How strong is your impulse to have a biological child?
Do you have a strong impulse to have at least one biological child? If so, can you explain why? If you met someone whom you considered the love of your life (who was only interested in adopting), with whom you were otherwise entirely compatible, would you be willing to adopt instead?
If you do not have any desire to have a biological child, can you clarify if you plan not to have children at all, if you are unable to have children, or if you would prefer to adopt?
Finally, it would also be helpful if you could state your gender and age.
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130 Answers
I do have a desire to have a biological child. It’s not that strong, but it would be nice. However, since I am gay, that is going to be a lot less likely to happen. If only two men could have a child together…
But I would be perfectly willing to adopt. I have no problem with that and if that ends up being what I do, I won’t be surprised. I do know that I want to have kids eventually.
Male, 17
Pretty strong. I have raised “others children”. One is “my” son.
But to be totally honest, something about a biological child that will put you into a greater level of tolerance and “loyality”.
I don’t want biological children, because I can’t be arsed to watch them 24/7. Plus when they scream/cry, it’s more annoying than Nickleback
17 male.
It’s pretty weak, almost nonexistent. I’d rather only care for myself and my babe.
20 year old woman
on a scale from 1 to 100..
0
i had younger siblings, that was enough pain
when I’m older and ready I’d love to have children, they’re a beautiful thing.
19, Male.
Having children in general, I don’t want one now (of course), but even thinking down the road, 10 years or so, the urge just isn’t there yet.
As far as biological vs. adopted, I really don’t have a preference.
My desire is practically non-existent. It has nothing to do with adopting or not adopting, it mostly has to do with the fact that I don’t get along with kids. They just don’t like me, and I don’t particularly like them either. I go to every length to not become pregnant (the fact that the very idea of pregnancy makes me uncomfortable and just kinda grosses me out could have a lot to do with not wanting kids), and I’m really not interested in doing that to my body. The only reason I’ve thought twice about the idea of having or not having kids is because my mom really wants me to. She loves kids and really wants grandkids. My brother isn’t such a great contender for having them, so that kinda just leaves me. I am a 20 year old woman, and I suppose my opinion may change after my biological clock starts its “ticking,” but I’ve held firm to this for awhile now. The right person with his own desire to have kids may change my mind as well.
I had a vague interest in having a biological child, but after several miscarriages and the discovery that both my husband and I could have difficulties with fertility, we both happily switched to the idea of adoption. We adopted two children, and had planned to adopt more except my husband became ill.
Both are just as much my children as any child produced by my own genes. However, I firmly believe that both are better looking than my biological progeny would ever have been.
Female, older than dirt.
Not at the moment. But when I get older and more mature, have a steady source of income, and of course somebody I’d like to have children with, then I would think I would. But now, no way…
Male, 15.
Absent.
There isn’t exactly a lack of people in the world, and I don’t think I’d do the gene pool a favour with my high-functioning autistic DNA either.
Furthermore, it’s a bit early for me to even think about such life-long commitments. I’ll probably be able to give a more sensible answer when I’ve grown up a bit further.
(22, male.)
This is something I’ve thought about a lot.
Part of me wonders if I have anything worthwhile to pass on. I started going bald at age thirteen (interestingly enough, it hasn’t gotten worse since then), I have trouble losing weight even when exercising regularly, I sometimes get anxious, I’m a procrastinator, I’m stubborn… why would I want a child to inherit any of these traits?
But at the same time, I wouldn’t give up my life. I adore being alive. So maybe passing on some bad traits won’t be so bad as long as I pass on my empathy, my sense of responsibility, my thirst for knowledge, etc.
Plus, I happen to be great with kids (preferring them to adults most of the time). I love my relative’s kids, my friend’s kids, etc. I can’t really imagine how bottomless my love for my own children would be.
So minuscule as to be nonexistent.
My (basically nonexistent) desire for biological children is outweighed by overpopulation concerns.
Male, 21
I don’t think I can answer now the way I would before I had my two biological kids (25, female parts)...when I had both of my children, it was because I wanted to have them with the people I had them with…now I think I have a relatively decent desire to have one more biological child (I think I make them well, :)) and then I will begin to adopt…also I wanted to add that I never once considered whether or not my genes are good enough to be passed on…I figured they of course are
Right now, I’m a 20 y/o with a dead-end part time job that lives at home with his parents.
It’s about a -3 out of 10.
I’m 23 and female. It was extremely important to me to have a biological child.
I’ve dated men who very much intended to have children eventually, and men who never wanted children ever (not even adopted).
I dated a man for two years who actually didn’t want children at all. It was hard for me to even comprehend, since I felt having children is pinnacle of life. We never really fought about it, because we knew we both wanted to finish school before marriage. We had talked about marriage, but rarely children. He’d mention a friend of the family who had an adopted daughter, and how great they got along..so I thought he might reconsider it eventually. Our relationship deteriorated because of other things, mainly him not being able to deal with my depression. He was a good friend through it all, but it got to be too much for him, and it tore us apart. Also, towards the end, he got a vasectomy without even telling me. That’s when our trust barrier broke
So, things weren’t meant to be with him. I was too young to realize “Hey, we don’t have the same life goals, so we shouldn’t even be considering marriage!” Hard pill to swallow at the time.
Since I already have a child, this is hard to do hypothetically. I’ve grown up a lot because of my son, so I’m more clear headed when it comes to relationships.
I suppose I wouldn’t even give a man a chance at a long term relationship with me, if he didn’t want children. Children equal happiness in my world, and if that isn’t part of the equation then the man wouldn’t be involved in my life. Possibly as a casual relationship.
If I had been infertile, I think we would have tried adoption. I’ve been blessed with the ability to conceive, so I will use that ability. I can’t really explain why I feel so strongly about it. It’s definitely not about carrying on the family name, or anything of that sort. To me, it’s the ultimate act of love and sacrifice. adoption is included in this, since adoption is still parenting
My husband is 26 and has told me he has always been ambivalent about it. He could have gone either way, as long as he loved the woman he was with. But, he said he knew he’d always have children, and did want them. I suppose if he were with a woman that didn’t want children, he would have been okay with that. But, I don’t think he’s ever been with a woman that didn’t (at some point) want to have children. So, it’s always been in his life plan as well. Now, at like 20? I doubt he was really even thinking serious about it. He was 24 when we had our first. I was 20. And now I’ll be 23 for our second, and he’ll be 27.
I used to get this thought pop into my head saying, “I want a baby,” relentlessly from about the age of 10 until I found out I as pregnant with my third child. After that it suddenly stopped. It had to have been biological.
For people who don’t want children right now, can you also comment on whether you expect to never want children, or if your desire for biological children will probably change when your circumstances (age, money, etc) change?
@Judi I hope the urges for a baby go away eventually! I don’t know how many children I can handle! But I totally know that feeling you describe. So your body just knew you were complete?
@casheroo yeah, 2 kids down and I still have the urge to have more…it’s really strange..I never expected to feel this way
Nonexistent.
Male, 37
My wife and I are able to have children, however we choose to adopt.
We have a six-year-old daughter we adopted when she was one. We plan to adopt another at some point.
With so many children without homes, I honestly don’t see the appeal of biological children. But that’s just me.
@nikipedia I have many friends with no children, same age as me. They all want to find the right person, finish school, and then settle. Most all my friends do want children, whether it be by adoption or biologically. They’re just waiting, and use birth control properly. lol
As someone who adopted children I honestly don’t think my experience in raising my children differs very much at all from raising biological children, except I never had to heal from an episiotomy and insurance did not cover the adoption fees. The love I feel for my children could not be any greater than it is, nor can my periodic level of frustration. Basically, I bonded with my children when I first met them, and they seem to have bonded with me. Yes, we have had to deal a bit with the “why don’t you all look alike” thing, but that can happen even with biological children.
My brother had biological children, so perhaps that is why I don’t feel any huge need to have biological offspring. At least some of the family gene pool will survive.
@casheroo ; it was like a switch flipped. I did have a few urges after my first husband died and I met my second. He already had a vasectomy with his first wife but I just thought it was so sad that he was an only son and never had children.
@Darwin Who questioned whether adopting was different from biological children?
I’m 29 and I would like to have one child, if not two, some day. I’m not looking for it to happen any time soon….maybe five to ten years from now would work. I’ve thought a lot about adoption, and I think I’d like to have one biological child and one adopted. I don’t know. We shall see. I’ve got plenty of time to ponder it. If I find myself 35 and single, I would adopt a child then. The timing isn’t right to me now. I feel too unsettled and my relationship is definitely too new for that.
Right now, I’m with @boots in my desire to have a child by any means, -3 on a scale of ten.
That’s easy for me to say though, because I already have three kids. It wasn’t something I thought much about before I got pregnant. I was recently out of college, on the pill, and if someone had asked me I think I would have said I’d like to have kids “some day.” Then, I met my now-husband, and after dating for a while we unexpectedly found out we were going to be parents. After a brief freaking-out period, we did just fine.
As for the other two kids, the second one we planned on. The third, again while on the pill (needless to say, I don’t use birth control pills anymore). My kids are fantastic, and I wouldn’t wish them away or change anything about our family, but I can say that I am done. I just don’t have the energy, and I think I’m at my limit of being able to provide for the needs of others. We do make such smart, adorable kids though. It’s almost a shame we aren’t popping one out every year. If at some future date I am struck by an insurmountable need to have another child, and I could talk my husband into it, I’d rather adopt.
I’m 34 and, obviously, female.
15, female
Of course, I don’t plan on having children, biological or adopted, any time soon. However, I definitely want children in the future, but no more than two, maybe only one. I strongly want biological children. I’m not completely ruling out adoption, but if at all possible, I would choose biological over adopted 100% of the time. I’m positive that my opinion on this will never change.
On a second thought, they make great minions!
@casheroo ; I should add that my two daughters one with 2 and the other pregnant with her third have also reported that the switch is off and the factory shut down for good. :-)
Only my son will give me more grandchildren now!
@casheroo – @ChazMaz said above “But to be totally honest, something about a biological child that will put you into a greater level of tolerance and “loyality”. That, plus the question itself separated biological from adopted children, as if there is a difference between them.
My urge to have children has always been very weak. I just turned 40, I’m not in a relationship and I don’t know how much longer I’ll be able to get pregnant, so right now, raising a child would not be a good idea for me.
If I did ever change my mind in the next few years, and I was in a solid relationship, I would be willing to adopt. I’m fine with being the “cool Auntie” at the moment, though.
35 female
I have never really wanted children, for many reasons. I think to some extent that my mind quieted the urges of my
body. Lately, like in the past 3 months, I have been looking at babies and pregnant women and I feel a pang. I figure it’s my age and it will go away, eventually.
23/F
This is definitely something I’ve put a lot of thought into. The appeal of biological children (or “spawn” as my partner and I lovingly refer to them as) is pretty undeniable for me. I’ve been having vivid pregnancy/motherhood dreams since I was about 13.
I think I’d want a brood of at least three, if/when we decide to take on the responsibility. However, for the sake of environmental and social responsibility, I would prefer to adopt one or two of those.
I don’t have a strong desire to have children of my own at all and have often thought that if I ever do decide that I want children (which isn’t all that likely) I would rather adopt.
Sorry, female and 23 years old!
I’m 22 and female. I never really wanted kids, but I think if I were to get married I probably would feel the urge to do so more than I do now. I always have more “Oh my God look at that adorable baby I want one!!!” moments when I’m in a relationship. Plus I always seem to be attracted to people who love and want kids. I’d be interested in having biological kids just to see how the genetics work out (I am such a science nerd), but it’s not something I feel extremely strongly about. Three of my five siblings are adopted, and they feel in my heart exactly the same as my bio siblings. Just a little more asian. ;)
I’m male, 37 and already have a biological child (she’s 4). Before she was born I didn’t care, I certainly wanted to have children but I’d actually prefer to adopt if the process was easy. Now that I have an actual biological child, who looks so much like me that people call her my “clone”, I cannot imagine having someone else’s kid. I think that no matter how much you love children (and I love all children), there is a special connection with someone who is blood-related, and is a part of your own body. And I assume that’s even stronger for women who carried the new life in them for 9 months.
When I was growing up, I always wanted a family of four. We were three, and it didn’t seem ‘right’ to me. After I had one (46 years ago), fate intervened and I had to change my plans. I took care of other people’s children for a long time, through volunteer work and a Foster Family Program. I had my second and last child 16 years later (30 years ago) and my sons have kept me in grandchildren enough to keep me happy ever since.
64 female, never had children and never regretted not having them. I always considered motherhood a full time career for at least 16–18 years and it didn’t suit me at all. I enjoy my nieces and nephews but never was distressed when they went home. I did always have teenagers working for me and I thoroughly enjoyed that experience.
@nikipedia I don’t want kids ever…in life…ever. We’re working on getting snipped :)
@casheroo I think you were the one who showed me that before, but we decided he would get something done, not me thank God. My cervix has been through enough
I’m so glad to read so many people are opting not to have children. I worked with a Foster Family Program in the 1960’s and I was appalled at the number of people who never should have had children.
I didn’t expect anything :) Neither one of us wants kids. like I said we made a decision.
29, female
It’s pretty damn strong, and the tick-tock is getting stronger every day. I’m not ready for it immediately, but in the next few years, definitley. I would absolutely be willing to adopt, but there would be a mourning period for sure if I couldn’t pop em out myself.
Can someone explain to me why adoption is almost always discussed as a consolation prize? Usually along the lines of, “If we couldn’t get pregnant, I’d certainly adopt”.
Why don’t more people simply choose to adopt regardless of whether or not they can or have had biological children?
Sure, giving birth is a biological imperative, but so is having multiple mates (if you’re a male). Many men ignore the biology and choose to remain manogomous.
Why not choose to adopt?
Because people want their own child
BECAUSE IF YOUR CHILD DOESN’T SHARE YOUR GENES, HE CANNOT TAKE YOUR PLACE AS KING WHEN YOU’RE DEAD!
duh
@cprevite Interesting question. (and @Facade, a child you adopt is your own child)
For me, it’s because the biological drive is strong. I would feel like I was missing out on something special and important if I didn’t carry a child in my womb, give birth to it, see how it resembles me and my partner…
@cprevite Financially, getting knocked up is free. I could probably never afford to adopt. Also, I doubt they’d let me because I have a past with depression. Aren’t they strict with that?
IMO I think kids and babies are ugly. Not ugly as me though.
@casheroo I disagree, but it doesn’t matter lol
@casheroo Not sure about the depression thing—it might depend on what adoption avenue you persue. I have a friend who has had problems with depression, her husband has OCD, and they have been approved to adopt from China. I think some of her depression stemmed from not being able to conceive, as they’d been trying for several years. Of course, once they finally decided to adopt and were put on the waiting list, she got pregnant on her tenth round of IVF.
The adoption process is expensive, time-consuming, and grueling. Imagine having every aspect of your life put under a microscope, all the while knowing that if you could (or wanted to) have a baby yourself, no one would deny you that right based on your finances, your age, your medical history, etc.
I also have heard people say that they wanted to look at their child and see themselves or their partner, a little bit of each of them wrapped into a person they created. I sometimes wonder how I would feel about it if I hadn’t been able to have children, but having worked with many, many adopted kids I don’t think I would have struggled with the decision to adopt. There were a lot of kids that, when I found out they were adopted, I was surprised because of how similar they were to their adoptive parents. There’s more to a child than DNA, but maybe you have to witness that first-hand to fully realize it.
@Facade: Adopted children are your own legally and emotionally. Just not biologically – which is where you disagree with @Likeradar, I suppose. I can appreciate that. Biology is just not that important to me.
@Likeradar: I can see what you are saying. My wife never felt that strongly about it.
@casheroo: The adoption process (domestically and internationally) is (as @MissAusten points out) grueling and expensive. Compared to an event-free pregnancy, I can see someone’s reservations.
That being said, I have known more than a few couples to suffer through multiple miscarriages, fertility drugs and the like all in an effort to have their own. I imagine that to be equally (if not more) grueling and/or expensive.
@MissAusten: Your last sentence sums up my feelings exactly.
Thanks for the feedback folks.
Before I became pregnant with my first son at the age of 20 I didn’t have a strong impulse at all. Once I felt that first kick inside of me, everything changed.
Having a little tiny individual doing gymnastics inside of you is an amazing feeling. I have three children now and long for a fourth. I’m afraid it will never happen and it’s really hard for me to come to terms with it. I’m very thankful for what I have but I really enjoy having a larger family. I have five siblings myself.
I’m 38.
@cprevite I admire you very much. You are a good father!
@MissAusten Ha, sounds like applying for state assistance, it’s worse than a rectal exam! And you have to go through it every six months for different programs. Very frustrating.
@cprevite I have suffered multiple miscarriages, I had a pretty sucky pregnancy with my son. I know what that is like, but I know I’m lucky.
I feel adopted children are just as much part of the family as biological. For me, giving birth doesn’t make you a mother…not at all. A lot of women can give birth, doesn’t make them a good mother.
I know this sounds harsh, but to me giving birth was an amazing thing and it’s something I always wanted to experience. I hate when people who adopt or don’t want children automatically call people who have biological children selfish. It doesn’t mean they’re selfish at all. It’s what I’ve always wanted to experience, and I’m happy I have. But, when it boils down to it…parenting is parenting. I imagine people who adopt have even tougher parenting issues to deal with than I have to explaing adoption, dealing with the emotions with that But we’re all parents in the end.
@casheroo: ”For me, giving birth doesn’t make you a mother…not at all. A lot of women can give birth, doesn’t make them a good mother.”
Agreed. And I can totally respect your need to be pregnant. As @jonsblond points out, I’m sure the feeling of a baby inside you must be amazing to some.
@casheroo:
I hate when people who adopt or don’t want children automatically call people who have biological children selfish. It doesn’t mean they’re selfish at all. It’s what I’ve always wanted to experience, and I’m happy I have.
How is doing something because you want to do it not selfish….? I don’t think there’s anything inherently wrong with having biological children (or with being selfish, for that matter) but that seems like a total contradiction to me.
@nikipedia It’s then selfish to adopt, because you’re doing it because you want to. But, people seem to judge and I’ve only seen this on Fluther people who have biological children, and not people who adopt…yet both do it for “selfish” reasons.
@casheroo: Not necessarily. If you want biological children but you choose to adopt, that seems entirely unselfish to me.
@nikipedia Okay, I’ve never encountered anyone like that. Who would want bio children, could physically have them, but not? I personally don’t know anyone like that. And didn’t see any responses like that on this thread. Most people go either way, or can’t have bio children so they adopt, want bio children and have them, want to adopt and adopt.
@casheroo: Oh okay, if you haven’t encountered it, it must not exist.
You must have missed @cprevite‘s wonderful and moving response above. Lucky for you, it looks like he’s back for a reprise.
Incidentally, I have a very good friend who plans to do exactly this, and I have seriously considered the same.
@casheroo: Well you’ve met one now.
I would have liked to have a biological child but chose not to because it felt selfish to me considering all the children without homes.
Plus, when I walk by a mirror, I never think, “we need more of that on the planet. ;^)
@nikipedia Until his most recent post, no where in this thread did @cprevite say he wanted biological children. He luckily backtracked for you, even though he said biologly wasn’t important to him.
Yeah, adoption is just as selfish as having biological children. I love thinking along the lines of the judgemental :rolls eyes:
I absolutely, positively don’t think having children is selfish at all. It’s fucking ridiculous to even say such things.
Just for this. I think we’ll have 4. Maybe 5.
Look, I’m not attacking your decision to have children. I don’t care if you have a thousand, as long as you can provide for each and every one one of them. (I think a strong argument can be made that not only is it selfish, but it’s also extremely bad judgment to have even one child you can’t support without public assistance.)
I’m just pointing out that it is inherently contradictory to say you did it because you wanted to and to turn around say that is not a selfish decision. Everyone does selfish things all the time. Why are you getting so defensive about this?
@casheroo: First of all, no back-tracking here. I said I would have liked to have biological children, but chose otherwise when the time came.
I was about 21 when I first thought I’d like to be a dad. At the time biological children were the only kind on my radar. However, as I became more familiar with the idea of adoption (my wife worked at DSS), it became a better choice for me. Doesn’t mean I never wanted to have my own. And yes, biology became less important to me by comparrison. Doesn’t mean mean it never was a consideration.
As for the whole “selfish” thing: You’ll notice I said it was a selfish decision for me.
I know a lot of people who are going to adopt even though they can have bio children – but for people in the queer community either way is more difficult and that’s a problem imo oh and I am in Philly right now for a couple of days in the home of one of them and we’re looking up adoption agencies in NYC as we both plan to adopt…I want to have another bio kid, if possible and then adopt one
@nikipedia Sigh. Because, me doing something because I want to, and others doing something because they want to should both be considered selfish. I don’t care if people view one act as more commendable as the other…I don’t. Both have the same results.
But, like I said…I don’t think it’s selfish to have children at all, so I can’t even imagine what it’d be like to think like that.
@Simone_De_Beauvoir I know people who can have bio children but choose to adopt, but they never wanted bio kids. Not the same as wanting them but adopting. IMO.
@Simone: Absolutely. I completely agree that the adoption process in general should be streamlined and made much more accessible for gays specifically.
@Simone_De_Beauvoir You’re in Philly?! Do you have the boys with you?? We should get them together
@casheroo I also think it’s entirely possible as is the case with me to want both bio and adopted children – I always knew I would do both and plan on it…same with my best friend…he wants a bio child and an adopted child…we’ll see which we can make happen first
@casheroo no, sadly, I miss them like crazy…I am here on my own helping my best friend out…for emotional support, you can say…Alex is home with the babies…why do you live here? I have a lot of free time over the next couple of days
@Simone_De_Beauvoir To me, that’s not the same either lol. You already have bio kids, and wanted them and then plan to adopt. I’ve thought about doing that too, but would have my bio kids first and then contemplate it
@casheroo well but I always wanted to adopt…the fact that I first had bio kids and now plan to adopt only has to do with the age factor…easier to get pregnant and better anyway when you’re younger and because of the finances factor…easier to adopt when you have more money which for me will come later in life
@nikipedia The public assistance argument doesn’t even belong here.
@casheroo: I wasn’t trying to start an argument, just qualifying the preceding statement. Anyway, is there really an argument to be had? Do people really believe having more children than they can afford and asking the rest of society to bail them out is a good idea?
@nikipedia That is not the purpose of general assistance. I don’t expect people on assistance to automatically get abortions if they become pregnant while receiving assistance. I don’t judge people on assistance who have more children. There’s never a perfect time to have them.
@casheroo: Did you not want to have “the public assistance argument”? Because it seems to me like either you do want to have an argument about it, or perhaps you just want to announce your opinion and not listen to anyone else’s.
I had a very strong desire to have a biological child. I spent an awful lot of money to be able to do so.
I’m curious about adoption. Do people who have both biological and adopted children have the same feeling of seeing parts of themselves in their adopted children, or are there more instances of just not understanding where something is coming from in the child?
I often have the sense that I can understand my son in certain ways that my wife can not. I see parts of myself in him that she has no experience with. This is also true with my daughter. I see parts of my wife in my daughter as well as parts of me. My son also exhibits parts that follow after his mother. However, in terms of personality, I feel like I understand him better, and I think it’s because of our biological connection. I don’t think I would understand a child who was not related to me biologically nearly as well.
We have close friends with two adopted boys. The boys are very different. Biological children can be very different, but this difference seems much larger. Also, they have much more difficulty with their children, and I wonder if they would have such a hard time if the children were biologically related.
The biological drive to have a child is hands down one of the hardest things to actively ignore, at my current age and sex (mid 20s female). Well, I mean mentally. Physically I have my bases covered by being on the pill and being pro-choice in case something happens. Logically I know that I do not want to have a child at all at this time if ever, even though I have a steady job and a place to live.
But every time I see a baby, I can’t help but smile and wave and a little shiny thing inside of me glimmers. Then my mind thinks, oh wouldn’t it be awesome to have a kid. And yes, it would be. I would be a great mother, my parents would be happy as peaches, and I think it would give me motivation working on a farm in establishing a great place to hand over to my child, the propagation of my genes.
And then the rational side of me kicks in. But nobody can guarantee you’ll have a great kid. What if my kid turns out to be a Charlie Manson? And even if the kid is perfect, having a child changes your priorities and order in life and I’m not sure I really want for that to happen, certainly not at this moment.
So even though I am a rational and logic person, that biological I want a baby pulse is so very strong. Who knows, maybe I’ll give in later on in life, but certainly not now and not with my current partner who has an active desire to never have children. I’m also open to the possibilities of adoption. But at this time, the answer is no, and if I were somehow to end up pregnant (likely won’t happen) that baby would not be born.
I don’t have a problem with people having their own biological children by choice and I wouldn’t hold it against anyone (other than a few trampy sluts I know who have admitted to getting pregnant because then they can get a council house Grrrr!) but I can understand why some people do find it selfish. I have so much respect for people who choose to adopt even if they could have children naturally if they so wished. That doesn’t mean I don’t have respect for anyone who raises a child well (whether it is their own or not) it’s just a different kind of respect.
@dynamicduo With you as the mother, what are the chances your kid will turn out to be a Manson? Personally, I don’t think the apple falls very far from the tree.
I think that, in an age where children are almost always a choice, the desire to have a biological child (and I’ll get killed for this) has a lot to do with how one thinks about oneself. If one thinks one would be a bad parent—what’s that all about? How come you don’t trust yourself to be a good parent? Maybe you don’t trust your genes. Maybe you think you will be like your parents and you hate your parents. Maybe you don’t like kids. Maybe you think your parenting style is not socially acceptable.
If one uses overpopulation as an excuse, is that really what it appears to be on the surface? Is it possible that one is using that to hide that one really doesn’t trust oneself to be a good parent? Can economic or altruistic justifications be a screen for other things? I generally think that the people who are willing to let their genes die off are the ones who probably should be having children. Their children are more likely to benefit the world than the children of parents who never think about the consequences of their behavior on the rest of the world.
Using marital status and finances as a reason is usually to delay having a child rather than not having one at all. More women than in the past are finding themselves delaying until their biological clock is down to zero. I don’t know what the reasons are for this. I think that career may be very important to these women. Also, opportunity is a problem. Many hold out for a partner they can imagine raising a child with, and their standards are such that they never find this person.
I think that people have no obligation to do anything other than what they choose to do. However, for me, intellectual justifications seem like they don’t tell the whole story. I feel like there must be deeper, emotional reasons why people don’t want to procreate. I could be wrong, of course. And as usual, I’m sure people will think I’m reading too much into it.
My sons girlfriend is adopted and the family also has natural children. As much as they wanted to treat the children the same, there is a different kind of pride in the natural children. Also, my sons girlfriend feels a sort of burden because the parents have a certian amount of pride in the fact that they “rescued” these poor children. I have never met her parents but they seem to be very good people. They just feel somewhat differently about the adopted kids. (It seems it’s not their intention, it just happens. )
@Judi I think people are different..I do not know how I will feel about my adopted children when they’re here…I can only tell you that my excitement about adopting is the same as my excitement about becoming a bio-mom once more
Every action is selfish, so let’s get that of the way.
I don’t think anyone can adequately defend having more than one biological child, if they say they just wanted the experience, or to pass on genes.
I have no kids, for many reasons. I am seriously considering fostering because it’s needed, not because I have the urge to be a parent.
@tinyfaery I believe fostering must be one of the hardest things to do. I have so much respect for people who do that because I’m not sure I could.
@tinyfaery well I hope you do foster but that when you do you will have the urge to parent…all other reasons are incomplete
@tinyfaery Having siblings for my son was very important to me. My father was an only child and I know how lonely that can be sometimes. Siblings can be there for you when you need support, especially as you age and your parents have passed away. Siblings can be there for you when no one else will.
For the record, I don’t think anyone needs to defend having more than one biological child. My parents have 4 and it’s excellent that way. No need to defend it.
on a scale of 1 to 10, 2.5.
i’m only 17, so i’m far from having children, but even though i get that having your own kid is just so awesome, etc, etc, i feel like adopting is a better choice. there are so many children in the world without homes and families, and i think i’d just feel like a jerk putting my own ‘need’ to have my own – ahem – spawn out there instead. i don’t look down on people who have their own children, it’s just that my priorities are different.
also, there are just so many people out there. so many. i don’t feel like we need more.
and this is super self-absorbed i guess, but if i don’t have to push a human being out of my vuhjay to have a kid, i don’t exactly see that as a con.
i guess if my significant other was really set on having a biological child though, i might give in. but that’s my stance on it basically.
Siblings don’t have to be biological.
@tinyfaery No they don’t, but we could not afford to adopt.
@jonsblond i’m looking into domestic adoption in NYC and here if you adopt a non-white baby through a public agency they will pay you to do it…obviously in our racist world, no one wants children of color and they don’t cost you anything…sigh
Good point. Maybe if adoption were easier and less expensive more people would do it.
Simone makes a good point, too. Adoption is expensive when people want nice, little white babies.
sigh. I guess my having 3 biological children was a bad thing. Even though my husband and I have done a great job raising them to be respectful, kind and intelligent.~
I admire and respect anyone that adopts. My husband and his brother were both adopted as babies (from different families). Jon has never met his birth parents. He always wonders if he looks like a relative. Maybe he has his uncles eyes or grandma’s nose. He’ll never know.
I would say that my husband had a strong impulse to have a biological child because he felt that he was missing out on something growing up as an adopted child. His mother was a wonderful mother (his dad was an ass) but he still wanted to know where he came from. Even now he would love to know if our children look like any of his relatives. We already know that our oldest son looks alot like my dad, but maybe he looks more like Jon’s. I feel guilty when I pull out my family tree because I know that he wishes he had something like this.
By giving Jon these wonderful gifts, I gave him the family connection that he always longed for.
It may be selfish but at least we are a happy family.
@cprevite – Just so you know, it cost us $20,000 and huge piles of paperwork to adopt two children. If we could have had them biologically ourselves it would have cost much less because medical insurance would have covered pregnancy and birth expenses. That’s why a lot of folks try for biological children first.
However, we decided that since it could cost us that much in co-pays to get pregnant (if it were even possible) adoption would be the quickest way to actually be able to raise a child.
@Simone_De_Beauvoir and @tinyfaery – Where we live, even though there is a plethora of non-white babies needing parents, no one pays you to adopt them. We did pay less than we might have ($20,000 instead of $40,000 or more) but still adoption is expensive. In fact, the primary reason we were allowed to adopt non-white children is because we are a mixed race couple and our state law allows mixed-race children to be adopted by mixed race families, and because we had the money saved up in advance. Apparently most folks in our area don’t research cost in advance and I guess plan to adopt on the installment plan or something.
However, when compared to the cost of actually raising children, $20,000 is a drop in the bucket.
@Darwin oh I know, in NYC the kids are older 7 years and later and have medical needs…then it costs almost next to nothing to adopt them…I’m looking into domestic and international…interested in biracial children…I know we have to first put away 10–20 k into a savings account to start and the rest will be on credit card…seeing how we yet don’t have that put away, I’d say we’re quite a few years away from adopting…but I, in the mean time, am attending all sorts of info sessions and webinars and doing loads of research with my husband…
If you were here in Texas be aware that there are about 600 mixed race newborns who do not get adopted every year.
We considered international adoption, but my husband worked as a bailiff and saw so many kids come through the court who needed families that we decided to opt for not just domestic, but within Texas.
@Darwin thanks for your help and support
I don’t care if your selfish, just admit it. I hate when people try to deny it.
@tinyfaery that answer makes no sense to me. i’m all for people admitting their feelings as well but i’ll still care about what those feelings mean.
@tinyfaery If you don’t care, why is it so important for you that others on this thread admit it? Maybe some of us don’t feel that it is selfish to have children, some of us do. Oh well. It’s selfish to not have children. It’s selfish to fluther. It’s selfish to go swimming. It’s selfish to own cats.
Who cares?
@tinyfaery @Simone_De_Beauvoir I’m sensing a need for a question on the difference between “selfish”, “own best interest”, and altruistic. In my opinion, selfish is the derogatory way to say a person acts only in their own best interest in a bad way, while “kind”, “thoughtful”, “helpful”, “loving” and many other words describe a person who acts in the interest of others, whether motivated by self interest, or not.
After all, every emotion is actually just a series of actions/reactions that take place in the brain, and we choose which words we use to describe them. Using words that are derogatory is not necessarily the best choice.
I always figured it could be selfish not to raise children at all, whether biological or adopted. It certainly gives you more free time and a whole bunch more money if you don’t bother.
@YARNLADY well to clarify, i generally don’t think being selfish is a bad thing – it all depends on the situation…like @Darwin said for some it’s selfish to not have kids…I’ve never felt selfish for having them
@Simone_De_Beauvoir It helps when using words which you are self-defining to say so. Dictionary definition: concerned chiefly or only with yourself and your advantage to the exclusion of others; lacking with regard to the rights and feelings of others, inconsiderate behavior.
@Simone_De_Beauvoir I’ve never felt selfish either, but know people who don’t want them is usually for selfish reasons…which has been expressed many times in this thread.
@jonsblond I’m pleasantly surprised everytime I hear of a loving couple that aren’t actually trying to screw each other over and stab each other in the back.
I think adoption laws in almost every country are ridiculous, and end up deterring any family that would have liked to adopt a child. Children spend half their lives in orphanages, which in many cases are understaffed and generally not the best place to be. At the same time, there are wonderful loving people out there (most of the people who want to adopt are like that) with so much to give, that are not even considered because they’re not rich enough, or educated enough etc. For me the criterion should be whether they could offer the child a better life than the orphanage, and in most cases all you need for that is a decent meal and someone to hug you when you come home from school crying.
@Jack79 definitely I was just saying – adoptive parents go through such a rigorous process when ‘regular’ parents don’t and all kinds of stupid parents get pregnant carelessly and have children and we don’t ensure that they are ready (no I don’t know what system we’d have in place to change that around but maybe parenting classes free for all new parents and pregnant people)..and it’s quite expensive and I’m thinking my god I should have at least 10k in savings…how many times in my life when I was pregnant and kept the child did I even have that in savings? yes, that’s right, zero times…and yet we manage, we have a happy family, 2 beautiful amazing children…all money is spent on their education and development and I wouldn’t trade it for the world
If everyone waited until they could afford it to have children, mankind would become extinct.
@Judi I do not agree with the blanket statement. Hubby and I waited for five years after we were married until we were ready to have a child. (I had a son by a previous marriage). Not everyone jumps into that most important move without waiting until they are ready.
@YARNLADY being ready and being financially ready are two different things
i consider myself completely ready for a third child, obviously
but financially adoption is a bit out of reach
@YARNLADY hospitals costs are covered by insurance and/or medicaid…and the zero dollar adoptions, as I mentioned above are rare, for much older children, etc.
Before I got married, I knew I wanted kids. When I dated, that was always a consideration. When my wife and I married, we both wanted kids right away.
Her first pregnancy with me was a miscarriage. I was crushed.
Not long afterwards, she became pregnant again, and we had our daughter.
Another miscarriage, then a boy.
I was thrilled to have one of each (and my stepdaughter!). Today, I miss them being small.
Male 53.
I know it is damn strong for women over 40. They feel like as if life has passed them by but they chose they are girls that just want to have fun. Time is always the great awakening.
In reference to the prices we paid for adopting our children and my comment about the costs of raising said children, I read in our local paper today that “they” have figured out that on average it costs $221,000 to raise a child from birth to age 18. Thus, paying $10,000 to adopt a child is rather like the tip of an iceberg – only 5% of the total shows up.
Not so strong that it cant be completely extinguished by the screams of a brat at the table next to me in a restaurant.
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I’m a 22 yr old female. I always said that I wanted to adopt because the urge to have your own child is animalistic and unneccessary since there are so many unwanted children (i have worked on several mission in orphanages). I thought that adopting is the superior intellectual thing to do. HOWEVER, i just recently have met what i believe is “the one” and my desire to create life with him is overwhelming. Whenever I thought about it with other men I would cry at the horror of the idea. But with him I can feel my whole body overwhelmed with pleasure at the idea. And mentally I love him so much and respect him and connect with him that creating a life with him sounds like an universal asset and what could be our ultimate gift to the world from our love. Its to the point that, if I miss a day of taking the pill, instead of being careful we are even more overwhelmed and sensual in the sack. Crazy right? I also shamefully admit that there is the underlying desire to know “what it would look like” because we are two very classically good looking people. (PS the intellectual side of me cringes as I write this but thats what my biology is saying)
@AZByzantium I agree that that urge to create is very powerful. The urge to create life is even stronger. I think it is the only time we can be truly like a God. “Let there be life!” That’s what making love makes many people feel like. I know it made me feel that way, and the frustration of being unable to participate in that magic that most people seem to be trying to prevent was enormous for me.
I don’t think it matters whether you are good looking or not. So many couples that love each other have this urge to see what they can create, no matter how they look. If you want a child, then I think you’ll believe it will be a very special child just because it has you as parents. I don’t think you need to cringe about this.
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