come close to admitting that Biden committed any crime. Hell, this thread here shows that. You are trying to say it now, but I already dug up proof that you were covering for him before. Sorry…too little too late.

“Do I think Trump did a quid as well OH FUCK YEAH! I do think it was covered up and shoved under the carpet.” I know you believe that. But I guess the real question is…when and how? When and how was it covered up? He had a phone call with Zelenskyy that was witnessed by many, many people including Zelenskyy and his people. The only person out of all those that heard the call that claimed anything at all odd was Vindman. And his claim really boiled down to he didn’t like how Trump did things. Nothing actually illegal…just his opinion. And when all this became big news, Trump released the transcript almost instantly. So when did he cover it up? And how did he cover it up so completely that it was never uncovered? See…this is where the deflection and “alternate facts” come into play. Your view defies logic and facts….yet it is what you have been told over and over is true.

“Can you simply not admit you deflect as much as anyone else when it comes to your beloved fright wing comrades?” My very first statement on this thread explains my views of deflection. What you call deflection, I call identifying hypocrisy.