What is your defintion of forever?

Just forever. There is no limit, like a line, and there is no definite beginning or end because it is all of it, and when you try to pinpoint a particular place in time that might be either of those two, there’s still forever beyond that as well. Goddamned paradoxes

t=∞

Forever is everything and nothing.

But everything has to exist in some period of time, so it cant be nothing.

When I say “forever” it means “until you betray my trust.”

As in “You’re my best friend forever!” really only means “until you fuck my girlfriend.”

@Fred931 What is nothing, is it outside of time?

Nothing does not exist.

I figure I have 10–15 more good years, then 10 years of diminishing abilities, and that’s forever for me.

Does Forever exist?

If the expression is being used by a teenage girl – probably about a week.

yes, if a line exists, and it is indefinite, so is forever.

What if time stops, the world ends?

Never ending, Without an end.

Time will never stop. Like I said, it is indefinite.

Time should exist as long as there is a universe right? So, no universe no time.

@Fred931 I agree with you except with that picture. Go Jr!!!

Time will exist no matter what the condition of anything else is.

A couple of minutes.

So time is forever, with no beginning and no end?

Right.

Anything over 15 minutes.

How do you define time?

The, what im going to call, dimension in which everything occurs in, but don’t jump to a time-travel conclusion just yet.

So time is the ever expanding universe?

…. for the members of the Pirahã tribe, whose entire lexicon for precise numbers consists of the words for 1 and 2 and many….....

…context and culture determines how long forever is…........

…forever could mean the absence of a death sentence…......

Girfff… you’re asking someone with ADD, im having trouble thinking clearly… I think the universe and everything are contained in time, which goes forever (which is indefinite).

I think you are thinking clearly. So time is the container? Without time nothing would exist?

Its just taking me time to think directly on the topic, and its late. Time probably is forever, and since forever is indefinite and must exist, then time cannot not exist.

It is thought that before the Big Bang there was neither time nor space, so time must be able not to exist, as it is inextricably entangled with space.

What about time being a man made measurement? Time wouldn’t exist if we didn’t define it. So therefore in your statements if we created time, we created the universe.

Waiting in line at the DMV.

goddamned ADD @pdworkin the BigBang is indeed a tested theory, but probably will not be proven correct or incorrect. The Big Bang, in a just-created opinion of mine, could not be true because according to some certain physical law or property that I don’t remember the name of, something cannot come from nothing. @jqlyn We measure time justa tool, a measurement, based on a man-defined point in time and works in a way consistent with how man wants it to operate. Time works alone and cannot be perfectly defined since time is forever and forever is indefinite.

I’ll be back after sleeping, so throw another monkey out here and I’ll try in the morning.

“For” means to be in favor of. “Ever” is a specific designation of no particular time.

Forever is to be in favor of no particular time. Hence, without time.

Forever is beyond the notion of time.

Forever is anything that lasts until after I die, or waiting for my son to do his chores.

Thanks Fred, it was fun.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies Thank you, “Forever is beyond the notion of time.”

Time is the forth dimension and like the first three, it can be measured, and it can always be added to, therefor forever is forever, non-ending

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies So as time is inadequate in measuring forever, time has no relevance to it?

… @DrBill… do not forget the potential for the BIG CRUNCH…... that’s all 11 dimensions rolled up to zero.

@virtualist

True, but time would continue, proven by the fact that every action can be measured within time, even if no one is there to hold the watch….

@O

Where is this Time you speak of?

Forever is an abstract concept developed by humans. It is an attempt to comprehend the nature of things that exist beyond our current level of comprehension.

@DrBill

Are you speaking on the authority of Planck’s constant? Time is man made, and thus your 4th dimension was created by humans.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies Obviously, my question comes from this statement of yours:

“Forever is to be in favor of no particular time. Hence, without time.
Forever is beyond the notion of time.”

So, I ask: So as time is inadequate in measuring forever, time has no relevance to it?

@O

We can only name forever. We cannot measure it.

The traffic light two miles from my house on Kennedy Drive. That thing stays red forever.

@O

Time is a man made invention designed to destroy reality… the reality of forever. No really, its entire purpose is to chop, mince, dice, grind and shred forever right away from us. This is a lie. How may we divide something that goes far beyond a single whole?

Time is a fantasy. Forever is reality.

It shows just how far away mankind is from the true nature of being. We are forever away from that knowledge.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies I suspect both are delusions, bro, but only the measurement of time is of any use to us. Forever is kind of a bummer.

For me forever exists outside of time. It is forever and eternity. It exists through death. But I also believe we exist through death in some form.

@O

What’s the bummer in pure being, beyond the savage notions of time?

If for any day in the future there also exists a tomorrow with respect to that day, then you have forever.

While I know it means never-ending, I tend to think of it as as far into the future as I can realistically imagine. Probably 3 or 4 generations out. Everyone before my great-grandparents is just a concept and I everyone after the idea of my great-great-grandchildren is the most I can really imagine my family into the future. Imagining my daughter as a grandma is about it… maybe a great-grandma.

Of course I know the world existed well before my great-grandmother and will (hopefully) exist long after my great-great-(great?)-grandchildren, but that feels like the world’s forever. My personal forever is a completely different concept.

@Supacase

Now try and imagine “not” knowing your family at all. If you cannot, that is a glimpse of forever.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies Well, it sounds to me that you kind of feel that the purity of forever is obstructed or tainted by the very existence of time, which is a real component of the universe according to the unified field theory. In that sense it seems that the concept of forever is an abstract construct, and of little use other than tickle philosophy. Life has only use of measured time, and as life is the only thing making any sense to the universe, forever is a bummer.

@O

I’d like to clarify something with your choice of words… you said:
”...and as life is the only thing making any sense to the universe…”

Do you mean of the universe or “to”?

@jqlyn You asked: What is your defintion of forever?

Waiting for you to fix the typo in definition…

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies Oh, right-o. I meant IN. I am a bit dyslectic and in relation to that, I double check and correct to the extent that I sometimes blip around and cut in my text so much that I sometimes just mess it up. Sometimes I just go whoa, that’s nothing even related to what I tried to say. Anyway, as life is the only thing making sense of the universe, and puts meaning to it, by being a part of it, and the only thing that can observe it, measured time is of use to us. Forever is not. Ergo: bummer.

@O

I’m glad you said that. So since humans are the only thing that make meaning, did we find time in the universe, or did we create time to help make meaning of the universe?

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies I don’t know. I suspect that time exists in both aspects. That time is a component or a part of the universe as it moves along, but not necessarily in the straight line that we observe and understand. Time as the concept we use, seems a human construct to describe the time that is obvious to us and that we depend upon. I don’t pretend to understand M-theory, but I understand that human concepts are developed for our purposes and adapted to our needs. The universe don’t really care about our needs. Our time is probably a delusion. But it is important to us, and a big help in describing and managing our existence.

Time is a burden to our existence. The funny thing about existence, is that it has existed for all of exixtence. Care to put a number on that?

As a noun, existence refers to “a state of being”. As an adjective, “all of existence” could synonym “forever”. Its all in the Word… a state of forever being.

Now Here is nowhere. Where is the Now? How can you possibly get Here?

Space/Time is an illusion created by humans to describe the reality of forever. We failed.

Amm. I guess in a way. It does impact the way we look at the universe in relation to our existence, so as a delusion, it probably does it’s share of warping our ability to experience the true face of reality. But we wouldn’t work as humans if we didn’t label everything, and make units of every part. It’s how we move forward. It’s our nature.

Isn’t estimated time just numbers? Put a number on the biggest number in existence? You’d come up with googol, googolplex, grahams number and such before infinity. The truth is that there isn’t really a biggest number, and will never be. We can only make the biggest number yet to be named. This to could be seen as a delusion, but we still need the numbers and the units. Cause we are truly primitive animals, and we tuck and jump like this. Delusions or not. That’s my part of the story anyway.

Christians want to be good so they get to live forever and ever in heaven. We should realize that if “the kingdom of heaven is in you”, forever is available whenever… some call that 24/7.

I often tell certain people in my life, “I hope to know you forever”. What I generally mean is, “all the days of my life, until the day I die”. Does forever exist outside of my short, little life? By the definition of the word, yeah, it would. But do any of us know for sure? Not so much.

Till it is over.

I would assume that humans do not have the ability to totally grasp the concept of forever, much like they have no concept of what eternal means. Look at the Christian religion for example of this lack of ability to fully grasp the concept. I attempted to achieve this in an Evelyn story once, and it gave me a headache.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies

Time has always existed, it was man who devised a way to measure it.

So clocks don’t keep time? They detect it?

And I’m slightly confused… where does the “measure” begin for something that has “always existed”?

If you measure the distance from the 2 to the 5 on your phone, you don’t start at the edge of the phone

If you are measuring time you also do not have to go back to the beginning. Time is measured from when you start measuring till when you stop.

Clocks don’t keep time, they measure it.

Actually clocks just tick. Humans do the measuring because they decide what an hour is, not the clock. The clock just ticks, at a rate specified by humans. And since humans specify the rate of tick, humans invented a thing called time. We certainly did not discover time, and I don’t think the clouds in the cosmos bestowed it upon us either. I can’t see time under a microscope. I haven’t found any time at the bottom of the sea. Where is this mysterious thing called time? it’s only where we say it is

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies humans invented a thing called time

Humans didn’t discover time, they merely found a name for it.

I agree we didn’t discover time. I claim we invented it.

Where is the “it” they were naming? There was no “it” in the first place. We invented “it”.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies I claim we invented it.

Your claim is invalid. Time has always existed – it was not invented. It is the progress of existance.

huh? “the progress of existance”? Just who do you suppose is keeping track of that progress… time or humans?

Existence doesn’t “progress” any more than it can “regress”. It either is or it isn’t.

particle p1 moves from point a to point b and collides with particle p2 and fractures into particle p1a and p1b. the change from p1 to p1a and p1b is the progress of the particles existence.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies Existence doesn’t “progress” any more than it can “regress”. It either is or it isn’t.

Sure, we are all newborn old people.

Of course existence progresses – or does time stand still in your world?

@ragingloli

Thanks for proving that human authored descriptions depict an observation of the physical realm. Our description is a material code referring to a specific quantity of immaterial information that we call time. Time is a type of information. And it is created upon human observation and description. We create time just like we create math and science and “Little House on the Prarie”.

—Man invented a tool called “Stone Henge”, “Sun Dial”, “Clock”, “Watch”... in order to describe the physical universe. How unfortunate that description is used to create a false god called Time—

@DarkScribe

Time stands anyway I want it to in my world. It is a human created tool. It serves me. I can spend it any way I wish. I’m spending it with you currently.

uh no
the progress or change of the particles existence is time.
humans have no influence on it, it will change regardless of our observation and as such, time will exist regardless of our observation.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies

Time has always existed – it is a dimension – all humans have done is develop ways to measure and record it.

Take it up with Stephen Hawking – he has some pretty interesting theories.

@ragingloli
Change is not equivalent to time. Observation is not time. Time is a code authored by humans. Time is a description. It points to things. It provides information. It provides information about particle collision. But time is not particle collisions.

Where exactly was the false god of time before humans existed?

@DarkScribe

He never answers his phone when I call. He doesn’t really want to speak with me about this

@DarkScribe

A dimension created by humans.

Planck’s Constant
“represents solution to prove the new measurement for time of the moving body”

They use the material world to create an immaterial entity (concept).

and

“Every moving body has its own speed and its own time. ”

So Wrong

It should read, “Every moving body has its own characteristics, some of which humans define as speed and time.

The moving body did not speak to us. It cannot tell us it speed or time. It is not alive. We must resort to describing it for ourselves. We do this with tools created by humans. Those tools help us author descriptions. Some of those descriptions are “speed” and “time”. But the universe doesn’t know what time it is.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies A dimension created by humans.

No, it is a dimension that would still exist regardless of whether any humans existed to observe it.

@DarkScribe

You make it sound like a God. I feel like I’m debating a fundie. Can you point to where I might find Time or God in this dimension? You’ve obviously seen one of them otherwise you wouldn’t insist it actually exists.

Will Time and God go on when humans become extinct?

Time is a global meme complex.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies an you point to where I might find Time or God in this dimension?

Here we go – I was wondering how long it would take for you to start juggling strawmen.

I made no mention of God – gods are not involved. Do you really believe that every object in the universe had no age before mankind crawled out of the swamp? If it had an age, then time passed, regardless of whether it was named or observed.

yes, time is not change. but time is represented by change and motion. indeed no one knows what time really is, and neither do you, btw
but we know several things about time. time is not constant, but relative to an “observer” (observer in this sense can be anything, from a human to a rock floating in space). Time is affected by velocity and gravity. for example a piece of uranium caught in the gravitational field of a black hole will have an increased half life compared to an initially identical piece of uranium outside the field, which shows that time and motion and space are tied to each other.
Time is not an abstract concept invented by humans that would not exist otherwise. Time is an integral part of the universe itself, just like the three spatial dimensions.

also please explain to me why you have to call time a “god”? we may have difficulty describing what time really is, but it is not a completely intangible concept like deities.
we can measure the passage of time by observing motion (incidentally the second is defined as “the duration of 9,192,631,770 periods of the radiation corresponding to the transition between the two hyperfine levels of the ground state of the caesium 133 atom”) we can compare differences in the passage of time by measuring it in two different reference frames with differing velocity. none of which can be done with gods.
i find it peculiar of you to equate a very real, measurable property of the universe that is independent from humans and their thought processes to gods, who are completely fictional constructs of the human mind and that can not be measured, neither directly nor indirectly by its effects, and that does not have any effects on reality other than perpetrated by humans drivien by their own delusions.

@DarkScribe

Humans developed the notion of “age” alongside the concept of “time”.

Before humans, there wasn’t a concept of those immaterial things. Yet you want to tell me they always were… and always will be…?

Well if time just simply was and always will be then that my friend… is forever! You’ve just answered this question, _How do you define forever? by defining it exactly the same as time.

———————————-
as I said earlier

—“For” means to be in favor of. “Ever” is a specific designation of no particular time.

Forever is to be in favor of no particular time. Hence, without time.

Forever is beyond the notion of time.”—

@ragingloli

No. Time is not “represented by change and motion”

Time is represented with sentient authored code.

another way to try to explain it to you.
imagine a rock in a 3 dimensional space.
then imagine the same rock in that same 3 dimensional space, but now at a different position. then imagine several different scenes with the same rock in the same space, but in each scene the rock is at an incremental postion from the former scene to the last scene.
remember, all this would have happened even without you or anyone else present.
what is the property of this space that is behind this progression and difference in position?

No. Time is not “represented by change and motion”
Time is represented with sentient authored code.
now that is bullshit. a rock moving from point a to be is not code. it is motion. don’t mistake or equate the concept of time that you have created in your mind with the actual property of the universe. because that is the error that you are making all this time, no pun intended

If time were not a real thing, then the universe would be very messy because everything would happen at once. All humans did was figure out a way to express it and measure it.

@ragingloli
“no one knows what time really is, and neither do you, btw”

I claim that it isn’t. Not that it is.

@ragingloli
“time is not constant, but relative to an “observer” (observer in this sense can be anything, from a human to a rock floating in space).”

So…... a rock can be an observer? Huh?

@ragingloli
“Time is affected by velocity and gravity.”

As you said “but relative to an “observer” This observer notes that “forever” is the constant. And I do mean constant _constantly on, constantly off, constantly there, constantly not there.

Time is our human creation to define Forever. Our creation requires tools to manifest itself. Forever does not. Human tools fail in extremes. How can the constant fail? Human tools are “relative to an “observer”.

Shall I trust an observer to tell me his relative truth about what I must observe? Will he accept my relative truth over his own? What to do?

Or shall I trust the constant as truly being constant? Everything else is a description.

by observer i do not mean a sentient entity. by observer i mean ANY object that is itself affected by and part of spacetime.

I refuse to personify chaos… we don’t need another religion

I claim that it isn’t.
If time did not exist, then there would only be 3 dimensions, height, width and depth.
Any activity within that space would be simultaneous.
Without time actually existing we would not even have the concept of time, because that concept arose from the observation of the physical representation of time which is motion. motion requires that every step is distinct from each other. without time, these steps would not be distinct from each other because they would all be one, there would be no motion and as such we could not observe it to create the concept of time in our head. there would be no causality because causality requires that an event happen before an other event to influence it (except in some special cases of spacetime where effect comes before the cause). causality itself is dependent on the actual existence of time. we would not have any concept for past, present or future. we would be like the wormhole aliens from deep space 9, who had no concept of time because for them, time did physically not exist, existence for them “is”.

“the physical representation of time which is motion”

The physical representation of time, is code (11:54pm where I am). I just represented time by authoring a code to create information. The name of this code is time. The purposeful intent of this code is to describe the motion between the Earth and our Sun.

“Any activity within that space would be simultaneous.”

You don’t know that. You think motion and time are the same things. Not me. One describes the other. And before man invented time, he would set out on the hunt with plenty of motion, concerned only about catching the game. He did not know when he would return because he had no time to define when with. And his motions were not dependent upon somebody’s math equation either.

Sure, lets take the smallest measurable distance, and the fastest known phenomenon (light) and measure an interaction between them. We call that measurement Time

Oh but wait! Tomorrow we find and even smaller measurable distance, and an even faster known phenomenon… and poof! Worship the New God!

Nobody knows what time it is… because it isn’t (unless we create it).

Time is a trick that we play on each other.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies he would set out on the hunt with plenty of motion, concerned only about catching the game. He did not know when he would return because he had no time to define when with.

You are more and more amusing. Are you posting “tongue in cheek?

Do you think that a child, before it can tell time, has no concept of “when”? Do you think that animals don’t know when certain things are likely to occur? Do you REALLY think that your caveman didn’t expect to be back before dark, before the animals moved to water, or the moon rose – or some other marker of time in a pre-horary world?

_He did not know when he would return because he had no time to define when with. _
oh come one, you must be smarter than this. ever heard of the day and night cycle?

The physical representation of time, is code
no it is not.

You think motion and time are the same things
no. i said time is represented by motion
motion is dependent on time. without time there can be no motion.
motion is the change in positions within the known three dimensional space.
this three dimensional space has no function for motion. all it accomodates is position.
motion needs a dedicated 4th dimension to occur within the 3 dimensional space. this 4th dimension is time.
think about this logically for once. there has to be a 4th dimension (time) because motion exists and the already established 3 dimensions, by housing position only, can not contain motion.

@DarkScribe

Not before they could codify a description of the concept. Thinking cannot occur without a code to think the thought upon. Anything less is pure awareness, like being in the zone, or runners high, or any extremely intense meditative practice. Perhaps the feeling of time slowing down just before a car crash, or the feeling of time speeding up when you’re having fun, is related to this process. No thinking is required in any of these situations. Some would tell you that the goal of meditation is to stop thinking altogether. Awareness is different than thinking, and it seems no less capable.

@DarkScribe

To think about it in the way you describe requires planning. All plans are codified information, even if only in your mind.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies Not before they could codify a description of the concept.

Do you believe that before language there was no reason? It seems that way based on your responses.

@ragingloli

Well that’s the root of our weed. You think:
“time is represented by motion”

I think, time is represented by code to describe motion.

Not sure where this will go?

@DarkScribe

You’d have to know a bit more about what I consider language to be. I prefer the word “code” to language, as all languages are a form of code. Codes come in many forms… wink nod.

No no… scratch that. I RETRACT!!! Haha…

I think
time is information, expressed on a sentient authored code, for the sentient purpose of describing motion

hey it’s been fun… good night

your step of putting your “code” between time and motion is completely unnecessary.
there is the “concept of time” and there is “time” itself. if there was no time, in which of the three dimensions of the 3 dimensional space do you think the motion , e.g. the different steps in the change of the position in space, is positioned? hint: it is measured on neither of the three. an object has 4 coordinates, the first three make up the position in 3 dimensional space, the 4th coordinate is the position within the progression of motion from one state of position in 3 dimensional space and another state in 3 dimensional space. this 4th coordinate can not be attributed to any of the three dimensions. It needs an additional 4th dimension. This 4th dimension is time.
And until you understand that, there is really no point to continue arguing.

One more before bed. You may have the last word.

I never said there wasn’t a 4th dimension. I said that man created the 4th dimension, and named it space/time coordinate.

You talk about “different steps in the change of the position in space”, very similar to _time-code on a movie disk. Time-Code is only as good as our observations allow us to describe. 20 years ago we filmed forever at 18fps. Currently we can capture it at 300fps.

When you speak of “different steps”, that depends on technology’s ability to observe them. But that in no way means there are “different steps” in forever . I propose that forever is fluid, and without “different steps” at all. Technology simply learns faster ways of slicing it up to make sense. We cannot comprehend the fluid forever without dimension, and so must make sense_out of it… as in _create it.

i did not mean to imply that time is somehow just a series if snapshots. i used steps to clearly illustrate the change and progression.

I said that man created the 4th dimension, and named it space/time coordinate.
humans did not create any of the dimensions, not the 1st, not the 2nd, not the 3rd and certainly not the 4th. we discovered them, made concepts based on them, named them and integrated the concepts into one single model, backed up by the theory of relativity and many experiments done to verify the correctness.
at no point was actual time and space created by humans, we only created the concepts and models to describe the already physically existing properties of the universe.

When the protons start to decay big time.

@ragingloli

Hello and good morning. Forgot to mention, I don’t believe in the other dimensions either. Noting that the 4th dimension is just a summation of the other 3. We can sum them all up with the word _“spacetime”.

No really… how can there be a ”thing” called height (unless we created it) to describe a measurement of distance? A distance that cannot exist in our physical realm because to travel it requires the traveler to always go half way first. The concept of a ”whole” demands a concept of a ”half”. Since we can never accomplish the whole because we must first go half, then the whole does not exist in physical reality. The whole is beyond the capability of energy and matter alone to produce. The whole requires concept to exist. Concept requires a mind. Whole = Energy + Matter + Information. Anything less is UnWholly.

@RealEyesRealizeRealLies

You realise of course that time only exists to stop everything happening at once.

(It makes as much sense as any of your claims.)

Some people define forever as “as long as the grass shall grow and the rivers shall run.” However, some think that it means until we need whatever it is for ourselves.

@DarkScribe

Our language breaks down in discussing these notions, failing miserably to describe the indescribable. We cannot suppose that terms reserved for concepts of time “everything happening at once” may be properly applied to concepts of forever. We need a new vocabulary to think these concepts upon, lest the fire ant be tempted to claim his hill as equal to New York City.

We cannot rightfully claim that anything happens ever in forever. Forever is forever beyond time.

I see forever as time related, but it transcends space and time. It is everything at all times.

Forever to me is for all your life. Throughout eternity. For as long as infinity.
That is how long my love for my Husband and Son will last.