What's wrong with religious people?

no not harmful. but once the religion has gone away from its principle then it becomes bad . those are call extremies who do not understand the true meaning of a religion

Not sure of your question! Do you mean religious people can be harmful or people who try to talk you into their religion are harmful? If that avatar is your, delightful…..very pretty gal/gal!!! What a great stock of black hair.

I’m not sure I understand the question. I think most often when someone feels passionately about something, it’s part of their repertoire and their opinions and conversations will be influenced by it. I don’t find it harmful, but it can be annoying when people are dogmatic and intolerant of others beliefs.

Nothing is inherently wrong with religious people; anyone can believe whatever silly crap they want to. But when certain ideas based on religious beliefs are put forth in legislation it affects everyone, not just the believer.

Can you come up with a valid secular argument against same-sex marriage?

Can you explain why there are movements to get Creationism taught in public schools?

I am an atheist, but I agree with you that atheists should not proselytize their disbelief. I never do, though I will argue issues here reflecting my non-belief. I am neither proud nor ashamed of being an atheist.

Religious belief or non-belief does not in and of itself have any impact on any other beliefs. For example, there is nothing about belief in God that has any implications about the rightness or wrongness of abortion. It is the specific beliefs of particular religions that cause problems.

I don’t tend to talk about religious matters unless someone asks me (and even then cautiously) or when someone shoves their own religion in my face.

When meeting someone, I try not to judge them by their religion, rather by their actions.

Until the advent of talk show, tell-all television, talking about religion was considered bad manners. This is why; it’s rude and offensive for people to have to defend their beliefs. In general, when someone asks you about religion, the 80/20 rule applies—80% of the time, they’re not interested in your answer, they only want to tell you why your beliefs are not correct.

I could care less what religion a person follows; let them believe what they like. It is when this person tries to force their beliefs upon me that I dislike them.
Knocking on my door at 7am is definitely going to make me believe in your fairy tales.

Nothing is wrong with religious people, per sé. I was religious once myself. And unless someone is legislating my life based upon principles of religion that aren’t mine, or unless it comes up in conversation (like it so often does in Fluther), I don’t really talk about it in the way described in the question.

That said, what’s wrong with people who think that tinfoil hats protect them from mind-reading aliens, or who think that the little plastic strip in American paper money is a radio transmitter that helps the One World Government track the holder of that cash? Well, nothing, I suppose, except it’s a little weird and flaky. I’m happy to let them keep those beliefs, though, if that’s what props up their minds and hearts and lets them get through the day.

There are people to whom religion is a private source of strength and guidance. That’s wonderful. And then there are people for whom religion provides a carrot and a stick to keep them in line, and if someone is prevented from stealing from me because they’re afraid of God’s wrath, that’s wonderful too. And then there are the wacky folks, who are usually the folks that bring religion up in the first place – who are usually the ones I end up chatting with.

How come some religious zealots try to convert the innocent bystander?

Fanaticism in anything is detrimental to the cause.

OK, let me explain the situation that prompted me to ask this question…

I was walking home with someone the other day, and with someone else who lived nearby. Note that it was at about 3:00 AM and we had a couple of beers… Now, one of them was a religious person (and not the crazy fanatic type that tries to convert everybody) and the other person was an atheist (about which I don’t really hear him a lot, though).

Anyway, it ended up in a terribly annoying discussion on whether the religious guy was wrong or right, which prompted me the question “does it matter?”

@laureth – exactly! People wearing tinfoil hats don’t harm anybody, so why try to convince them of your non-tinfoil-hat-stance?

Just like there are religious zealots who try to convert everyone, there are also decent, upstanding ones who don’t – and just like there are zealous atheists who try to smack down religious thought, there are good ones who don’t. We can’t tar all religionists with the same brush, and we can’t tar all atheists with the same brush either.

About the tinfoil hat types – if your life were to be made difficult or needlessly complicated by a belief in a concept that is not based in fact, would you consider it a help to learn of the error in your thinking, or would you prefer to live in fallacy?

For example, my mom claims to be agoraphobic. She has an irrational fear that if she leaves the house, it will catch fire in her absence and burn down. It makes her life very difficult, always needing to get her partner to run the errands, go to the store, bring in income, etc. It also hampers her efforts to make friends and be generally productive. Now, while it’s possible that the house may ignite as soon as she leaves the yard, I believe it’s improbable. Getting rid of that belief would enhance her life. However, should she be allowed to keep her irrational fear intact, or should she try to shed it? The choice is hers, but I wish she’d get help.

I think that’s the tinfoil-hat and religious-zealot concept, too. If an irrational, untrue thought is limiting life, is it doing the person a favor to humor them, to accept it as “just their quirk”? Or do we have a duty to help clear up these things, to spread the light of truth instead of the darkness of fear? The only difference between wacky tinfoil hat types and wacky religious types is, for me, that one is widely seen as freakish and the other one is steeped in tradition and has a wide basis of social acceptance and respect.

@bythebay…I agree with your statement about intolerance of others beliefs…

Everyone loves their own flavor. We all like to consider ourselves, for the most part, tolerant and open minded. Unfortunatly, the human ego tends to override these qualities. When confronted with something totally at odds with how we percieve things we go into defense mode and rationalize our negative response and censorship as the ‘right’ thing. Or ‘the exception that proves the rule’ never really understood that one we need to decide whether we believe in true freedom of speech and expression or not.

@Blondesjon – Here you go. Basically, we learn that rules exist when something pops up to go against it.

I think my dad put it best when he said that no one knows anything when it comes to religion – no one has died and come back to tell us what’s out there. So anyone else’s guess is as good as mine. I just hate it when some people insist that they know, like most organized religions do, because they had a prophet who talked to God, or something of the sort. Bullsh**! You don’t know, I don’t know, and so it’s just a matter of faith.

@laureth…Thank you for the amazing link. I see a few more hours a week being devoured by the web.

I can relate to what @Vinifera7 says regarding the influence of religion on public policy. It’s disconcerting knowing that we , through our leaders, are making decisions that will determine not only the direction of our country, but ultimately of the world, and yet we’re at a fundamental disagreement about the very nature of reality.

The majority of Americans, to varying degrees, subscribe to assumptions about reality that aren’t at all evident to the minority of non-believers, and those assumptions can have profound policy implications. I recall the flap a few years back about how US foreign policy toward the Middle East was influenced by the views of some fundamentalist Christian politicians regarding the “end of days” prophecies. As a non-believer, that scares the hell out of me, as does predicating our environmental policy on the assumption that our days on Earth are numbered anyway.

It’s as if our society were forging through the wilderness with some using one map of the terrain, and others using a different map. The map used by the majority (who end up getting to choose the path) shows all kinds of fantastic features that don’t appear on the other map, including a destination that sounds highly improbable. The minority understandably is a bit nervous about this and wants a serious discussion about where that map came from and why it should be believed.

I’m atheist and could give a damn what others believe. I certainly don’t try to “convert” anybody. Religion is personal. All I ask is that overly religious people keep their religion to themselves and stop telling me that I’m wrong and going to Hell.

I just want to add that the polemic between non-believers and fundamentalists catches a lot of wonderful, perfectly level-headed religious folks in the cross-fire. I feel truly sorry for people, like our Judi, who model the essence of religion as a personal path, because they get unfairly splashed with all the muck.

Absolutely. Judi’s one of my favorite Christians ever!

@laureth – that’s only the comparison. Is it reasonable to think you’re helping that guy I was talking about by trying to make him lose his faith?

@Harp – in the US, non-religious people are actually a minority? 0.o

@Vincentt Yep, 92% of Americans profess a belief in God.

@harp…What percentage if that 92 follow a “godly” path. How many of those if pressed further would admit they believe in “some kind of higher power not necessarily God”? There is still a stigma attached to professing non-belief in the country’s smaller communities.

I question that percentage.

I do not think that atheists are commanded to evangelize the world. Christians are charged to evangelize the world. Most atheists that I know, do not wear it on their sleeve like Christians do.

That was one poorly worded question, if there even was a question in there….

Harp——here is the quote that you misrepresented: The study detailed Americans’ deep and broad religiosity, finding that 92 percent believe in God or a universal spirit—including one in five of those who call themselves atheists.
To say that 92% of Americans believe in God is a blatant and deliberate misrepresentation.
A universal spirit—yes. The Christian depicted God—no thank you.

@Mizuki – it was poorly worded indeed, see my clarification above.

@Mizuki We’re getting into some pretty murky semantic waters here. I never said that 92% believe in “the Christian depicted God”. The word “God” does not necessarily mean the anthropomorphic God of the Bible. Your “universal spirit” fits the definition of God for many people. The first definition of God in my dictionary is “The supreme or ultimate reality”. Most Christians embellish that definition quite a bit. You don’t. But that doesn’t make your spirit any less “God”, does it?

I understand the urge to distance oneself from the “old man with the beard” brand of God. If you want to do that by discarding the word “God” altogether, that’s fine by me. You’re not alone. But to say I’m deliberately “misrepresenting” the findings because I don’t respect the same semantic distinction is a bit of a stretch.

The article takes a look at that distinction: “Smith said some people may identify with the term atheist or agnostic without fully understanding the definition, or they have a negative view of organized religion, even though they believe in God.

David Phillips, 57, a Bethesda receiving clerk who considers himself a humanist—meaning he does not embrace the concept of a supernatural being—does not believe in a God who is an “actual person.” But Phillips does believe in a “spirit—a spirit within you.”

“God is a symbol that everybody can relate to,” Phillips said. “They look to it as a visual thing. But, actually, God is inside of them.”

This guy would fall into the “universal spirit” camp because he doesn’t believe in an external god. But even he acknowledges that his version is just a different flavor of god.

@Blondesjon To answer your question, I found a 1999 Gallup poll that breaks it down this way:

86% responded affirmatively to “You believe in God”
8% responded affirmatively to “You don’t believe in God, but you do believe in a universal spirit or higher power”

my imaginary friend is much more interesting than anyone else’s imaginary friend. I didn’t say better, wiser, more correct or anything judgmental. Simply interesting. My imaginary friend is a 300-foot tall female with six breasts. this is a personal opinion and in no way denegrates or puts down the belief system of any other person on fluther.

nothing wrong as long as they do not assume everyone else is wrong.

I think religious beliefs are a very personal thing, and am surprised by even the mere notion of ’‘mass’’ (as in mass praying). People should not preach either way.

Harp—I get your point. The reason I objected to your post is that, depending on the wording, any assertion that 92% of Americans Believe in a Higher Power, becomes 92% of Americans are Christians slipery slope—next you know it, they want to shove their commandments up my *** and want my kids praying to someone’s version of god, ect.

Your point is well taken. Belief in God does not assume one is a Christian, does not assume that the vast majority of Americans are Christians. Out side the Moron Crescent that runs from West Virginia south through Dixie and then west into Idaho (credit to Kunstler)the vast majority of Americans are not Christians, at least out side of the Crescent.

A certain portion of the ones that “believe in a higher power” in whatever statistical survey is being conducted are some kind of sweeping theists or “spiritual” people (whatever that means).

“A higher power” is a completely vague description which people can place any meaning on. I am not surprised in the slightest that such a high percentage believe in “a higher power”.

Perhaps if a survey could be devised that established strict criteria for finding what percentage can define what they are calling “god”, we might find that the results are shockingly low.

Well, keep in mind that 81% also believe in heaven, which is pretty consistent with a belief in a classic God. This poll result breaks it down demographically.