Do "celestial beings" really exist?

I don’t know if they do or not. Or did. I find the stuff endlessly fascinating, though.
If you want some interesting reads, pick up some books by Zecharia Sitchin. I don’t consider him “the bible” but for pure thought provoking (and sci-fi inducing, including “The Fourth Kind”), he rocks.

For “totally weird,” this is my favorite picture.

It depends on how we describe celestial beings. I think it is possible, even probable, that the ancients had technologies which have been lost to us, their descendants.

No.

It’s like arguing that sphinxes and griffons exist because of all the drawings various cultures made of them.

The Egyptians did not have magical alien technologies. If they did, their monuments would have been much more impressive.

Pyramids are really not that hard to build, guys.

There was another question like this a while ago, and I remember suggesting how the hypothetical magical aliens would have decided to interact with the Egyptians.

ON THE SPACESHIP:

Emperor Zargon: “Hey look, a blue planet. Want to go hang out with the natives?”

Zeblog: “Sure, what should we do?”

Zargon: “Let’s land by that river valley and help them build stuff.”

Zeblog: “Build what? Like spaceships, skyscrapers, power plants, telescopes…”

Zargon: “Don’t be crazy, man! I was thinking more along the lines of the exact same shit everyone else on this planet is building at this moment in time—large hills of piled stones. But perhaps a little bigger this time.”

Zeblog: “Okay sounds fun”

@Qingu I can’t stress this enough, but I neither believe nor disbelieve all the “alien visits the Earth” stuff. I feel that’s important to stress and repeat.

Because, any assumptions that we make about aliens, if they exist or existed, is flawed. Your reasoning will probably not apply to beings that are completely alien to this Earth and the culture. Not to mention technology.

For reasons dealing with really, really long commutes, I’ve spent a lot of time trying to figure out how things might go, or not go, if there had been visitations. Two things I always came up against were the psychology of aliens, which I’d never be able to figure out without actually having an alien, and technology.

Since I can’t address the psychology, I’ll make a point about technology.

If you read a passage from an ancient text that went along the lines of this:

“And then the god Xenu wrote on his clay tablet and showed me a picture of the world that appeared. He touched the tablet again and the picture disappeared.”

If you were studying that text twenty or thirty years ago you’d think, “Wow, a magical clay tablet.” But now you’d think, “Huh, the gods had iPads.”

Why don’t we see alien litter? Maybe they were very “green” and their stuff broke down after a few years. Or they perfected nano technology and after a certain amount of time little nano bots were activated to break down all the materials.

But, boy, do I love this stuff as a thought exercise.

But the Egyptians were not more technologically advanced than their neighbors.

In fact, there is a very clear, very obvious progression from mounds to ziggurats to pyramids. Again: why on earth would aliens need to be involved?

There’s simply no evidence to support what you’re saying. It’s an argument from ignorance

I’m not saying aliens built anything. Maybe they lent a hand? Helped in planning? I don’t know; couldn’t say one way or another. Like I said, I’m stressing that point. It’s not an argument from ignorance because I’m not saying anything in or around Egypt was built by aliens.

What I am saying is that we have no idea what would be going through an aliens mind and it would be futile to even guess.

Okay.

Likewise, I could say “we don’t know if fairies built the Sears Tower.” Maybe they didn’t. But maybe they did, and then they used their fairy magic to brainwash people into thinking humans built it. We have no idea what goes through fairies heads, or how fairy magic works.

I don’t remember fairies being part of the question.

Yes, the one typing and crafting responses right now!!!!!!

@mrentropy, I was trying to illustrate something.

If I asked you, “Did fairies build the Sears Tower,” would you then say “I don’t know, because we don’t know how fairy magic works?”

I would just say “No, because there is no evidence that non-humans built the Tower, or that said fairies exist in the first place.” That applies equally to aliens and ancient Egypt.

@Qingu Yes, I know. But it doesn’t apply. I’m not the original author of the question and my interest isn’t if aliens built tourist attractions. However, given the art and writings of the venerable ancient people I don’t think it’s too outrageous to think that there may have been some help from people from a different world. It could be wrong, it probably is wrong, but I can understand why someone would think that was the case.

My issue is when people think they know the reasoning that an alien would use. If you want to argue against celestial beings coming to Earth and providing engineering help to a bunch of Egyptians, then do that. If you’re going to ridicule the question with a humorous play starring two aliens, then hold off. Your first answer was better than your second.

Like I said, I find the topic fascinating and wouldn’t mind going back and forth with hypothetical arguments. One of those arguments are: you can’t decide what an alien would or wouldn’t do because you’re not an alien and have no experience with one (unless you know something the rest of us don’t).

I suppose, though, I could relent a little and say that Egyptian Gods = Faeries = Aliens, but I don’t see any reason to address that.

“Pyramids aren’t that hard to build, guys. ”
I thought the stones weighed several tons each? And that they fit against each other almost perfectly? And how tall is the Great Pyramid that wasn’t “that hard to build?” How did they get the TOP rocks up there? One hundred Egyptians walking uphill (on rocks) pulling a rock weighing several tons taken from a land without rocks.
Sounds difficult to me. Just the thought of it makes my neck hurt.

Yeah right, and in that high desert heat too. With sand blowing.
Just how strong is a rope anyways?
How much weight can those twines hold, lift and transport???

(There’s so much “Crock” written in our history. No wonder they had a Croccodile God.)

I place my bets on Aliens for the simple reason that it’s just too much work for men to do, let alone thousands of men! And for many decades?
Oh come on, name one man who after mowing the lawn, on a riding lawn mower, doesn’t have to rest with a couple cold beers when he’s finished the lawn.
A Pyramid? oh pleeeze!
yup! Aliens is my final answer. They had gravity technology, lazers to cut with and had they left their blueprints, there would not be any mystery as to WHO built those monuments. Other than maybe arguing if they were Martians, Venusians, or another solar system.

@GrumpyGram, I meant that the technology necessary for building pyramids is minimal.

Obviously, the pyramids took a lot of work. But with thousands of laborers (and/or slaves) working with levers, pulleys, levels, and other well-known ancient technology over a span of decades, they simply don’t require any special or supernatural explanation.

@mrentropy, As for examining the psychology of the aliens, that wasn’t meant as a serious examination but rather as a mockery of the premise of the question. The topic presumes that the ancient Egyptians accomplished something supernatural. That is simply not the case; the pyramids are an elaboration on a well-established architectural pattern at the time. There’s simply nothing to even spur a discussion of whether or not aliens helped them, anymore than aliens building the Sears Tower.

Moreover, the way of thinking that gives countenance to “aliens building the pyramids” and other conspiracy theories really bothers me. Not least because real history and real technological development is far more interesting.

@OneMoreMinute, I’m not sure what you mean by “it’s too much work.” Are you suggesting the workers in the ancient Egyptian theocracy would revolt? Or what? The physical act of building a pyramid, with the technology they had, in that span of time, is certainly not “too much work,” as any engineer will tell you.

@Qingu yes that’s what I’m saying. The twine/ropes and men doing it all by their own hands. And in the weather and environmental conditions. I am going against what was shoved down my throats in the history books and going by what seems to be simple logic.
It is much easier for me to believe in Aliens with advanced technology than slaved labor and ropes.
I question religion too.

Here’s a wiki article about the Babylonian ziggurat originally built 4,000 years ago.

Did aliens build that?

What about some of the smaller, less impressive (but still impressive) pyramids pictured on the pyramid article. Did aliens build those? Or just the big ones?

What is the basis for saying aliens built some ancient structures, but not others?

@OneMoreMinute, you should question religion. Unfortunately, your logic is the exact same as that used by religious people to prop up creationism.

“Bacteria couldn’t have evolved swimming tails, therefore God must have designed them.”

“The ancient Egyptians couldn’t have built the pyramids by hand in 30 years, therefore aliens must have helped them.”

@OneMoreMinute, they used levers. We actually know for a fact that it would be possible with levers and with enough manpower. The physical laws governing pyramid building aren’t that complicated, and are well-known.

In fact, that’s why the pyramid shape is common to so many ancient cultures. It’s the most easy and obvious “tall building” to make. Compared to, say, a Gothic cathedral (also built by hand and only with simple machines, with less workers, in less time)

@Qingu I watched a documentary on the History channel last night on Ancient Egyptian and Gods and sex. The carvings of their phallus’s are more than impressive.

Up until last night I thought the biggest mystery was how those pyramids were built.
Now it is how did ANY organized religion take down what those Ancient Egyptian societies had going and turn sex into a nasty and punishable sin.

I cannot comment on how creation did what it did. or does what it does. Especially since I started taking the red pill to escape out from the matrix.

but I DO believe in Aliens because it makes total sense to me.

@OneMoreMinute, it’s telling that, based on your previous posts, I am actually not sure if you’re joking when you say “since I started taking the red pill to escape out of the Matrix.”

Re: Egyptian religion, I’m actually sympathetic to the idea that “Moses,” to the extent that such a figure existed, was perhaps an exile from the monotheistic, short-lived cult of Akenaten. The Hebrew religion was really a mish-mash of mythological ideas from the Mesopotamian area; it seems reasonable that some Egyptian travelers brought their own ideas into the mix.

That said… aliens making the pyramids makes as much sense to me as Yahweh creating humans from clay. The natural explanations are better, and more interesting.

@Qingu I am quite serious. Yet I make my points in light hearted fashions.
so it might appear that I’m joking. sorry to mislead you.

for me to say taking the red pill, means, to not go along with the majority just because “they said so”
To question, to think, to figure out things for myself. To not take the same pharmesuetical pill that the other sheeple take. I have watched Zeitgeist 1 and 2 and found it very informative.

I don’t know why you choose to not believe in Aliens. Do you also believe we are the only planet with I-pods and HDTV and Pizza and race cars?

But I find the entire concept of employing thousands and thousands of men as slaves to roll and lift mega tons of stone, on levers, in precise precision, for decades in extreme sun blistering heat, parched from thirst, and desert sands blowing, while the Ancient Egyptian Gods are having the sexual time of their lives with their woman, quite frankly, the BIGGEST DAMN BLUE PILL TO SWALLOW…EVER!!!

@Qingu…just sayin! ;-)

Even today the Great Pyramid is amazing! The pyramid measures 756 feet by 756 feet at the base and is 481 feet tall. It is made up of more than 2 million blocks weighing about 3 tons each. I wonder how they measured for it? Tape measures? Rulers?

@GrumpyGram Yeah!
Do you see why it becomes so easy to say Alien technology? You try holding the tape measure in direct desert sun, day after day, month after month, year after year, decade after decade. With sand blowing at you. Sweating. And the ropes are always wearing down and breaking. And it all is in perfect degree line up with north. With no room for error. All completed inside exact measurements.

@OneMoreMinute Maybe the ropes didn’t break back then. Let us not forget bathroom breaks, either. And lunch; what about lunch? Surely those men needed lunch to stay strong. And depression. How could they not be depressed living like that?
I wonder what they ate for lunch? And how would they get DOWN from the top after securing each rock?
It was one tough life, that’s for sure.

Well I’m guessing they must have ate Cryptonite for lunch Grumpy!

(And they got down from a duck! Even back then! Or maybe an Egret!) ;-)

But wait! There’s More! Pyramidologists speak here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvPQc_ssz20&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0o0gpWiI4o&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_N_ydWg6e4E&feature=related

@OneMoreMinute, I believe there are aliens. It would be unimaginable if intelligent life didn’t exist elsewhere in the universe. Maybe even intelligent life similar to ours, with cells and brains. Of course, life is just an arbitrary category: I’d be willing to call the storms on Jupiter (one of which has “lived” for more than 300 years) a form of life.

However, there’s simply no evidence that any aliens were involved with the Egyptian pyramids. Your “evidence” is that you can’t personally believe that large numbers of people worked hard to construct the pyramids. I have no idea why you don’t believe this perfectly reasonable and well-documented part of the historical record; perhaps you are taking the wrong pills.

@GrumpyGram, the fact that you think they would have needed “tape measurerers” to measure it indicates you don’t know how people used to build things. Just because you can’t imagine doing it, or don’t know how people built it, doesn’t mean that aliens did it.

Do you know how the Sears Tower was built? I don’t. Way harder to build than the pyramid. Does that mean aliens must have built it?

As for people working hard in hot desert conditions… do you people realize that this is happening, today, in Dubai?

Perhaps foreign construction workers living in slavelike conditions didn’t actually build the city, but rather, aliens did it.

@Qingu Why don’t you please watch those three youtubes I placed on my previous post.
it really illuminates the numerous problems humans would have building the pyramids in several aspects. I don’t accept it because after viewing the information, it simply doesn’t hold together that humans built the pyramids like they taught us in school. like the many things that I have been re-learning about life. All built on sand foundations. Lies. Lies. Lies.

This documentary convinced me, and there are many others. I am not a researcher, I am a reader, or viewer of what researchers put together. Do you think I did any 1st hand research on this topic? no.

I think Aliens have had many technologies far more advanced than earth people. I would think they had the abilities to harness gravity and warp time and jump through all kinds of hoops.

And, on a more personal note, do you have difficulty accepting when other people don’t agree with you? Is that why you resort to insults? Has that approach been effective for you?
Just so you know, it doesn’t make me want to change my opinion out of some insulting intimidation.

I have a longstanding policy not to watch videos people link to in the absence of making an argument themselves.

If the videos are so convincing, why don’t you summarize their arguments and conclusions?

I don’t care if people disagree with me. I do care rather deeply about unfounded and irrational conspiracy theories, because I care about the truth, and I think this way of thinking—much like religious faith—clouds people’s ability to examine things truthfully. I didn’t mean to “insult” or “intimidate” you.

Here’s the thing about being a “skeptic.” If you’re only skeptical of mainstream theories—but completely willing to believe “alternate” theories with no evidence— you’re doing it wrong. If you want to be skeptical of mainstream theories, that’s great. But you need to be consistent in how you apply your skepticism, and your standard of evidence.

Being a skeptic doesn’t mean knee-jerk rejecting what you’re taught in school and automatically believing any alternate theory. That’s just another kind of gullibility.