Why on clocks and watches is the Roman Numeral 4 written IIII instead of IV?

According to Wikipedia, using IIII instead of IV “creates a visual symmetry with the VIII on the other side, which the two-character IV would not.” The article also says that using IIII keeps the total number of Is (bars) at 20, while the Vs and Xs remain at 4 each. As such, clock makers “need only a single mold with a V, five Is, and an X in order to make the correct number of numerals for their clocks: VIIIIIX.”

I didn’t even think to wikipedia it. Meanwhile, if I had written IIII in class when I was in high school it would have been marked wrong. Thanks for looking it up for me. I still find it odd.

Another reason is that when you do IV and VI some people would get confused. Especially on old clocks that had all the numbering on the dials facing outwards.

I just mixed up IV and VI tonight without even paying attention. I was putting a series of horror movies in order in my Netflix queue and realized I had requested 6 before 4. Temporary dyslexia.

Maybe I need to get out more or get a watch but I have never seen the number 4 written in Roman numerals as anything but IV. Is it just watches?

Great question! I have literally never noticed this before!

@lillycoyote I have only noticed it on timepieces, but the wiki link implies both ways were acceptable in the past.

You learn something new every day. :)

We have a big clock on the mantle in our livingroom and I always noticed the four was written “IIII” and I used to assume that was right when I was little because I originally learned Roman numerals from that clock.

This clock looks weird to me!

@DominicX So does that mean you didn’t learn Roman Numerals in school?

@JLeslie

No, I did; that was before I learned it in school. I remember my mom telling me the 4 on the clock was wrong, but I don’t think she knew the reason why it was written “IIII”.

The number four when used alone (as opposed to 44 or 104, etc.) has always been represented as IIII in ancient Rome. And although the jury is out as to why IIII is used instead of IV, many historians believe it may be due to the Romans’ pagen beliefs. I & V are the first two letters of the name of Jupiter (IVPPITER OPTIMVS MAXIMVS), the supreme god in ancient Rome. Using IV alone may have been considered blasphemy or disrespectful.

@AstroChuck I find that answer… fascinating. Bravo.

What’s with the Removed by Fluther moderators? What did I, or anyone else, say that warrented removal?

Cos thats the way the Romans used to write it…... :)

@DominicX I see, I had misunderstood. So, you had noticed as well. Whenever, I ask other people, I have asked people who sell watches, friends, etc., most people say they had never even noticed. No one has ever had an explanation. Then it occured to me yesterday to ask the collective.

I heard an urban legend (long before they were known as such) that Charles V had said that nothing should come before the V. (not sure where I heard it).

Why were those comments removed???