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Jeruba's avatar

Have you heard of this approach to relieving back pain? Do you have an opinion on it?

Asked by Jeruba (56062points) November 29th, 2022

“I Have to Believe This Book Cured My Pain”
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/11/09/well/mind/john-sarno-chronic-pain-relief.html

The article discusses an emotion-oriented response to back pain as described by Dr. John Sarno, author of several books, including Healing Back Pain: The Mind-Body Connection, which says that chronic pain is mostly mental. If we’re looking at vertebrae and discs and their abnormalities, we’re looking in the wrong place: the pain is muscular and tension-based.

I’m not far along in reading the book, but so far it’s consistent with the NYT article.

I’m not much for woo-woo theories and spooky medicine, but I sense that there’s something to this. Right now I am suffering almost constant, debilitating back pain, and I need to do something. If you’ve read the article and/or the book(s), or have any related personal experience to share, please comment.

(And yes, I am also taking the conventional medical route of seeking consultation with a back specialist.)

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20 Answers

RocketGuy's avatar

Sounds like BS. My discs are wearing thin and I have back pain. Offloading the discs via inversion table helps. Massaging the muscles doesn’t seem to help. Sounds like a disc problem to me.

raum's avatar

Firewall, so didn’t read the article. Though there’s definitely overlap between pain and stress.

seawulf575's avatar

Basically he isn’t wrong…and he is. The pain you are feeling is usually muscular in nature. This is exasperated by tension. However, he is ignoring the “why” the muscles are in pain. They are usually overcompensating or working at an odd angle due to problems with the vertebrae and discs.

I’m with @RocketGuy…I love my inversion table.

ragingloli's avatar

I despise these “it is all in your head” hand-waves in general.
Not only is it insulting to the patients, but it also prevents further examinations, and discovery of potentially serious causes.

gorillapaws's avatar

I’m not a doctor, or an expert in pain management. I do know that there absolutely is a psychological component to pain (e.g. amputees will experience phantom limb pain, you can also trick the brain by hitting a mannequin hand with a hammer, and people will report pain). Also there can be physiological responses to mental phenomena like stress, and it’s at least plausible in my mind that those responses could result in pressure on the spine. I’m also extremely suspicious of “mind-body” stuff and would want to see that any claims being made were supported by quality experimental studies.

Jeruba's avatar

I appreciate all comments. Thank you.

I am a skeptic’s skeptic, but I have also had a lot of back diagnoses and treatments over the years and thought it was 90% baloney. If a doctor with relevant experience writes that it’s about muscle tension, and that emotional states such as anxiety can cause that tension, and that fits with my observed experience, I’m going to listen.

And, as always, ask questions.

So I’m interested in your opinions.

smudges's avatar

I believe it’s a vicious circle. We have a problem which causes pain, the pain causes stress and tension, the tension causes continued and quite possibly increased pain—> more tension, stress, pain, etc.

My lower back has bothered me since my 40’s. It got to the point last year that I couldn’t stand for over 15 minutes without it feeling like it was going to cramp. My orthopedist recommended someone his wife saw so I made an appt. He’s what’s called a physiatrist – which I hadn’t heard of before. He had me do a round of physical therapy, which didn’t really help. This year I went back to him because he had offered shots in the back but I was hesitant the previous year; this year I was ready to try anything. My back was so arthritic that it bent his needle in the spot it was supposed to go into. He had to contact my insurance company to see if they would cover a different point of entry which was technically a different procedure. They ok’d it, I got the shots two due to diff point of entry and it helped for a few weeks. I want to live without pain or with as little pain as I can for whatever time I have left, so I didn’t accept that small improvement. A couple of months later a neurosurgeon did a laminectomy, which, unfortunately hasn’t helped completely. That was in May. Some meds help, but I can’t take NSAIDS due to stomach issues. The only thing left would be something like an opioid.

So yes, I think that emotional issues can cause problems in lots of parts of the body, but there are many times when it’s purely physical. Pain does cause tension and anxiety, so it’s pretty much a mixed bag. If I were you, I’d see a physiatrist or at least an orthopedist and see if they can find out exactly what’s going on. Best of luck to you. I can sure sympathize.

added: https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/treatment-tests-and-therapies/physiatrist

JLeslie's avatar

If it is back pain from a bulging disk or a nerve being crushed by the spine having very little cushion between vertebrae then I call bullshit.

If it is back pain from muscle cramping or pulls, then I think there can be some validity to mental state and back pain, and also body pain in general, but generally I hate blaming the patient, which is usually how blaming psychological reasons often sounds and feels.

The pain from anxiety or acute depression or sadness like from big life changes can easily cause physical pain along with psychological pain. You have been through a tremendous amount of stress the last few years.

In my late 20’s I injured my back. The pain was unbelievable some days. It wound up being just muscular. I wore a brace, only flat shoes, limited how much weight I lifted, tried not to twist getting in and out of my bed and car. It lasted 9 months. What finally cured it was I spent three months living with my in-laws, and my MIL did all the cooking, cleaning, and laundry. When I was “home” I didn’t have to lift a finger or reach into a dryer. Finally letting my muscles fully rest is what I think stopped the muscle spasms or whatever they technically were.

I really had thought I had something very wrong with my back, but it wound up just being the muscles.

Now, if I pull or strain my back I rest my back full stop right away. I let my husband lift anything over five pounds for a few days. Usually, it gets better. I make sure not to keep aggravating it. I even get a housekeeper to come in if I have to.

Also, ibuprofen works. Assuming you don’t have any medical reasons that you can’t take it. Taking ibuprofen for a few days like a treatment not a pain killer and relax the muscles and calm inflammation. Remember take it with plenty of water and some food.

Disclaimer: of course check with your doctor before taking medication.

filmfann's avatar

My back doesn’t have issues, it has subscriptions.
Cracked vertebra, bone spurs, disc disintegration, and on and on. When I was working, several times a year I would be unable to get out of bed for days at a time. My wife would help by cracking my back (often in restaurants, which humiliated her).
I had real back pain. I don’t anymore, because I don’t challenge my back. I spend several hours a day immobile.

Smashley's avatar

I suspect there’s something to it. Chronic pain is at the frontier of medical knowledge, and most surgical back interventions do not give great results. Backs are also funny because everyone hurts them, and most injuries self-resolve, no matter what woo woo thing you are or aren’t doing.

Muscle tension causing other issues is absolutely a real thing though.

Dutchess_III's avatar

When my back starts hurting I strap on a cool little sciatic nerve brace.

For me it’s BOOM! Instant pain relief.

Zaku's avatar

I have not heard of that specific approach. I have heard various ideas about mind-body connection, which there undoubtedly is. There are certainly multiple approaches to treating pain and other symptoms.

And, what I have had much experience with, is Feldenkrais (awareness through movement exercises in particular) and its potential for curing chronic pain and mobility issues, through re-training the nervous system and stimulating your mind’s ability to learn new habits, through movements.

flutherother's avatar

Chronic pain may be mental, but I think you should rule out physical causes first. For example by getting a CT scan of your spine. However, in my experience back pain has never lasted longer than about six weeks and physical activity actually helped rather than made things worse.

Jeruba's avatar

@flutherother, that’s exactly what the author recommends. He says his treatment is about education.

He also says that the fear and anxiety you get from having the pain is a self-reinforcing cycle; when you do learn to overcome that conditioning and resume your normal level of activity, the pain is more likely to decrease or end.

JLeslie's avatar

I’ll add if you vitamin D is low try to get your D into the normal range. The only way to know is to get a blood test. Low D significantly affects my muscles. Moreover, I have found magnesium spray to be helpful. Magnesium is absorbed well through the skin, so don’t do it daily or in large amounts. Epson Salt is delivering magnesium also, but you can buy a spray and just put it right on the painful area.

People with chronic pain can have usually have time during the day where they have less pain or less aware of their pain when they are busy doing tasks, but it only goes so far in my opinion and in my experience.

Also, doctors see fit to prescribe antidepressants and other drugs that change brain chemistry or block nerve transmission, and I am not a big fan of it, this is purely my opinion, but some people find relief.

The way I see it, chronic pain causes psychological distress more than the other way around. It is depressing to be in pain all of the time, and can be life altering. Chronis pain is a prison.

smudges's avatar

@JLeslie Love the above post that you wrote.

I have to add to those of you who lighten the effects of back pain or say it’ll go away by itself – you need to know what the cause of the pain is before making those claims. Arthritis can’t be stretched away or exersized away or cut out and doesn’t have anything to do with emotions.

Just this past September my orthopedist had to do an arthroscopy to remove 20 “nuggets” (for lack of a better word) of arthritis from my shoulder, the largest being 1.3 cm. I had fallen twice and apparently they broke off and were floating around in my shoulder. I have arthritis in every major joint as well as my back.

@JLeslie said it best, “chronic pain causes psychological distress more than the other way around. It is depressing to be in pain all of the time, and can be life altering. Chronis pain is a prison.”

Entropy's avatar

There is a proven link between the mind and physical symptoms. It’s why the placebo effect is a real thing. But unless this guy is reporting on techniques proven by multiple double-blind randomized control studies published in peer reviewed literature….I’d pass. Talk to a real doctor about your real problems.

There’s alot of bad “science” out there. Trust your doctor to help you separate the good stuff from the bad stuff.

AhYem's avatar

I haven’t read that book, but my 66 years can surely tell you something about it.

I have had lower back pain for quite some time, fortunately only once or twice a year though.

I have spoken to many people about it, and read a bunch of texts in books or on the internet. It was both, classic/traditional medicine and alternative medicine. It’s been a while now that I have this general understanding of physical ailments.

Most of them are called “psycho-somatic” which means they are connected to both, our Psyche and our Body.

People generally tend to consider things in a black-or-white manner, meaning they most often accept one side and totally reject the other. Most people that I talked to or read something they had written were either pro-traditional and anti-alternative, or vice versa. I think both sides were wrong, and this is why:

An illness has two moments. One of it is its physical part, where it manifests itself. The other one is its psychological part, where it has its origin.

If your back hurts, it IS due to some physical problems, because the mental pressure of whatever kind causes some of your organs to succumb to it. A saying goes “the weakest part breaks first”. So, if you have a psychological problem, it will be very “normal” for at least one of your organs to “crack”, and it will be those that are the weakest at the time being. It can be your head, your teeth, your blood (pressure), your heart, your back, your bones or any other organ. So, if you go to a doctor, he will figure out your physical problem and will start to treat you in that regard. If however you see an alternative shaman, they will most probably disregard your physical problem and completely focus on your soul or spirit. Later, when you tell both sides that you have consulted both of them, they will make fun of the other side.

In my opinion, both parties make a huge mistake, because they focus on just one of the two sides of a problem.

I have the luck to have friends in both camps, and they are totally honest with me, because they know what kind of person I am. That has helped me figure out much of that problematic. So I managed to understand that before I go to see a doctor, I have to consult myself in order to see if there is anything inside my Psyche that had caused the particular problem. I usually find something there, and then i go and talk to an alternative doctor first. They have been fair so far, in that they had told me that one of my particular problems could not be treated by them, because it was more physical than I thought it was – and that was my broken hip, that could not have been treated by means of alternative medicine. So I was then taken to a hospital where they replaced my broken hip with a brand new – plus musical! – one, that “sings” every time I have to go through certain gates on the Airport or in some Institutions.

Having said that, I’d also want to tell you something about my – and your – back problems.

I haven’t had any back pains since I started to do some exercises, mostly in bed. I call them stretching because they are stretching combined with a specific (actually slowed down) breathing. I move almost my whole body, yet not all at once, first my arms, then my hands, then my belly part, then my legs and so on. While I’m doing it, I hear crackles all the time, even from parts of my body where there are no bones or joints, and I always marvel about it. I asked some people to watch me while I was doing it, and they all heard the crackling and were amazed.

I’m not there to show you how it works, but I think it’s not even necessary, because i never saw another person do that. I figured it out myself in course of time. Which means, you can do it as well, even without seeing another person do that.

If you do those exercises, it won’t take long till your back pains will subside. It won’t happen overnight, but it won’t take you longer than 3 or 4 days till you manage to get rid of the pains, maybe even completely. If not, they will at least not be as hard as you have had them so far.

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