Is "I'm only hurting myself" a valid excuse?

I find that is rarely the case. Irresponsible behavior almost always affects other people, whether it be a loved one who worries, or society when we have to use tax dollars to rescue you off a mountain top in a blizzard. We are not only responsible for ourselves, but also for the people around us.

I rarely have heard this excuse come out of someone who didn’t end up hurting someone else in the process or requiring someone else to expend time, effort and money to clean up after that person. @JLeslie – you hit the nail on the head.

Hah! People who say this are in denial. They’re trying to excuse themselves for what they know is a stupid decision, so they use the old chestnut of “I can do whatever I want, why should you care if I ruin my life?”

Well.

If my brother did drugs, I would feel a massive sense of guilt for not seeing the signs and warning him of the dangers before it was too late. I would lie awake at night worrying over her. I would plead for him to clean up. I would pay for rehab. I would comfort my parents. There would be recriminations and endless bills, because if he did anything stupid because of his drug habit or if he’s in trouble financially because of it…I would pick up the bill. And if I finally decide that I can’t help him, and the only way for him to stop is if he decides to do so…I would still regret everything I said to him that wasn’t enough to keep him off drugs. For the rest of my life.

And what if he has a family? And the paycheck that should go to the kids goes to his drug habit? I could go on and on and on…but I’m actually feeling a little depressed now, just thinking about it.

The only way you can do something stupid without hurting anyone else is if you have no family, no friends, no religion, no political affiliation, no obligations, and no country.

Sometimes if people have no children, technically if no one cares (and someone always does), they’re only hurting themselves…sure we’re all connected to people, but we each have a right to do to ourselves what we please…others that ‘worry’ don’t have to come first, they can be next to us but not ahead…I use the same argument for suicide as I am for it because one should have the right to end their life

That’s just not true because they’re not just harming themselves. By harming themselves, they’re affecting those close to them.

I’ve heard this line before from people who were abusing drugs. Those folks are affecting every single person they come into contact with. “I’m only hurting myself” is a myopic statement.

@Simone_De_Beauvoir all suicide, or do you mean suicide related to a terminal or painful illness? Which I would classify more specifically as euthanasia.

@JLeslie all suicide – i mean it gets kind of shady there with whether or not people have a serious mental illness (and I don’t believe wanting to kill oneself classifies a mental illness) when they want to kill themselves and the such and who they’re leaving behind and all that but yes all suicide – we have that right

My friend found one of his best friends hanging from a tree by a noose fashioned from a belt. You can’t tell me that discovering the 3 day old bloated corpse of a good friend hanging from a tree doesn’t harm you.

@The_Compassionate_Heretic it does harm you, of course, obviously..but we can’t just live for others if we don’t want to live for ourselves

Is it possible to only hurt yourself? It’s hard for me to see this. Humans are tribal creatures, and our lives don’t make any sense without our relationships to others. By this reasoning, the loss or pain of any human hurts those the person is related to, either via blood or by proximity.

As to suicide—I don’t believe anyone considers it unless they are in enormous pain, and they can’t see any end to that pain. The perception that there will be no end to the pain may be erroneous, but perception seems real to the person, and they may choose to end the pain the only way they know how.

In my experience, it is the impact on others that is most often the argument used to stop people from killing themselves. It’s not hope for the future, or telling someone it’s not as bad as they think—it’s the damage they will do to others if they kill themselves. From my experience, it seems to be an effective argument.

Looking at suicide as the daughter of a man who shot himself, it leaves deep ripple effects for the entire family and for more than one generation.

In my opinion, his act was one of rage and cowardice. Other family members disagree.

@gailcalled I just think that the effects of someone’s suicide are THEIRS to deal with – as in that’s the trauma in your life and you will deal with it however life takes you…but for the person (cowardice, selfishness or not) it is their right…even if some believe it’s not the right step, you can’t be inside their head.

The suicide was my father’s choice. The effects were ours to deal with. He was dead, in the driveway, with a bullet in his ear. The neighbors called the police, thinking they had seen a sick or dying dog.

Perhaps if he had been willing to talk with his wife and children, to share some of his issues (many were about losing power and control), things might have evolved differently.

@gailcalled perhaps. there are always could have should have would haves we can talk about.

@Simone_De_Beauvoir Yeah, the suicide is dead. They don’t have to deal with anything any more. Yet, they had to do some thinking in order to make the decision, and in that thinking, it becomes less likely they will want to commit suicide if they consider their family members, and if they understand the effect a suicide has on family members. It’s their decision, but a lot of times, suicides believe they are not wanted and that everyone will be better off without them. This is almost invariably incorrect.

With death, it seems to me that people should have full information. How many suicide bombers would commit suicide if they had more information about death? Or about their earning potential, if they stay alive? Many suicide bombers believe that their families will be taken care of if they carry out their mission. Do their families agree? I doubt it. I suspect they are isolated so they can be brainwashed into doing this.

People make their own choices, but I think they often underestimate how much impact their choices have on others. When in a depression, it’s not hard to believe one doesn’t matter. Even when others tell you that you matter to them, it’s hard to believe. However, I think it does have some impact. When I was ready to check out, people here and in real life kept telling me I mattered. I didn’t believe them, and yet, it did make a difference.

@Simone_De_Beauvoir I can see your point about suicide, but I would offer this…most people who are suicidal are only temporarily suicidal. Most people who are suicidal do not want to die, but want to be out of the pain they are in. So, let’s say I go along with the idea that if a person wants to off themselves it’s their body, their life, their decision (although if someone has young children I am less willing to be accepting of this) what I worry about MORE than the people around this person, is that the person themselves, if they had stuck it out, whatever horrible emotional pain they were going through, they might have gone on to have wonderful happy lives.

Terminally ill people who are in pain and it will never end and only get worse, I am in complete support of their desire to die. I will never understand why people think suffering at the very end of life is a good thing.

@JLeslie yes it’s possible to have them go on to lead ‘wonderful happy lives’ but that’s not a guarantee..we can’t predict the future and though suicide is a very final solution to perhaps temporary problems, it is still a person’s decision…i’m not saying it’s always a wise decision, but I will not berate them for it

@Simone_De_Beauvoir Not berate..I agree.

It was near impossible to berate my father after his suicide. He was not in intractable pain, he had some quality of life, his family cared about him, he had wonderful grandchildren, no money concerns, a lovely home. His Parkinson’s was annoying and changed his life, it is true. But what he couldn’t bear was the loss of his role as benevolent dictator both at work and at home.

He was the CEO of a family business that went public. Shortly before he killed himself, he got into a beautiful grey suit and was driven to NYC. There he presided over and spoke at the annual meeting of shareholders. T’he power and ego generated a wonderful day for him.

He was never able to replicate that feeling in his emotional life. And he was the age that I am now.

@gailcalled I’m really sorry for your loss. You remind us of a reason for suicide that we had kind of overlooked on tis thread, the loss of ones position in society and family. We all know stories of people killing themselves during the stock market crash that preceded the great depression of the 1930’s. The thing is the people around these people would have continued to love their spouses, grandparents, and children, so very sad. In the psych hospital I work at the most likely to kill themsleves are the ones who are high functioning, typically fine mentally overall with severe depression, which lately has been men who have lost their jobs or who are having a difficult time supporting their families.