Are transsexuals entitled to be addressed as their identified pronouns?

I would agree.

agree

is anyone keeping score here?

Only a bigot or a deliberate troublemaker would behave impolitely.

Agree.

Of course it’s rude.

However, if a person’s appearance is ambiguous, you can’t exactly blame people for assuming the pronoun that most closely matches their appearance. You can’t expect everyone to know what someone wants to be called if it isn’t immediately apparent based on appearance or if they haven’t already specified what they wanted to be referred to by.

People do often refer to transsexuals as the wrong pronoun on purpose as an insult.

Only if anyone else is entitled to theirs.

Definite agreement.

Agree, since by law, they are now female. But I’d rather use their names than their pronouns.

Maximillian

Not necessarily by law.

I admit, it does take me awhile to make the switch in my head. So I have to stick to names rather than make a mistake. I’ve got that going on with someone who’s transitioning at the moment.

I agree. But it also depends if that particular person wants to be called differently(like shemale/ladyboy,real trans,etc).

@Doctor_D there are no ‘fake trans’ people and very few people who are trans like to be called shemale, at all.

@Simone_De_Beauvoir I see. Thanks to explain that.

@Doctor_D

most trans people who like to be called shemales and ladyboys are those who need to go into porn because they cant find other jobs.

I agree. I would use the pronoun that matches how the person self-identifies. If you can’t figure it out, an error should be forgivable.

I do think some people are deliberately ambiguous in how they present, and I’ve wondered at times if some were intentionally trying to cause people discomfort or even just to make a statement by avoiding clear conventional identification.

And there are some folks who are not transsexual at all and yet whose gender identity is still not very clear from appearance. If you’re trying to be courteous and respectful, it’s sometimes hard to know what to do.

Transsexuals are “entitled” to be addressed however they want to be addressed, pretty much like anyone else.

Agree unless someone is used to calling that person “he” then they want to be identified as “she”. Then I think it’s not rude, but something to work on. Otherwise, it can be considered rude, if deliberate.

I think that we should use the pronouns that we’re born with.
That said, I make an effort to avoid pronouns altogether when I feel that they might be offensive. It makes for a fascinating linguistics exercise.

@Nullo: We’re born with nothing, including pronouns. Those are given to us.

I think anyone who uses the wrong pronouns deliberately is an insensitive idiot.

I’d say we’re entitled. It’s just common courtesy. I look like a guy, I sound like a guy, I act like a guy. Why the hell would anyone want to use female pronouns with me? The only reason would be to be intentionally hurtful, and where’s the cool in that?

@KatawaGrey Wiki moar.

A bit off topic…

I abhor it when I do or say something, and someone tells me that I “have balls.” What a sexist statement.

@Nullo: Ayup

I’m perfectly willing to address them in whichever way makes them comfortable. It’s just common courtesy and considerate of their feelings. They have a right to that.

The only ones who would get a pass would be the trans persons own children.

I saw a beautiful segmen in a documentary a while ago with a transexual Father who had completed the transition to female legally and otherwise.

The son was was around 8 or 9 when the surgery was complete and he understood fully what was happening.

But years later he was still addressing her as Dad. She explained that they had multiple conversations and she was fine with it because this was what her son said he was comfortable with when she asked him about it.

She could have insisted that the son address her as female but she had the grace and wisdom to recognize that his comfort was more important than her own.

She explained it thusly “regardless of what he calls me, know that in his heart I’m still his Dad and always will be So if he prefers to call me that, why not? He’s my child and this journey has been tough enough on him. If this provides him a bit of comfort in the midst of it, I don’t care what anybody else thinks is appropriate or not. I care what he thinks. That’s whats important to me.”

As I heard her describing all this, I thought it was such a beautiful illustration of the depths of a parent’s love.

I’m not suggesting that all trans people should do this. But that this particular one was sensitive enough to her son’s needs to communicate honestly and openly with her child and chose what she felt was best for him.

Perhaps other kids are ok with the change of terms but this one wasn’t and she chose his needs over hers.

As a transsexual man myself I completely agree. Although I appreciate that it’s very difficult for someone who’s always referred to me in the past as “she”, to switch and start calling me “he” instead.

Absolutely. But please choose a name that is gender obvious not Pat or Chris

@downtide Thanks for saying that. I always feel guilty when I slip, and refer to one of my friends as “he”, but I knew him for many years as a man, and only a few years as a woman. It’s easiest to make the mistake on line or on the phone; it’s easiest to get it right when she’s in the room.

Agreed. If it’s a genuine mistake, it’s forgivable.

@airowDee Really? Uh. I thought the surgery changes the sex, therefore, the person is identified as the opposite gender. I guess not.

What a great topic for everyone to be so agreeable upon. I agree too!

I don’t like to be ‘Mrs (husband’s first name and husband’s last name’) and was surprised recently to find that Ms was not a title available for my airline ticket when booking it online. Felt very strange to have Mrs in front of my given name.

I think people should be addressed how ever they deem fit. I’ve heard of self proclaimed wizards who insisted on being addressed as such. Fine. Great. Self identity is very much to be respected.

@cazzie: My mother is legally the second as in her name has II after it. She finds that she cannot book tickets with her legal name because once she has entered that she is female, there is no space for her to put the II that is legally on the end of her name. Naturally, I find this ridiculous. I would prefer “Ms.” myself even though i am single because it is nobody’s business whether I am married or not.

@cazzie One of the interesting things I’ve learned since beginning transition is that, at least in the UK, there’s no legal impediment to choosing whatever title (Mr, Mrs, Miss etc) that you choose. The only ones you’re not allowed to use without due reason is ones like Doctor, Reverend, or those implying a military rank. So it’s perfectly acceptable for me to insist on being Mr, even before my transition is complete. You’re even free to make one up, if you so choose.

Also, in the UK, a legal name change is something you can do for free, and you don’t even need a solicitor to countersign it.

@downtide I can’t imagine you could go around calling yourself a Duke, Earl or Sir something in the UK, could you? Make up an imaginary title for yourself, all ‘Landed-Gentry’ type? That would be fun! hahaha.

@cazzie No you can’t, although there are certain “titles” you can buy which entitle you to call yourself by some aristocratic title. You’d be laughed at by the real aristocracy though. It’s also, apparently, not legal to use something like “Duke” or “Lord” as a first name.

I agree completely.

Agree. It’s a matter of basic respect once you know someone’s gender, and should not be contingent on “where” they are in regards to transition, or your knowledge or beliefs about what their anatomy is like.