Can the Government, any Government come up with a law that punishes people that commit crimes with guns, and not punish the law abiding gun owner?

The ATF has reported for many many years that the VAST majority of firearms used in crimes come from two sources:

1) Straw purchases (where someone eligible to own a gun buys one for someone who would fail the background check).
2) Corrupt FFL gun dealers who are selling guns out the back of the store.

Both of these are already illegal, and both laws are poorly enforced. The problem with the straw purchase thing is that it’s often a girlfriend who is under implicit or explicit threat if they don’t comply and buy the boyfriend a gun. So the ATF and other locales tend not to do much about straw purchases.

There are honest gun dealers who will tell you that it’s EXTREMELY easy to spot a straw purchase in progress. And many of them have reported them to the cops as they’re happening. They have no legal right to refuse the purchase to the law abiding woman, but you can see her nervousness and uncertainty. But the cops generally don’t act on them. So the FFL dealers stop reporting them since they know nobody will do anything.

The corrupt firearms dealers are harder to spot. There have been some high profile stings, but not that many. It doesn’t take a genius to figure out what store a particular gun’s serial number came from, and when a whole bunch all came from the same store, it doesn’t take a genius to figure out what’s happening. And yet, big busts of corrupt FFL dealers are very rare. I’ve never heard a policy explanation for why the way I have for why they don’t enforce against straw purchases.

I will also add a third thing. The fact is that most of the gun violence in America is an offshoot of the gang war that exists in almost every city which itself is an offshoot of the drug war. Want to cause US gun violence to plummet almost overnight? Turn off the money spigot that motivates it and legalize recreational drugs, using the money for harm reduction policies instead. The gang wars will dry up and so will the violence. I’m not saying there will never be any violence or other crime, but it will go WAY down.

There ARE laws which make sentences harsher for crimes committed involving a weapon.

Unfortunately, too many judges sentence too light irregardless of circumstances.

That sounds good to me! I believe criminals should get the maximum penalty’s always. Home invaders should be executed. Break into my home and I have a pump Maverick 12 gauge shotgun with your name on it.

Yes, from a different perspective. I would raise funding for mental health issues, the earlier the better. Also career, relationship, and life skills counseling; so people don’t think that they ruined their life, if they fail out of school/university, dumped, from a bad breakup, and fired , from a minimum wage job so that are not as crippling.

The flaw in the logic in penalizing after a firearm has been used in the commission of a crime is that it is too late.

You penalize after any crime has been committed.
Do you charge a fast car for speeding or do you charge the driver?
See where I am having a problem with your flawed logic?
Do you charge the alcohol for someone being drunk and disorderly,or do you charge the person?

It’s hard to charge for a crime before it’s committed.

@Dig_Dug all anti gunners think all you have to do is outlaw guns and there will be peace and love throughout the land.

Wouldn’t that be so nice?! But I do believe if you use a gun to commit a crime you should have an additional punishment added to your time.

@SQUEEKY2 ”...You penalize after any crime has been committed.”

By that logic, then there should be no restrictions on anyone getting a gun at any time. But you want your skeet gun and your target pistol, so it is okay for the wacko down the street to get an assault weapon.

You lump me as “anti-gunner”; I am not anti gun, but they should be tightly controlled. And the 2nd Amendment should be repealed.

Good grief, of course there should be restrictions background checks, safe storage, like here in Canada I think people should have a license to buy and possess a firearm having completed the right safety courses for whatever gun they want to own and use.
Just like you have to have a driver’s license to drive a car.
So by what you are saying no one should own a super fast car because they MIGHT speed with it?
Everyone is penalized after committing a crime ,show me where they are penalized before committing a crime.

@SQUEEKY2 You’re creating a straw man argument just so you can vent. Hardly anybody in the States is saying no guns should be allowed for anyone. Gun control or gun sense is just what it says it is – and what you say you are for. I think you just like to rant about things.

@janbb I think @SQUEEKY2 may be referring to this ”And the 2nd Amendment should be repealed.” by @zenvelo

@janbb “Hardly anybody in the States is saying no guns should be allowed for anyone.”

Don’t look at North Carolina, the GOP state Congress wants anyone that can pass the Federal level to get a gun including wife beaters and people that have mental issues known to local police. . . . also they want to let guns into schools . . places of worship and other places that post guns are “BANNED” !

@Tropical_Willie I think you misunderstood what I said or maybe I didn’t say it clearly enough. The OP said in his original details that “anti-gunners want all guns banned” and I was saying that isn’t a position that many/if any “gun-sense” people hold.

Gun sense people no,but alot of anti-gunners scream the public shouldn’t have guns at all.
Because a sicko shoots up a school or night club no one should own a gun,hence the law abiding gun owner gets punished.

Since this question has gotten off the rails a bit I want to ask any gun owners that see this, why do you own a gun?
All of mine have been bought for , target practice, competitions, and sport, I have never owned a gun for protection or felt I needed it for protection.

@janbb is right, @SQUEEKY2. You just love this rant. “Anti gunners” is a group so small that it doesn’t really register on the meter, and the very few that I know are not so stupid as to believe that outlawing guns will eliminate them. <eyeroll>
You sound like my BIL who, after Sandy Hook, sent me a number of emails saying that liberals were using it as a platform to make responsible gun owners look bad. That was his take away.
Like you, he is childless and lives in BC. You guys should get together and discuss how difficult it is to be without the various restrictions and problems of living in the US.

And, @Dig_Dug, please understand that repealing the 2nd Amendment would not not impact the gun trade, but would simply alter some of the parameters.

@canidmajor I’m not sure what you mean. If the second amendment was repealed, that would drastically change a lot of things.

@Dig_Dug Please read more carefully. The gun trade would continue, but there would be a few changes in how it was handled.

”A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed”

Okay maybe I’m not grasping something here BUT if you do away with the second amendment aren’t you doing away with ALL this stuff above? You just took all the weapons away from the state police, city police, security guards, all lawful citizens, highway patrol, everyone EXCEPT the federal government owned military. (and the criminals) You just made us Nazi Germany.

@Dig_Dug Nope, it doesn’t mean all the guns go away. But it means we can regulate them, like Australia does.

Canada just recently froze all handguns,if you own them you can keep and continue to use them but you can’t buy any ,sell any or even give them away you can surrender to the government if you choose but that’s it,l have no idea how that will reduce crime but the anti gunners love it.

^^ I bet the gun dealers love that! Just put them out of business along with all the things that go with them.

Yeah the dealers are quite upset, my rant is with this freeze you can’t attract new people to the shooting sport, and people don’t realize these guns are very expensive, some are family heirlooms been in the family for decades now even family member can’t inherit them if the owner was to pass away.

Canada may have created some kind of “black” market, I see some bad things happening with that!

Exactly!!! But the anti-gunners think it will bring peace and love throughout the land.^^^^

Policing will be difficult with the abundance of 3D printed guns. They are about to swarm the world.

Anyone (and everyone) over the age of 18 should be properly trained to use a firearm, and should be required to carry one.

@kritiper I would have to disagree with that! To require everyone is a brush far too broad!