If the reason for your divorce was because of infidelity, would there ever be justification in telling that to your children?

I don’t see why children would need to know those sorts of details.

Some things are simply none of the kid’s business.

Perhaps when they are adults, perhaps never. Kids who are still children should absolutely not be told negative things about either parent. A divorce will be hard enough on them without being told these things.

The best thing is simply explain that it has nothing to do with them, but that you guys simply can’t live together any longer, especially if they are young. If they are older and start asking perceptive questions, then you can say more, but I would keep it non-judgmental, as in “Your mother needs to live a different way than I do so we have decided to separate.”

Anything else would be hard to explain with out the temptation of demonizing her creeping in.

And you want to punish your children by destroying their affection for their mother because you think this will make them love you more?

I have no idea why my parents divorced. Yes I was certainly aware they had problems, but I’m glad they never told me why.

What’s your reason for letting them know? I think you should work from there. Your question now seems to indicate that you want to tell them and you want a reason. It should be the other way around.

Agreed with @Darwin on how you should explain this. It’s a horrible thing for a child to deal with one of their parents cheating on the other, please don’t expose them to that unnecessarily.

When I was 30, my mother told me that my father had been cheating on her since I was three. It devastated me. I was 30! Imagine what this would do to a young child. Please don’t tell them.

Do not involve your children! It does nothing more than upset and hurt the child no matter what age they are.

Wow, that can be so damaging. No, this is anger speaking, not common sense. That would hurt your children and I’m sure you really don’t want to hurt them, right?

Yes, there are signs, you don’t have the proof and to even suggest it without proof – not that you should ever tell them is even more irresponsible than to just make the decision to tell them in the first place.

My first husband cheated, he even introduced my daughter to one of the girlfriends…my daughter has asked, but I’ve never told her exactly what was the last straw. He said he used to live in fear of me telling her, but then he really started believing that I would never hurt our daughter like that – it really has nothing to do with him, it has everything to do with our daughter.

Don’t do it. Not only is it harmful, it’s not the sole reason for the problems – it’s just the final straw.

Your children did not ask to be born (or adopted) into your marriage. They bear no responsibilty for the mistakes you or your wife make. They are not your friends, your confidants, or your therapist.

They are yours to raise, teach and protect selflessly – independent of whatever stupid, immature or selfish things you and your wife may choose to do to each other.

PS: if she really is cheating on you, I’m really sorry to hear that

Telling your kids that instantly makes them pawns in your marital struggle. That’s not for their benefit, it’s for yours.

I understand your desire to tell them the truth…but whatever the truth is it is YOUR truth and may not be that of your wife and will not be that for your children, necessarily…as they will put their own life experiences on it and conclude things that you may not have wanted them to conclude…as in ‘did mom cheat because there were marriage troubles or because she was tired once we, the kids, came into the picture and she wanted to get away?’ – you can see where they can make it about themselves and get upset…

I’ve never told my grown daughters about their mother’s affairs, but I think they’ve figured it out on their own by her actions with relationships she’s had since our divorce.
Infidelity isn’t something that should be discussed with your kids. That’s between you, your SO, and whatever third party is involved.

First of all, I personally don’t feel infidelity is a good enough reason for a divorce. But that’s just me. It’s obviously a good enough reason to break up with a girlfriend, but a family with children is so much complicated, and the cost to everyone is much higher than that of living with a person who’s cheated on you. Plus there are so many much worse things someone could do to you, and trust me I know.

Secondly, if you do file for divorce (I’d just say comfront your wife with the accusations and see what happens), then eventually I think the children should be told the truth. Not in the sense of telling a 4-year-old that “I divorced your mum because she’s a slut that cheated on me” but eventually when your kids are older and keep asking, saying that it was due to infidelity and making it sound as if it’s not such a big deal, but caused strain on your relationship. And stress that this does not mean she’s a bad parent.

Whatever you do, never say bad things about their mother to your kids. Not only is it immoral, but it will ALWAYS backfire. My ex is the worst monster you could ever imagine, yet I have never said one bad word about her to my daughter. My daughter has been terrified of her mother ever since she was 1, and is currently receiving psychiatric treatment as a result of her mother’s abusive behaviour. And I still don’t accuse her (well eventually she’ll be old enough to read this and find out anyway).

I agree with @Jack79—the issue of infidelity is more about you and your wife, and with some counseling you can work that out. If there is any way to save a marriage once children are involved, I would do what you can. And if you decide your pride is so damaged and you can’t even consider working your problems out, what on earth good reason would there be to bring in the children? This is about you two, and you two are the grown-ups.

It is crucial that the children hate the offending spouse.

Absolutely not, under any circumstances. If they figure it out when they’re older that’s one thing, but you cannot be the source of this information.

I have a friend whose husband was cheating with a neighbor. My friend never expected her husband was cheating, because the neighbor was gay and in a relationship with her partner for over fifteen years. The husband admitted to the wife what had been going on, broke up with the lady, and they tried and succeeded in putting their marriage back together. One day their child was riding a bike when the neighbor called her over and told her everything. She was only ten. This devastated the child. She had adored her father, and then she hated him. She had to go into counseling. She tolerates her dad , but things will never be the same. It has been a hard road for this family, but they are slowly working it through.
Cheating takes such a toll on everyone in a family. Keeping this information from a child is so important. You owe your child this selfless act.

My husband told our 22 year old daughter that he had been having an affair for over 10 years, and she’s in counseling because of it. Not so much the affair, but because he felt it necessary to confide in her.

My friend, although YOU say the marriage broke up because she’s cheating, SHE’LL tell the children it was because you couldn’t satisfy her in bed. Or that you didn’t know how to make love.

Are you sure you want to tell them YOUR reason in such detail? Just say the two of you went different ways, yada, yada, yada. BE VAGUE!

Actually, her reasoning for cheating may have nothing to do with sex. It may have to do with emotional abandonment, or a whole host of other issues. I think men tend to cheat because of sexual performance or disinterest, women more often cheat because of other more complex issues.

My point was that SHE will blame HIM for the divorce the way he’s blaming HER. She’s not gonna say “Dad’s right. I cheated.”

Always present your wife in the best possible way to your children. After all, she is a part of them. In their heads, it effects their self esteem if their mom is a cheatin’ whore.
Even if your wife bad mouths you to them, never bad mouth her. I promise, in time you will be the one they respect as they grow and see her true colors. Always keep the high road when it comes to your kids. You are the best example of acting with dignity they have.

@Judi- You said it perfectly. And I can tell you from my own personal experience that by doing what you say you will get the respect.

I find it strange that children find out about a parent cheating, and that devastates them and they have to go into counseling. Why does that make them go into counseling? Cheating is just a symptom of something far deeper. Why doesn’t that deeper thing require counseling? Or is it just that the information about cheating finally uncovers that deeper thing?

If children need to deal with their parent’s separation, and if the news about cheating is what gets them to deal with it, then isn’t it a disservice to not tell them? Otherwise, they’re living in pain, and not knowing what it’s all about. Therapy can’t even help them. To not tell them, is to torture them, and deny them a chance to heal.

I think we are deluded if we think we are doing our kids a favor by not telling them. I think we’re just trying to get ourselves off the hook. We don’t want to do something where we have to be honest with our kids and face the music from them. And that, of course, means that we want a relationship with our children that is based on lies.

The least we can do, is to tell them, and then answer their questions honestly. They’ll be furiously angry. They’ll want to know why. But this is real world information they need in order to learn how to live their own lives and have a chance at being healthy, emotionally.

I think we owe it to our children to explain our behavior. Not when they are kids, though. Maybe during college or after. I think we owe it to them to not by hypocritical. If we cheat, how can we tell our kids that cheating is bad? As @Jack79 said, infidelity is not grounds for a divorce. Irreconcilable emotional distance and hatred are grounds for divorce, and that, only after several attempts to close the distance again.

Oh well. There I go again. Seeing things in a different light. In a way, I always did know that I was crazy.

I know this is a tangent
but cheating, to me, is a perfectly good reason to divorce
because it breaks trust and if that’s broken, at least for me, there’s no reason to torture yourself
even if kids are involved
we’re not to live for our kids only
we’re to live for ourselves and our kids
and doing a disservice to ourselves is not doing a service to our kids

It is an interesting debate that I imagine will never be resolved. My girlfriend would agree with you Simone. And actually most of the people I know. I belong to the opposite side.

What I wonder whenever I have that type of discussion is why we disagree. Does it have to do with the way we were brought up, our parents’ values, whether we come from divorced families, etc? I still haven’t managed to put my finger on it, but I’d like to have a statistical analysis of it, because there are two clear-cut views on this, and there is no apparent reason (religious, political, gender, age) for picking one or the other side.

@Jack79
i think it has to do with individuality, ideas of sacrifice and whether children made in a relationship should come before the parents that made them…it’s about whether you consider yourself as a person as well as your children or whether you think that once you’ve procreated, you take a back seat and your responsibility is to your offspring…I just don’t think my children hold more value than myself…doesn’t mean they hold less but I also don’t think a divorce is something they can’t recover from especially if they’re served by two bio parents that are much better at raising them separately than they are at raising them together…or when a parent that keeps the child is better at raising them with a step parent than when they were with the other bio parent..as is the case in my family…my ex husband wasn’t really a big presence in his son’s life both when we were married and after we divorced…so it didn’t affect the baby much…he was a baby…and we divorced over other reasons…and it was the right thing to do

@Simone_De_Beauvoir I know the arguments for that position and I think it is a valid one, even though I value my daughter more than anything (and personally I did everything else before she came along so I’ve consciously dedicated the rest of my life to her and her needs). I’m not really interested in discussing the issue itself, mainly because it has to do with how people feel and not some sort of rational debate where you can prove the other person wrong. It would never end and nobody would change their minds. I was only wondering what people’s background is that leads them to either one or the other side of this fence.

It’s a bit like asking “why do you like red?” I don’t expect an answer saying “because it’s the best colour” but rather something along the lines of “my first toy was red. My brother’s was green and he likes green”.

Incidentally, my gf feels guilty sometimes because she thinks I love my daughter more than she loves hers (I have certainly done a lot more for mine than she’d ever do for hers). But it’s not a competition. I don’t mean to make other parents feel bad. Each relationship is unique, and we all give our children what we can. If a marriage is killing you and making you a bad parent as a result, then a divorce is the best choice even for the child. But I chose to put up with anything in order to avoid divorce, and even today I can see that things only got worse afterwards, so in my case it would have been right. And I would have been a lot happier knowing my daughter is well, even if it meant giving up everything else. But I don’t expect anyone else to do the same just because I believe it would have been the right choice for my case.

@Jack79
well to answer why I feel this way I’d say that it is, in part, due to how my mother (dad never a big part) made her entire life about us (my brother passed away) and as a result raised me to be ALWAYS next to her, as she has NOTHING else to live for, blah blah blah…it always held me back and I vowed never to be this way with my kids…I vowed to have love and interests and a future beyond them so that they never feel guilt tripped, so that they feel independent and self sufficient…I believe kids that have well rounded parents are better off

thanks, that was an interesting insight Simone :)

@daloon – I don’t think every child winds up in therapy because of their parent’s divorce, regardless of the reason. I don’t know that all children really need or want to know (child or adult child) why their parents divorced. I sat through a very uncomfortable discussion – I so wish I had left the room, but was asked to stay!- while my cousin explained why she and her husband divorced to my younger cousin. She was 17 when they talked, to this day, she still wishes she never knew. If anything, it angers her. She said she really never needed to know it and to a point, I understand. She didn’t ask, she didn’t want to know and she resented the hell out of it, because she had finally gotten to a point where she really never thought about their divorce anymore, it had been so long. Sometimes, it’s best to leave the past in the past. Obviously, if someone is dealing with issues, they need to be addressed. I don’t know that it really is a conversation that must happen, in brutal detail – not blow by blow, but, “Son, mom cheated.” Might not be the best way to go. I really do think both sides could be argued on this one. I see your point, but sometimes, I really think people really want to over talk an issue. This might be one of them.

As far as what is and what isn’t grounds for divorce, I think that is an individual couple’s decision. To some, it is infidelity, others, it is dishonesty, gambling, falling out of love, outgrowing each other, the list goes on and on. I’m not sure any one person can determine what exactly is the “correct” grounds for divorce. I’ve heard some really oddball ones, funny….they fall into the catch all category of, “irreconcilable differences.”

@cak I think with your cousin an important factor was not wanting to know. Obviously, if the children do not care (and especially if they have healthy relationships with both parents), then nobody should force them to. It’s an adult issue anyway. And even if they insist, details should be kept to a minimum.

“Mom cheated” (or “Dad cheated”)is not a story. It is entirely unhelpful. It isn’t gory details, that people want, I think. Rather it is understanding. Why did this happen?

Granted, many people don’t know, or even if they do know, they have a hard time articulating it. However, if we don’t understand why things happen, how can we change? What lessons can we pass on to our children if we have no clue?

I think you’re right about some things, CAK. Some children have no need to know. Some may need to know, but not know they need to know. Some know they need to know, but can’t face it. I’m sure a family therapist can help people navigate through this, and help families find individual solutions that work for them.

It isn’t just with divorced parents that this can be helpful, too. There are probably just as many questions that children have of parents, but are afraid to ask. We don’t know why our parents did so many things. What could they have been thinking?

I’m on the side of health. If it helps, talk abouit it, and if it hurts, don’t. There’s no rule. I’m just saying you shouldn’t rule out the possibility that a discussion like that might be a way towards health.

@daloon – Okay, I see what you are saying. I took it as meaning the conversation should always happen. I was a witness to the aftermath of too much information and still can’t figure out how some people think it is necessary to really delve into all that info, sometimes. I understand that, “Mom (or dad) cheated.” isn’t a story, but for some, they start blunt and then move backwards. I’m related to a lot of those people – it stinks. It’s almost a bit dangerous for some to try to have that conversation.

Clearly, my children do not have this issue, as they ask one million questions a day, about everything under the sun!

@cak: ”Clearly, my children do not have this issue, as they ask one million questions a day, about everything under the sun!”

Isn’t that the coolest? The questions our children ask, at least for me, are an opportunity to see the world anew. To ask myself the same questions. It can be so eye-opening, and sometimes it just maks my heart burst. They say the coolest things!

Here’s the thing, if Dad asks Mom to leave, and she does, then who’s the bad guy? Dad, obviously. This same thing happened with my parents and I didn’t find out for a couple of weeks, through which I wouldn’t speak to my mom. This is only relevant if the kids are older, teens. If the children are young then of course spare their little feelings. I wouldn’t say anything unless they asked.
Then again, if you’re worried about protecting your spouse from the negative reaction of the kids then you’re crazy. I believe that I have every right to know that my father is a cheating bastard!
Anyway, don’t take anything anybody says here to heart. It’s all about your personal judgment call and in the end, YOU will know what is best for YOUR kids.

After my parent’s divorce, I used to envy kids whose fathers were dead, because they didn’t leave them voluntarily. Adults can justify it all they want, but when a child goes to living in a household with two parents, to having one parent leave and only being able to see them half the time, or having to pick up the phone to tell them something or schedule time with their parent, or be told “it’s not my weekend”, then life becomes an easy, insecure place for a child, who has zero control or input in the situation. My father walked out on Christmas day, and I had no clue that anything was anything but happy. He told me and my 8 year old sister that we should be happy because he’s happy. My mother was an emotional train wreck, and we were left to deal with it. I never went to where my father lived because my stepmom didn’t want to have anything to do with us. Then my dad moved out of state, and I saw him once a year for a week.

Sorry, I think grown-ups owe it to their children to be grown ups, and not burden kids with information and confidences that children are not equipped to handle. Unburdening on my daughter may have helped my husband feel better about the affair, but it was at the expense of handing that burden to our daughter, whose expectation was that her father should love her mother as much as she does. Her sense of security from family is shattered, and her sense of trust shaken.

AlfredaPrufrock, I know exactly how you feel, except my mom asked my dad to leave on Thanksgiving, which a little less horrible than Christmas. What burns me up the most is that my dad, myself, and my two brothers all went to my Aunt’s house for Thanksgiving dinner, my mom was “sick”(aka: packing suitcases) so she did not come, and my dad acted as if nothing was wrong. He was his normal, witty, two faced self even though I found out later he knew what was coming. I mean, I could see him saving face for us kids, but come on, a normal father would be a little upset over the fact that he was moving away from his kids!

I certainly wish that my brother’s second wife would have kept a lot of information to herself. She has really damaged their kids by trying to turn them against my brother, who did nothing wrong other than to simply be himself and love her and the kids.

She was the one who had an affair. She was the one who lied and got my parents to watch the kids thinking she was going to certification classes. She was the one who told everyone that my brother was cheating on her (he was not). She was the one who first announced the she wanted a divorce in front of my brother, my parents, and the children on Christmas Eve. And she is the one who never makes sure the kids get to school when they are at her house (67 unexcused absences for one child in one school year!).

All three kids are in therapy because she has made them pawns in her fight to get money from our father, to which she is not entitled.

The ugly details really don’t need to come out. In the vast majority of cases both parents love the children even if they can no longer live with each other, and that is something the kids need to know. Love between a normal parent and child never ends, whether a divorce intervenes or adulthood comes along, or illness or even prison happens.

What is it about holidays that people seem to actuate separations or divorces on them?

It’s the gift that keeps on giving ~

@daloon I have no idea, my parents told me they were officially getting divorced on thanksgiving on the way to our relatives

@daloon The stress of the holidays brings out the worst best of us?

I like what @The_Compassionate_Heretic said—when you do that they become pawns…IMO there is no reason for them to have to know. They’ll probably figure it out for themselves when they’re older, anyway.

Do not, under any circumstances, give your children those details. My parents split when I was 13, because my mother cheated on my father. Dad just HAD to tell me Mom was having an affair, and Mom just HAD to tell me she had an affair because Dad didn’t pay her any attention. I’m almost 30, and still feel damaged and bruised by the whole damn thing.

Kids don’t need to know the sordid details. Good parents will sit down together with the kids, and lovingly explain that they just can’t be together anymore, it’s nothing that the kids did, that they both still LOVE the kids and that’s what’s important!

@WillWorkForChocolate: how did that information affect you? How do you imagine it would have been different without that information? Does it make you mistrust people? Does it make it hard for you to have relationships? Does it make you more moralistic? Did you never want to understand what really happened?

I think 13 is too young, but if you grew up without the knowledge, do you think that, at some point, you might have wanted to know?

@daloon It affected me tremendously. My dad would rant and I would feel hatred for my mother. My mother would rant and I would feel hatred for my dad. To make matters worse, my mother married the man she’d been having an affair with 2 weeks after my 14th birthday. I hated him until I was about 18. When I was 19 we grew closer. I now call him “Dad”. They screwed up, but I still love them all.

It definitely made me mistrust people. Luckily, I married a fabulous guy who puts up with my shit and loves me anyway, LOL. I trust him. And that’s BIG for me. My relationship directly prior to my husband ended badly when the deflector head cheated on me. Bastard.

As for the moral aspect… I’ve always believed in fidelity. I don’t know that my parents’ split made that belief stronger neccessarily; it just sort of reinforced the desire for fidelity and honesty in my future relationships.

I’m sure I would have found out about the affair later on, but the way my parents handled the sittuation was just bad, dirty and wrong, LOL. Throwing me into the middle of everything with “your father is a worthless asshole” and “your mother is a whore” was not really the best way to help me accept a divorce.

Luckily, as I matured, I accepted what had happened, forgave all three of them and I’m a lucky gal for having three dads who love me. My bio daddy, my stepdad, and my father in law. Life is strange sometimes, but it’s mine and I’m used to it at this point. My father still has being up the old wounds and pour salt in them, which really sucks. As the “wronged” party, he still feels anger and hurt over the whole situation and will still occasionally make derogatory remarks about my mother and stepdad. I just tell him to shush. I’m 30, I can tell my dad to shutup without getting spanked now, haha.

And I really just rambled on forever, so I think I’ll take my own advice and shutup now. =0)

@WillWorkForChocolate: I really appreciate your answers there. Lurve!

@WillWorkForChocolate – wonderful answer, I wish I could give you more lurve.

@cak Awww, thanks!

Spam brought me back to a post @cak commented on. I miss her