How is this fascistic move even possible in our country (See details)

He’s a Republican. They make me sick.

God forbid he becomes president.

He’ll never become President. Precisely due to all the assholery that he is doing.

I hope you’re right @mazinger88! I hadn’t heard that. Scary!

I believe he has the potential to out-Trump Trump. He’s smarter. But I also think he doesn’t have the pizzazz to deliver what the GOP seems to want these days, which is an Inquisition-flavored carnival.

Yes, I’d be terrified to see him as president. Amazing to remember that at one time I felt that way about Ronald Reagan—and before him, Barry Goldwater. During Bush 43’s term, I said “At least it can’t get any worse.” When Trump became a candidate, I swore never to say that again.

It is ridiculous and scary. The only way it makes sense is if the Republicans think they will be in power forever and always. The next governor could be a Democrat, you never know. Only people who don’t understand higher education and who are ok with dictators would think this is ok.

I still say DeSantis is a political animal, and he has the formula down for playing to his base and riling up the left so he makes it into the news. Supposedly, he scores incredibly high for Republicans around the country knowing. The recognize his name and think favorably of him.

How is it happening in the US? It has been happening.

@mazingerz88 I think he has a great chance of becoming president. It’s still very far off, so who knows. I heard Gov Hogan might run. It would be interesting to see if he could make it through the primaries. I think the Republicans of today would likely just call him a RINO and get rid of him.

Cut and pasted from the article:” The bill would put all hiring decisions in the hands of each universities’ board of trustees, a body selected entirely by the governor and his appointees, with input from the school’s president. A board of trustee member could also call for the review of any faculty member’s tenure.”

Totally designed to keep down detractors and keep the professors scared of speaking up.

Horrible.

Meatball Ron has made powerful enemies. He will never be President.

I dislike this move against the schools, but I am not sure which aspect of the First Amendment you think he is violating.

Typo correction: Supposedly, he scores incredibly high for Republicans around the country knowing who he is. They recognize his name and think favorably of him.

@filmfann The right of faculty to teach freely and to hold discussions. Florida already controls what books elementary teachers are allowed to have in their classrooms.

If a college professor is going to be afraid for their job every time they turn around, it’s going to thrwart their ability to teach freely and have fruitful discussions. I know I would definitely feel inhibted if I were afraid for my job if the governing Board didn’t like the topics I taught.

I just love the smell of Gleichschaltung in the morning.

The voters in Florida selected him. That’s how.
It’s democracy in action.

I hate to say this, I’m very free speech. I’m also for strict academic integrity. Keep politics out of academia as much as possible. This is not a good thing to allow the state to decide something that should be handled at the university’s dept level. Many humanities departments IMO have strayed into dangerous political, pseudoscientific territory where the publish or perish mode of operation has created some dreadful cult-like behavior that needs to be reigned in to a degree. Just not like this. There, I said it. Needs to be said.

Republicans are very afraid of their children being manipulated and being indoctrinated into other ways of thinking. Some of that fear is warranted. When a political movement wants to take a country over, no matter if the intentions are good or not they always convert the youth first. Always. Christians are terrified their kids will be “turned away from God” politicians know this and play the angle of stopping that in conjunction with dampening some of the nonsense in humanities going on right now. Again, this is not the way to go about this. Leave it to the departments to handle.

@Blackwater_Park There’s indoctrination going on in Christian education as well, I have to say, but I agree with much of what you are saying. Leave it to the universities to sort out. And I think by the time students are college age, they should be exposed to many different ideas and theories and if they have learned critical thinking, they can start to sort things out in their own minds.

@gondwanalon elected yes and as @ragingloli implied Hitler was elected by democracy !

Desantis should stay out of public education since obviously he lacks the credentials to have any opinion of such. His mind is far too narrow to comprehend what he is talking about since theoretical subjects are just that, “theoretical” subjects! We have no theories we have no ideas, we have no ideas we have no advancement. So he wants us to go back to the Dark Ages and live in caves, I suppose.

This man is a dunce, a knuckle dragging Neanderthal (I apologize to all Neanderthals) If these GOP idiots continue to take over America we are going to plunge into oblivion. I don’t know what happened, must be something in the water, but these far right nut-bags are running amuck. I wonder if it’s only for their 15 minutes or is this really insanity on steroids?!

@Tropical_Willie I was just answering the question. I don’t know of anything that’s perfect. After all Trump was elected President of the USA in 2016. Or are you one of those election deniers?

But not to worry, you will be able to keep your gas stove he won’t let the evil Democrats take them away.

@Dig_Dug DeSantis was actually education at Harvard and Yale. That’s part of what makes him so scary.

@janbb Kids do not learn critical thinking at all before college. Quite frankly, they are not really learning it at universities either.

Christians totally brainwash their kids too. No argument from me on that.

We are creating the next generation of hateful, brainwashed, polarized and entitled brats.

Edit: “educated”

@janbb Too bad with all his expensive “education” he didn’t learn any critical thinking skills!

Who do you think should control public universities? They are state schools. Shame on states who allow schools to be hijacked by activists of one flavor or another.

The state universities are being hijacked by theocratic and fascist followers of DeSantis !

DeSantis and his ilk are against people of color and non-Christian religions.

Shame on states who allow schools to be hijacked by activists of one flavor or another. Exactly! Public schools are for the PUBLIC! Everyone is the public, not just Christians or whites or influential types.

Amazing how these conservatives claim they are all for privatization, and freedom just do it their way and all will be fine.

@SQUEEKY2 Like in Animal Farm, All animals are equal, just some animals are more equal than others.

Constitution of the United States

First Amendment

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

^^ Yes part of that is on my home page! One of my favorites amendments. Are we debating the Constitution?

Sadly we are in the “shitstorm period” of American History.

@Dig_Dug, well, I hope people read it and understand that it’s about preventing Congress from legislating against the freedom of speech and the rest. It says nothing about governors and universities, private religious schools, or other entities and their prohibitions.

Not that such speech shouldn’t be protected, just that you won’t find that protection in the First Amendment.

I think DeSantis is a louse.

However, I will not be adopting any of Trump’s crude nicknames for him or anyone else.

@Jeruba I just wondered since you were the one to bring up the Constitution. Unless I missed something up there. (if I did, sorry) I know it means a wall of separation between church and state, which seems to elude so many people for some reason. They replace wall with bridge silly people. They forget we left and fought king George over this exact thing (the reason we came over here in the first place) Some people aren’t to up on America’s founding history.

@Dig_Dug, I wasn’t. It’s in the OP’s details, and questioned by @filmfann, which is why I posted it. And separation of church and state was originally meant to keep government out of the church’s business, not the other way around.

@Jeruba I disagree. Separation of church and state was to keep religion out of the country’s politics (so the US would not have another situation similar to that of King Henry VIII, IMO). Actually, it works both ways.

Well, @kritiper, I wasn’t expressing my opinion but relating what I’ve read, which included this book: Roger Williams and the Creation of the American Soul: Church, State, and the Birth of Liberty

Resources such as those you’ll find if you Google the terms “roger williams” and “separation of church and state” lead to statements such as this quote:

Williams thought church and state should be separate to preserve integrity of the church. Unlike Thomas Jefferson who would follow, Williams did not wish to separate church and state primarily to preserve the peace and purity of the state but rather to preserve the peace and integrity of the church. Source

At any rate, the text of the First Amendment is a constraint on the legislation of Congress and not some sort of quasi-universal guarantee; that was my point.

I wonder what kind of Toxic Soup they will brew this week?

”to preserve the peace and integrity of the church” lol! Now that’s rich!

Hiding behind the Church!!
Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition

^^ LOL! nice :)

Well this is the same guy who was telling black people what they could and couldn’t teach on black history courses in case it upset white people.

Mein Führer DeSantis winning the hearts and minds of mother ‘Merica!

In a radio interview Friday, Agriculture Commissioner Nikki Fried drew parallels between Gov. Ron DeSantis and German dictator Adolf Hitler.

I teach at a public university in FL. I had to sign an oath to the state constitution to get my job. Much higher up, @blackwater_park stated that students don’t learn critical thinking at universities. That is completely false.

I received a graduate degree from FL and my oldest is getting a graduate degree in FL. My youngest children went to public school in FL until January, when I pulled them out because their needs were not being met.

I am highly afraid, as are people around me, that degrees from public schools in FL will become increasingly meaningless. I would encourage any of my students to get a job out of state, if possible, to stay employable in the future.

And there we have it. Thank you @Cupcake

Ironically, DeSantis has degrees from two of the most prestigious private universities in the country. So sad to me that he plays to the far right in this way.

^^There is no irony in the merging of ambition and douchebaggery.

Expected from Lord and Lady Douchebag!

We couldn’t have a government without a Douchebag!

“Christians are terrified their kids will be “turned away from God” politicians know this and play the angle of stopping that in conjunction with dampening some of the nonsense in humanities going on right now”
...and there ladies and gentlemen is the problem! Let’s not address the nonsense in their religion, oh no! Let’s address and suppress the sense in expanding your mind!

Where is the separation of church and state?

^ I’m not sure where you’ll find those words, but it will not be the U.S.Constitution.

^^ It is urged in the First Amendment.

@SnipSnip Jeruba made it easy for you to read it above. She quoted the First Amendment in full which is a part of our Constitution.

Congress shall make no law ”respecting an establishment” of religion, right there is the glaringly obvious WALL of separation

@Cupcake, how long ago did you get your degree? The level of critical thinking being taught now is shockingly less than it was 20 years ago. I never really left school, I have been a part-time student throughout my entire adult life in STEM, business and in the arts and sciences. It is different now. The quality of education is disturbingly poor compared to just 20 years ago.

@Blackwater_Park I’ve gotten four degrees in the past 23 years. I disagree. I actually think we expect more creativity, problem solving, critical thinking, and application of knowledge now than ever.

I agree with @Cupcake
I too have been in higher learning degreed programs over the past 30 years and still am.
I also have been in corporate positions most of my career.
There is an ever increasing expectation on students and those in the workplace to be more creative and show a higher level of critical thinking versus even 10 years ago.
I think there is a greater gap amongst people who have achieved higher education than those who do not. Some of the issue lies in that ever widening gap.

I wish (really) I could agree with you both but sadly, I do not. I have watched the erosion of expectations advance almost every year. Particularly in the humanities. I have also seen those expectations be forcibly lowered out of necessity in the workplace, especially for new STEM graduates.

@Blackwater_Park and why do you think that is the case?

I’m not sure on why it has happened in all cases. In STEM, particularly engineering, the pace of technology necessitates that students gain a more general education that gives an overview of things rather than getting into the “bug dust.” When they leave school many are asked to support all this legacy tech that we still use and they’re often back at ground zero. In other words, since we can’t teach them everything, we just summarize most of it and graduates are worse off than if we had made them get into the complexities of some of it. They’re not learning to do very complex things like they used to. When we have new engineers in the last five years or so we have had to train them on the very rock bottom basics. We never had to do that before. It does not seem to matter where they graduated from or what their GPA was either. The good news is they do learn fast when we train them.

In humanities, the publish or perish environment and some political meddling has sent it down a strange path. Perhaps this is why here. Last few courses I had felt more like cult indoctrination than classical education. Sure we learned some stuff, but I left deeply concerned about the learning environment. The garbage papers that are being published, sheesh.

Across the board there is an obvious lowering of the bar. Not easily seen on paper though. GPA requirements may stay the same but when you have GPA ranges above 4.0 and there is rampant grade inflation in High Schools essentially anyone can get into college. Not that it’s a bad thing, but we don’t want to dilute secondary education. There seems to be more pressure just to pass people along and to give higher grades. Getting a “C” is almost unheard of when 30 years ago in some classes that was a good grade when there may have only been one A (if any) awarded with perhaps two B’s out of a class of say 30.

Since COVID, online and/or remote classes have made most programs cookie cutter, check off box style learning. Cheating is rampant and hard to police. The back and forth interaction with other students and the instructor is generally missing. The people that went to school during COVID and we are just hiring truly scare me. It is not their fault either.

@Blackwater_Park Thank you for the detailed response. I too have experienced this in the Technology side of the Industry. Hire someone and give them the tedious garbage with minimum shadowing. Management thinks everything is solved by a senior writing a KB or a RunBook and walking away from it. Very frustrating on the grads not to say myself.
On the learning side I see the scenario you point out about earning your grade. I have some professors that are from the old school and grade correctly and throw it back for a resubmit. Others just give easy A’s and make you feel good to keep you coming back with your wallet open. I’ll take the school of hard knocks anyway.
I appreciate your insight and discussion.

I too miss the days of busting your ass for a C and being happy to get it.

@JLeslie my former governor, Larry Hogan, is now saying that he will not run for the presidency. He did a good job by us Marylanders during COVID, but after that he became a lot more wishy-washy and tried to play both sides of the fence. I’m a Democrat, but I still liked the guy until he started doing that. He did speak out against Trump a lot and we appreciated that. It could be that he came to his senses though, because I don’t think he would have gotten enough votes in the primary election to become the candidate.

@LifeQuestioner I’m not sure what you mean by wishy washy. He’s always seemed pragmatic to me. He was a Republican elected in a very blue state.

He has consistently denounced the fringe lunatics in the Republican Party. He even said the Democrat will win the gubernatorial race in MD, because the Republican candidate was terrible.

I saw him last weekend on one of the TV shows, and he said he decided not to run, because it would split the field more and give Trump more chance of winning. I’m paraphrasing here. He said any Republican considering running for president should think long and hard about why they are running and if they think they can really win and do the job well. He said if you are running just to get your name out there don’t do it.

Most Democrats I know in MD were overall pleased with Hogan. Republicans seemed a little split, but the Republicans I know in Maryland I disagree with a lot and they say things that don’t ring true for me in MD.

For instance: A few years ago a friend who lives there was saying public schools are brain washing kids politically. I asked him if it had changed from when we were in school, and did he feel politically influenced by any of our teachers or know which party a teacher was associated with. No answer. Changed the topic. He has children in the MoCo school system. Most of what they believe and get upset about simply isn’t true. Honestly, this particular friend I can’t believe he wound up being a Republican. In his family he is more of the get along guy, and not extreme, but just seems very influenced by his brothers who became big time Republicans.

@JLeslie I agree with much of what you said, but towards the end of his second term, he was sitting on the fence with more and more issues, because he was trying to pander to both parties. It’s one of the reasons why people were sure he was going to run for president. I do appreciate his decision and his reasoning for why he isn’t going to run for president right now, but I definitely saw that change in him towards the end. He ended up alienating a number of Democrats who might have considered voting for him, wow the other side just saw him as a RINO.

@LifeQuestioner I don’t question what you saw. You are in the state, so you see more of him. Maybe he wouldn’t have run if Trump hadn’t announced? He can still come back if he wants to enter the race. If something changed drastically in the Republica field.

@JLeslie no, I think he’s not running because Trump announced. I think he was considering a run if Trump hadn’t announced. I mean, he did get a lot of good publicity in Maryland and in other states with how he handled the COVID crisis. I think he even served on some sort of committee of governors that were working to minimize effects as much as possible. One thing I do miss that he provided, that our new governor doesn’t seem to do, is he was regularly posting updates on Twitter. Or rather, whoever had that task as assigned by him. On the other hand it could just be Twitter being screwed up, but I’ve been on the new governor’s page, and he doesn’t seem to post stuff very much.

@LifeQuestioner That’s what I meant, I have a typo. I also think if Trump had not announced Hogan might have run, but I think he would not have announced this early even if he was going to run.