If MSNBC, FoxNews, The View, and other shows that talk politics are reading this what do you want to tell them?

My latest annoyance is someone needs to inform Sara on The View that the word Nationalism is not a good thing to a very many of us. Most people do don’t use Nationalism synonymously with patriotism. It’s a scary word; anyone who lived through Nazi Germany will tell you why.

I mention is because she was saying Christian Nationalism or White Nationalism is bad, but Nationalism is a good. She doesn’t get it.

@JLeslie I still don’t ‘get it’ either.

You know my grandfather helped liberate camps and I have the utmost respect for the Jewish people.

My flag is out every day and always will be in respect for our country for helping, and service men/women who helped end that terrible period in history.
Over 550k Jews also fought in WW2, they deserve that respect as well. Imagine a world in which the US did not help.

@KNOWITALL You don’t get why nationalism scares people? Is that what you mean by not getting it? I don’t doubt your patriotism and I know that you don’t want to see anyone hurt or any minorities used as scapegoats.

@JLeslie Was the Mexican revolution bad? Or the Haitian revolution? Or the American Revolution? Historically in these examples of nationalism the result was positive and beneficial.
I truly don’t understand why you allow ypurself to continue to believe all nationalism is negative. This is one of many conversations about this and in every single one your connotation was negative. It concerns me and saddens me.

@KNOWITALL It’s because of how you define it vs how other people define. I found this article it might help.

I was raised being told that the Germans were too much nationalists, they put country before their morality and their natural instinct of right and wrong. They followed the country leader into the evil abyss. Some of them were White Supremacists or white nationalists, basically the same thing, but some were average people following along and putting aside or brainwashed into feeling what they were doing was ok or right.

If you get at to the Arnold Schwarzenegger documentary (highly recommend) he talks about his father and how being Nazi ruined him. He talks about how it ruined many men. The Germans were defeated and the men had to live with what they had done to other human beings. They were Nationalists in my mind, different than loving your country and having patriotism to your country.

An analogy I can give is when Biden said Obama was articulate and there was a big uproar, at first I didn’t understand it. I have been told I speak well, that I am articulate, we said it about speakers and trainers who came to my job and I always took it as a compliment. If I said it about a Black person I would say it as a compliment. The problem is, the Black person often hears it very differently, because of what they group has been through over the generations. I just have to accept that and be sensitive to it. I have explained to more than one Black person that we white people say those things with each other, so I believe when Biden said it, he was saying it like he would about anyone, but now we know as a society how that hurts some people.

Also, the confederate flag is another example. I know Southerners who feel it is a symbol of being Southern or in honor of their family who fought for the South. I even know Northerns who used to wear and fly confederate flags because they thought they were cute and the people they hung out with did it. When I see that flag I don’t know if those people want to kill me. It is the flag of the WS. I understand that everyone who likes and flies the flag is not a WS, but they need to understand how it affects a lot of people.

It’s unfortunate. I understand the frustration of losing a symbol, the changes in language, and when things are being misinterpreted. I feel like the QAnon, WS, extremists have practically taken the US flag away from us. I have all sorts of red white and blue for American holidays and wear the flag other times. My husband had a huge Mexican Flag and American Flag he used to hang in the garage and when we bought a house with a flag holder on the outside wall he wanted to buy a US flag for it. Now, I feel like if I wear a flag it is so political and people probably assume I am a Trumper. It is like they warped the meaning of me just showing I love my country and I am grateful to people who founded it, fought for it, and for being able to be here.

Lastly, I want to stay that I hate that I think some Christians don’t understand what Christian Nationalists are. I didn’t understand at first, and I hate the term. I think good Christians who define Nationalists as you do might think Christian Nationalism represents them, but it does not represent you. The CN are WS and are extreme and hateful, and using words to create loyalty and antagonism. Liberals, in my opinion, should not use the term Christian Nationalists either, because I think Christians get offended and think we are talking about the average Christian who is patriotic, but that is not the case.

@JLeslie I feel like you are single-minded in your focus on Germany and Nazi’s and WS. I truly wish you nothing but peace and joy.

But you will never understand who the actual threats are to your people if you continue in this mindset. It’s not about semantics and defonitions, it’s bombs, it’s legitimate threats. I wish you well.

“If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle.”
― Sun Tzu, The Art of War

@KNOWITALL Who do think are the actual enemies? You don’t think it is the people with power who want to kill us and the people who follow them?

Edit: You do realize I am not calling you the enemy because you use the term Nationalist to describe yourself.

We saw Trump encouraging White Supremacists, so voting for a president who does that puts us at risk. I don’t even think Trump is antisemitic himself, I don’t think he would order rounding up the Jewish people, but he encourages people who would love to do it. So, if people vote for him they are creating a bad situation.

What other president in our time talked about Nationalism? Trump is using WS language like a dog whistle. Those hate groups see him as one of them, it was proven on Jan 6. Other Republicans just think it is a benign word or a word that describes their patriotism.

I am not obsessing about the Nazis as in being paranoid, it was after Nazi Germany when the two words (patriotism and nationalism) really began to diverge in common usage as people began to understand how Hitler rose to power.

I’m worried about the division in the country most of all. That is being pushed on both sides. Not Briden in my opinion, but certainly there are people on the left also encouraging division it is not just on the right.

@JLeslie No I know it’s the throwback living a few doors down from you that thinks whites are the best race. That teaches their kids the white race is the best. And there are a LOT of them so politicians pander to them for votes. That reinforces their importance in their minds which empowers them to act, to speak out, to take action.

I lived with them, ate with them and they have their own songs, their own terminology and it’s actually more similar to a religious group than terrorism.

If you wore a gold star, I guarantee you would see what I mean very quickly. As a woman I don’t recommend it but it would be an interesting social experiment so you could actually see who they really are.
I assure you it’s not me regardless of which terminology I use or which flag I fly, which is why your posts make me worry.

@KNOWITALL I said from the start I don’t think it is you. It is about semantics primarily and how it makes me feel. I think the White Nationalists at the top know it is scary to hear for some people and now they have a good ⅓ of the country saying they are Nationalists. It is a psychological thing. They know when Democrats say, “I would never call myself a Nationalist,” that means AGAIN that Republicans can think and say Democrats are not good Americans and don’t love the country and will not fight for the country. That we are not real Patriots. They are manipulating the entire conversation. It happened with not standing for the National Athem. Same type of arguments.

@JLeslie I hate to tell you but Republicans are not all racists and some Democrats are racist. Racism is not that simple.

@KNOWITALL That’s what I said a multiple times on this Q and forever on fluther. I have defended Republicans who voted for Trump. I have said over and over again I have Republicans friends who are not racist, and I don’t think anyone should be saying all Republicans are, or that all people who voted for Trump are. How are you reading that I think or wrote that? I believe most Americans are not racist.

I think probably it is best to let it lie and not bring it up anymore out there in social media and other media and hopefully the conversation goes away. It’s like the war on Christmas, there never was one. I think that finally lightened up.

People like me should not worry about the word Nationalist and just worry about behavior. Hopefully, the word will die off again.

I hope the phrase Christian Nationalist dies off too so real Christians don’t think they are being accused of being racist when no one is thinking that.

@JLeslie I think your world and my world are very different so before I say something I regret, I’ll leave you and your talkshow hosts the floor.
Good day.

You should be obligated to only speak verifiable facts if you are claiming to be a News station, or simply call yourself the Gossip channel. (Though I will say the View is not a news station. It’s mostly opinion and gossip). I know that both claim that at certain hours they have commentary slots, so AKA, not really verified news.

I know fox one time tried to get away with lying by saying that only certain time slots actually delivered news and the other times were purely for entertainment. So they felt they could fudge the truth because they claimed their viewer knew this to be the case.
Well its not the case. Viewers cannot tell the difference because they mix in actual news with propaganda and so viewers can’t tell when it really is verified and when its a lie to gain viewership.

Anyone who would believe the View is an actual news time slot is just an idiot.

So I feel like they should have a disclaimer label on their commentary sections pointing out that not everything they broadcast is factual and verified. And guest speakers’ comments are not verified. Especially make it bold under their biggest liars.

@Pandora Absolutely.

@Pandora 100%! I doubt anyone thinks The View is news, but probably some people get all of their “news” from The View. Lots of people think Fox News is balanced verified news.

@JLeslie The fact that they lost so many lawsuits because they didn’t have actual facts to base their reports on a stolen election should prove to people that Fox verifies crap. They are basically just Tabloid Magazine. They just stop short of Humans being bred by aliens. Though I stopped watching fox years ago. So I don’t know if they have gone that far?

I will say I have never been a fan of tabloid journalism even as a teen. I use to and still believe that people who waste their time buying tabloid news have extremely sad lives and often willingly buy the lies to feel superior, but at least the ones sold by registers across the check out line are sold as being tabloid and not actually called News.
Sadly though even decent newspapers are taking a stab at junk journalism because people want gossip more than facts. As a nation, we did it to ourselves by not really investing our time in verified news and quickly running to our TV sets to watch the next train wreck. And so now just about everyone is doing it.