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kevbo's avatar

Does national security necessitate total world domination (external and internal)?

Asked by kevbo (25675points) March 9th, 2010

N.B. Looks like the idea of “national security” is more of a jumping off point to a larger idea.

I’m playing devil’s advocate to my own conventional thinking in asking this question. Also, I’m sure there’s a simpler or more concise way of explaining this concept, but I don’t know it, so pardon my wordiness if that is the case.

The thought I want to test is whether national security for the U.S. (and more broadly for what we generally think of as our alliance of western democracies) necessitates the control of everything that is to be controlled if only for the purpose of negating an enemy’s (or conflicting ideology’s control) and maintaining dominance in the balance of power. In other words, if we don’t have our thumb on a given resource, whether it is oil or the flow of information or the beliefs (by means of propaganda) that motivate individuals to pledge support to our political, military and corporate apparatus will we necessarily lose dominance to another power. Are our only choices then to assume or abdicate that power? If so, then don’t the ends necessarily justify the means whether it is a false flag event or the rescinding of absolute freedoms such as those of free speech and freedom from search and seizure?

Taking that thought one step further, should not the political, military and corporate apparatus that dominate the balance of power enjoy the freedom to do so as they see fit even if that means expending hearts, minds and bodies of its supporters and benefactors? Isn’t it safe to trust that the subjugation demanded by these powers is only equal to the need to ensure dominance in the balance of power? Even if the demands of these entities err on the side of indulgence in satisfying some greed and lust at the expense of supporters and benefactors is that not preferable to the loss of power that may by “natural” law be assumed by an “enemy.” Does that not make it okay to subjugate weaker nations, because if we don’t it will strengthen a rival nation that will subjugate it otherwise?

At the end of the day does all of the above signify little more than a natural consequence of a bedrock truth, that in the material world we must all navigate the churn of political power. I would add ”(or be consumed by it)” but are we not consumed by it regardless? Do we only get to choose to some degree how we will be consumed? In a way, is the whole process sort of amoral? That really the only constant is the churn?

When it comes to talk of a new world order or one world government, is this not just another manifestation of the balance of power described and the degree to which any of us benefit by, for example, the absence of war is offset by increased individual sacrifice?

Assuming we are invested to any degree in the material world, doesn’t this line of thinking make sense? Do you see holes in this argument? If not, do you find it palatable, especially when compared to the options of blind patriotism (or being blinded by any uncritical -ism) or equally detrimental angst and anger perpetuated by “delusional” (if you accept the above) beliefs in pacifism, self-determinism, the Constitution, etc.

If we cannot manifest universal peace and liberation because it does not (yet?) exist in this material existence, is it not preferable to see this amoral churn, accept it for what it is, and navigate it as best as one can? Other than for the satisfaction of exercising of one’s personal beliefs or motivations is it not worth worrying about the deaths of 3,000 Americans or 1,000,000,000 Iraqis or because the churn of power dictates that these deaths and injustices will occur more or less regardless of who is on the barrel end and who is on the trigger end of the exchange? Is attempting to profit from these inevitabilities merely a sophisticated way of accepting them as such? (And by extension or derivative the opportunity for profit will create a similar amoral churn.)

I guess what I’m arriving at is that perhaps mouth breathing red staters are right even if most don’t understand fully why that is so. Trying this thought on for size certainly alleviates my seemingly perpetual distress. Is this what it’s all about? More so than peace on earth and goodwill towards men as nice as that may sound?

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13 Answers

davidbetterman's avatar

Yes. Not only world domination, but universal domination as well as multi-dimension domination and Quantum domination.
To think otherwise makes you… why, it makes you a traitor.

Mikelbf2000's avatar

the U.S. is not trying to subjugate anyone. I don’t see an U.S. Empire rising. As for the Taliban and Al Qaeda, Those are threats to the U.S. and the free world. They have proven that even before 9/11. Therefore we need to go confront these threats before they come to our soil.

CaptainHarley's avatar

The ends do not justify the means used to reach them, and no one stays on top forever.

marinelife's avatar

No! The U.S. has crossed the line in recent years in my opinion. Iraq being one example.

Vincentt's avatar

I haven’t even read the whole question, but I’m going to throw this out nonetheless: if you make more enemies, there’s more danger to national security. Plus, civil war’s a threat too. Best to just keep everyone happy, which works best by being nice instead of dominating them.

wundayatta's avatar

Oh please! If you have half a brain at all you know you can’t control—at least, not for all that long. Your only real choice for safety is cooperation and inter-dependence. Only fearful, stupid people believe they can control anything big for any significant period of time. They don’t know history and they don’t know human society or psychology.

Next time you want to try to play devil’s advocate, @kevbo, don’t do such an unconvincing job of it.

kidkosmik's avatar

@Mikelbf2000 But there is an empire, the corporate oligarchy. As far as the Taliban and Al Qaeda are concerned you don’t need to invade and destroy an entire country to get to them. I thought the U.S. had the strongest military in the world? Does that not include special forces and intelligence? Could we not have cleaned up with our covert ops? How much money goes into the CIA, NSA, and other agencies. Come on now!

Mikelbf2000's avatar

@kidkosmik In order for it to be an empire The U.S. government would have to not only invade but also annex a country. the United States have not annexed any country other than Native American territories parts of mexico and that was about 200 years ago. There is no empire. The United States have not subjugated anyone in these recent conflicts. As for the corporate oligarchy. That’s every powerful country. Not just the United States. Money rules the world.

kevbo's avatar

@Mikelbf2000, if I said “corporate oligarchy” would that make a difference in your response?

kidkosmik's avatar

@Mikelbf2000 Money rules the world.

QFT

You don’t need to annex a country to control it, that’s so the 19th century. Invasions still seem popular.

Mikelbf2000's avatar

@kidkosmik @kevbo the U.S. is not trying to take over the world. annex may seem “so 19th century” but the fact remains the the U.S. has no real control over any other soil other than its own. An empire would require the U.S government to subjugate another. Which it does not. This so called “corporate oligarchy” to me just sound like another thing people made up to criticize the U.S governments foriegn polocies. Eveyone has a theory. this BS has gone on even before the U.S. even existed.

kidkosmik's avatar

@Mikelbf2000 I’ll concede that the U.S. doesn’t have complete control… It cannot go into, let’s say France, and start creating policy. However anything not considered a “super power” is up in the air.

The corporate oligarchy is made up… of corporations that can and have influenced our government to do things that the people would not stand for. Not only here but in other countries. Multi-National corporations like Coca-Cola and Walmart.

Let me provide an example with a case that is beyond belief. Enjoy this video on the Monsanto Company. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6262083407501596844#

Fenris's avatar

The problem is that this line of reasoning depends on there being such a thing as security. It should never have been a noun, should’ve been content to stay an adjective, because security is like enlightenment – only fools believe in it’s total achievability. It is the process of making it harder to steal, destroy or otherwise change something than the value of the object or subject being changed. In fact, I would go so far as to say all this “security” is what’s breeding so much insecurity – and insecurity is the worm that bores the wood to rot.

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