What does monogamy mean to you?

It means testing the limits of your imagination and sometimes doing things alone to keep your sanity.

It means putting ourselves, our energy, our thoughts, our words, into our relationship.

Certainly, it means nothing physical with another person. But it also means no spending quality time with another person without the other one there. What do I mean by quality time? I mean time when you are focused on what the person you are with is all about.

Does my spouse have lunch with a woman co-worker who he is friends with? Yes.

Does he go off on an adventure outing with one one-on-one? No.

@marinelife You’re going to have to be slightly more specific about “nothing physical.” Surely you can shake hands with other people? What about things like hugging, cuddling, or skinny dipping?

Monogamy to me means that my partner may not do anything romantically intimate with anyone other than me.

@le_inferno That seems sort of ambiguous to me. In some instances sex is not romantically intimate, just as in some cases eye contact is. Is he allowed to kiss or have sex with other people? What about flirting or hugging? Is cuddling necessarily romantically intimate?

(I want to clarify that I’m not asking these questions confrontationally. I’m genuinely curious about the specifics of people’s monogamy.)

I shouldn’t have assumed “he” in that response. Substitute it for you pronouns of choice.

@lapilofu – Your question is a very good one. And for one it shows how important communication is, in all aspects of life. Communication is even more important between two individuals that have chosen to 1. Cohabitate with each other. 2. Have declared to each other that they are each other’s better half, so to speak. 3. And, have made it abundantly clear to each other that they have no desire to mingle with another individual for sex, because these two individuals can talk about sex explicitly, and use all levels of the senses to turn each other on.

Some sort of hardwood.

Monogamy isn’t for me, in the sense that most define it. I am in open marriage and as long as all gets discussed, we’re fine with each other interacting with others and especially when it’s both of us interacting with others together. Betrayal is possible in all relationships and therefore trust can be broken in ours just as much as in any other relationships but, on the bright side, we don’t get rocked over a text message, a look, a night. Keeps us solid.

My partner and I only only intimate with each other, no one else. I do let him look. Not touch.

The reason we are Very conservative with our definition of monogamy is we feel anything other than thoughts about someone else can often lead to breaking up. If this belief is false, I’d be very surprised.
The very idea that he would look the other way if I spent time with someone else is laughable. And he wouldn’t do it because he doesn’t want to risk the upheaval and stress in his life my leaving would cause. It isn’t discussed. It’s an understanding. My last marriage broke up starting with phonecalls (by my ex) then dropping by other womens’ apartments. Look; if a man wants to screw around like that, fine; just stay far away from me. It is naive and dangerous to assume it couldn’t get messy. I don’t need that.
Is it a sacrifice or a deprivation? If it is, too bad. It’s better than the alternative!
If it’s “old fashioned,” so be it. not that people are lining up

@Aster I’m not trying to call anyone’s monogamy old-fashioned. (Though you should be a little more careful about your outright criticism of anyone else’s love-life decisions. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you were talking only about your relationship in your response and not commenting on others’.) I truly believe everyone has the right to whatever relationship works for them. I’m just trying to get a handle on what exactly people’s definitions of monogamy are. I’ve been in monogamous relationships before where it turned out we didn’t have the same understanding of what monogamy was because we had never discussed it—and I’ve talked to a lot of people who this has happened to. I have a close friend who’s boyfriend was affectionate and cuddly with friends, not realizing this would be a problem for my friend. There’s a lot of nuance in human interaction—there’s no such thing as “monogamy” in an ideal (think, platonic) perfectly defined form. Everyone makes rules explicitly or implicitly. I’m trying to understand how people deal with that nuance in the rules they make.

Is my understanding correct then that your monogamy requires that he doesn’t spend time with other women? Does this also mean he has no women friends and you have no men friends?

(Also, if it isn’t discussed how do you know it’s an understanding? How do you know someone understands something if you don’t discuss it?)

I can’t imagine how you can forbid a partner to look at or even fantasize about another person. That borders on thought control and ownership to me. And I would not want to be told or tell about such fleeting thoughts. (Although, we have both occasionally admired a beautiful man or woman.) However, I do draw the line at physical intimacy, including any kind of sex act or nudity. We both often hug and kiss our mutual friends upon meeting – generally in each other’s presence – but not in a sexual way. I have been married to the same man for 36 years and to my knowledge, neither of us has been unfaithful. But it does not mean that we are the only important people in each other’s lives.

@lapilofu I had no intention of judging anyone. I hope it didn’t come off like that.
That is almost correct about the “friends” question. I do not want or need men friends. Thank God for that. He has ONE female friend and , because of her age and other things, I dont care what they do. She is his golf and bridge buddy, definitely older than we are, has been married for 50 years and she reminds both of us of his MOTHER even though I like her and she thinks and speaks much younger than her age.
She is a champ at both activities, he is too, and it matters not.
I wonder what a married woman DOES with a male friend? I have to smile at this question

Monogamy to me is also sexual exclusivity and the agreement to skip making actions you believe your partner wouldn’t appreciate hearing or learning about. Those boundaries are different for everyone but you can find out what makes your partner feel most secure, respected, appreciated and loved by asking rather than trial and error.

@Aster What a married woman does with any friend.

Having friends and trusting your partner that it does not include clothing removal for carnal pleasures.

All relationships should have an unstoppable communication of truth.

But my marriage is the opposite of this question, open and trusting and SAFE we meet the other always as in ANY relationship that moves to another level.

It’s never worked for me, but I’m considering giving it another try.

I have no terms!! we are what we are!!! I have no issues!! this is usally an issue! :-/

@lapilofu The act of sex is an awfully intimate one, even if there’s no emotional investment. In fact, one existing definition of ‘intimate’ is “involved in a sexual relationship.” No he is not allowed to kiss or have sex with other people, because those are intimate acts. Flirting would bother me, because it has a romantic context, as does cuddling. Hugging is rather commonplace and takes place very often outside the realm of romance, so that’s not an issue.

Monogamy means “marry one person and stick with that person until one of you dies.”

A monogamist has but one living spouse at a time. A strict monogamist engages in sexual relations with a person other than that spouse only when the male participant wears a condom.

@le_inferno I don’t disagree that sex is necessarily intimate. I only take issue that it’s necessarily “romantically intimate.” Thanks for clarifying your answer.

To all of you, just a thought and I don’t mean any disrespect, but there are many benefits to being in a relationship where you two know without a shadow of a doubt that you care deeply for each other and lust and love each, and you keep each other healthy mentally and phisiologicaly, and physicaly

@SmoothEmeraldOasis I don’t doubt that what you’re saying is somehow related to this question, but I’d appreciate it if you could clarify that connection for me.

Hmm…well a Monogamous relations is a great one to be in because it comes with many benefits, such as the ones I listed above.

@SmoothEmeraldOasis Hm. I don’t think that’s right. I know a lot of monogamous couples who constantly doubt each other’s love and lust as well as many nonmonogamous people who seem very comfortable with their partners’ love—though I’m pretty sure everyone has doubts some of the time. I don’t believe there’s much correlation there.

I guess what I’m saying is that no one knows those things without a shadow of a doubt and monogamists don’t know it any more than nonmonogamists.

Well, okay then I believe that the individual that doubts may have a premonition that the other significant other may be into other activities. But if the two individuals communicate honestly and can say to themselves that they are not interested in straying to venture to other individuals no matter what temptation is dangled in their face, because they are fullfilled by the significant others presence in their life.

@SmoothEmeraldOasis I’ve been in monogamous relationships where I’ve truly deeply loved the other person and not strayed. I was honest and affectionate with them. But that didn’t stop them from doubting my love from time to time—and some of them doubted quite frequently. I take a little offense at the implication that one suspicious partner implies the other is guilty. Have you never doubted someone who was innocent?

And I’m not fond of your implication that a nonmonogamous couple can’t love and care deeply for each other. What makes you think so?

But I guess the question I’m most interested in, is what level of monogamy do you require to be so certain? Is it okay if your partner has other friends of their preferred gender? Is it okay for them to spend long periods of time with them? Go dress shopping with them? Give them a friendly peck on the lips when saying “hello” or “goodbye”? Would any of these activities make you doubt? Could they go farther if you were truly certain of your partner’s love?

Hmmm. well sorry that you are offended and or are not fond of my implication as you put it, yes I have doubted and then waited to see if I was right in waiting…then in my waiting period I found that in the first encounter with this individual that declared his everything for me and to me. I caught him in out matrimonail bed with the nextdoor neighbor, the second time I extended that trust and I went against my instinct I ended up single with five children and he moved out of the country to live his second life with someone that was the same age as out daughter. I also truly loved deeply and ended getting shafted. Again, each relationship comes with its own transistions, primarily due to the fact that each individual was raised differently and I still harbor much pain over that. I hope that somehow I am clear.

@SmoothEmeraldOasis I’m sorry those things happened to you. People can do terrible things sometimes. Thank you for sharing. It does help clarify how you see relationships.

Yea, no problem, I am trying to move on but once, after trust is abused more than anyone has a right to, it makes it challenging. I am happy with my current life, you know but ofcourse we all need someone to love us and for us to love them.

To be satisfied having sex with the same person and not with others w/o asking or inviting me.

@SmoothEmeraldOasis Being in an open relationship, as I can attest, does mean that you communicate honestly and doesn’t mean that you’re not fulfilled by your soulmate.

Stability.

@SVTSuzie If sex is out, is kissing or cuddling in? Where does sex start for you?

@mattbrowne Uh. Yeah. Monogamy’s real stable, as evidenced by monogamously married couples never getting divorced.

What is it about monogamy that you believe creates stability and what rules have to be followed for that stability to exist?

Rules! Ugh…geez relationship are not games that you play and stop playing when you grow bored or tired. Your dealing with reality. If you do not want to be in a monogamous relationship then say so then move on…stop playing with peoples lives.

@SmoothEmeraldOasis You only follow rules in games, not in reality? I’ve been living so wrong!

But seriously, what I’m trying to get at is each person’s definition of monogamy. Don’t call it a rule if you want (many people call them “agreements” which I like, but which suggests that you’ve discussed and agreed on them, which I’m not sure most monogamous people have done),—but surely you see that any word has a definition and the more clear that definition is, the stronger the word. The less defined it is, the more potential there is that two people use it in different ways.

I think rules are more important in real life then they are in games. In a game, an unclear rule is unlikely to hurt anyone in a long-term way. In real life real people’s well-being is on the line—it’s more important to be clear about your expectations.

@lapilofu you finally have me convinced that you are a decent intelligent individual and only want to live a good life and share it someone that may also already be in your life, or are seeking one special person that shares your same views. I wish you all the best. I truly do.

@SmoothEmeraldOasis I appreciate that! I believe the same about you. I’m not trying to persuade anyone to change the way they’re living their life—I just want people to think critically about their beliefs while getting a better understanding of other people myself.

@lapilofu – I was talking about myself. The question was what monogamy means to me. It can mean something else to you.

@mattbrowne That’s fair. I shouldn’t’ve been so quick to assume you were talking generally. Apologies. Still, any chance you’d like to elaborate on my followup questions? The elaboration was the real question.

@lapilofu – Alright, you asked, What is it about monogamy that you believe creates stability and what rules have to be followed for that stability to exist?

Well, first of all there seems to be a genetic foundation that turned monogamy into a successful survival model for humans, although the genetic makeup of the human species also contains polygamical elements. I mentioned this before:

There are two male evolutionary strategies for passing on their genes.

1) Have sex with as many healthy women as possible being always on the move.

2) Have sex with one healthy woman and make sure that as many children as possible from this relationship grow up to have sex themselves.

One feeling capable of explaining strategy number 2 is jealousy. Why does this feeling exist? There must be a reason. There are hormones such as oxytocin and vassopressin favoring monogamy. Another element of stability can be explained by human psychology. Scientists found out that on average monogamous married people have a slightly higher life expectancy.

There are many rules supporting stability and I’d like to pick out the following:

Learn how to accept the imperfections of your partner.

@mattbrowne – I am just floored and I appreciate you explanaition very much, I am still assimilating part of it but it makes so much sense, and lets me know why my first husband that he could behave as listed in No.2 I on the other hand would not for anything accept that imperfection that he insisted was an illness that needed to be treated. But he never sought treatment, he just kept playing the field so to speak.

@mattbrowne I like your answer, but this statement rubs me the wrong way: “Why does this feeling exist? There must be a reason.” I think there are a great many things in this world that exist for no reason. Jealousy may partly be in our nature, but it may also be at least partly conditioned. In either case, it’s effects can certainly be reduced by anyone with the desire and the willingness to put in the effort. Based on what I’ve read of oxytocin, I’m inclined to believe it’s effects are dramatically overstated.

“Scientists found out that on average monogamous married people have a slightly higher life expectancy.” I can think of a few reasons this might be, but I’d love to read this study in full. Is it available?

@lapilofu – Important emotions exist for a reason. The best example is fear. There is innate fear (great heights) and there is conditioned fear (someone pointing a gun at you). Jealousy might very well be a combination of nature and nurture as well.

I read about life expectancy in this book

http://www.amazon.com/Authentic-Happiness-Psychology-Potential-Fulfillment/dp/0743222989/

I think there are tons of studies and not all of them might come to the same conclusions. I briefly searched the web and came up with this

http://longevity.about.com/od/wholiveslongest/a/marriage_le.htm

pointing out that singles are catching up and there’s

http://www.city-journal.org/html/10_4_why_marriage_is.html

referring to Linda J. Waite’s book “The Case for Marriage” listing 10 reasons for marriage/monogamy such as

- Marriage lowers the risk that both men and women will become victims of violence, including domestic violence.
– Married people live longer and healthier lives.
– Children lead healthier, longer lives if parents get and stay married.
– Married men and women are less depressed, less anxious, and less psychologically.distressed than single, divorced, or widowed Americans.
– Married people are more likely to have a sex life.

Here’s an interesting article too which explores the influence of age gaps between spouses

http://www.demogr.mpg.de/en/press/1813.htm

@mattbrowne Well at the very least it can be said that important emotions sometimes exist for different reasons than they’re used for. The best example is anxiety. I saw Robert Sapolsky give a talk on stress. As it turns out, the stress response evolved to temporarily put long-term processes on hold while the body gave short-term reactions an extra boost if we were in immediate danger—for instance running from a lion. Contemporarily we now turn the stress response on for long-periods of time when we’re worrying about our jobs, work, the economy, 30-year mortgages and so forth. As a result, we’re making ourselves sick because all of these processes which are supposed to function only short-term are being run indefinitely. We weaken our heart and immune system, stunt our growth, and destroy our reproductive systems—all because of an emotion that evolved naturally. That an emotion evolved naturally is no indication that its primary modern use is important or non-destructive.

@lapilofu – Good points!

its almost the same as monopoly:)