NSFW (Rape Question strong stomachs only) Which of these two behaviors is more shocking (see details)?

I honestly don’t see what you are asking… Why would the man hold her down? I have no idea, but both acts are very violent and terrible, I don’t think they should be compared.

I think this fairly “common” behavior from things I’ve read – particularly in cases of adolescent gang rape. It is appalling, but it doesn’t shock me. I guess some guys get off on witnessing the cruelty and enabling it.

Every time I hear a story like this I have a hard time wrapping my head around it. Rape is something that I find very hard to understand, how you could do that to another person. But what can he possibly “gain” from holding her down for the other guy? Reminds me of that couple in Canada, was it Bernardo and Homolka? Twisted.

@Arp I guess what I’m asking is what would allow someone to assist someone else in raping a woman. The rape is horrible enough. Helping another person to do that is just beyond me.

Think of the term, Partners in Crime. Usually, one has a degree of charisma, and the other has a weaker personality and is influenced by the other one. I’ve witnessed it between two co-workers (both male), and it reached the point where it got out of control, and both were terminated.

@Adirondackwannabe You are a very compassionate man and I am envious you have been able to live such a peaceful and preserved life till now. I am not saying what happened to that poor woman is not heinous and awful because it certainly was, but there are bad, sick and evil people out there…lots of them that do lots of bad, sick and evil things.

@Cruiser I guess leading a nice pleasant life has it’s drawbacks. These were two college students raping another student. I can’t process the thought process or lack thereof. They were hanging out in the dorm and the one guy had to decide between going out and playing pool or helping his buddy f**k up the life of the woman down the hall? That just is beyond me to figure out.
@Arp I think both acts were the same. She got raped, both are charged with it and I hope they throw the book at both of them.

@Adirondackwannabe If I were King…punishment would not only fit the crime it would duplicate the crime.

@Cruiser glad people like you aren’t kings. These guys are scumbags, but if rape is wrong, it’s equally wrong to rape the rapists… Lock those fuckers up and throw away the key.

As to the motivations behind the actions of the guy who held the girl down, I think @Pied_Pfeffer has it right. He’s likely the “lackey” friend who gets push around by his buddy, and does what he’s told to get acceptance. On one level I actually feel a bit sorry for him (because the rape almost certainly wasn’t his idea) and on pretty much every other level he’s a total piece of shit who deserves the same fate as the guy who did the raping.

I’m not sure the partners in crime thing applies in this case. They were both college students and the crime happened in early September. They may not have been together long enough for that kind of a relationship to develop, is one thing I’m thinking. They both were from NYC, so it is possible they knew each other before.

The second student who abetted the rapist is just as guilty. He had prior knowledge that a crime was about to be committed and did nothing to prevent it, stop it or report it. He could have told his buddy he’d call the police if he made any move toward the girl’s room. He could have told the girl. He could have run screaming into the hallway yelling “Rape!” He could have called the police. Not only did he not do any of those things, he then abetted the commission of the crime. Every step of the way he had the ability to prevent the crime from occurring. He’s just as much of a rapist as if he actually penetrated the victim himself. I’m inclined to think that he’s a sexual sadist and obviously enjoyed watching the rape and the suffering of the victim whether he actually personally performed any sex act during the assault.

He’s probably a rapist who is working his way up. I’m sure most rapist just work their way up to the actual act once the minor stuff doesn’t give the same thrill any more.

It makes me wonder if they were planning to take turns and swap roles. During a gang-rape a victim is very rarely raped only once, unles the gang is interrupted.

One of the men had sex with the woman. One of the men held her down. Both raped her.

These behaviors don’t shock me. It shocks me when people rape infants and toddlers.

So, let’s think about this. Guy #2 was: 1.) Waiting for his turn. 2.) An enabler. 3.) A man who liked to watch. As many have pointed out, he is still a partner in the crime.

@Simone_De_Beauvoir Then do not read this: It happened 5 miles from where I live.

@Simone_De_Beauvoir Pretty much any sexual violence is beyond me, but I guess throw in the children and it is unfathomable.

@Pied_Pfeffer I won’t, I get too angry.

Really be careful about reading that. It’s extremely disturbing.

Just to clarify, I understand what happened. What I can’t get my head around is why a third party would help someone raping a woman, or anyone for that matter. A little more info: They weren’t interrupted and they released the victim after the rapist was finished.

@Adirondackwannabe

Why can you wrap your head around the man who had intercourse, but not this?

Besides, you shouldn’t be able to. When you can understand violent sexual behavior, that’s when you need to worry.

He got some sort of satisfaction from it, or was emotionally or physically controlled by the other guy, or stupid, or waiting his turn…but he got something out of it.

@iamthemob I guess I’m trying to figure out which one is sickest if that makes sense. I can’t get my head around either act.

@Adirondackwannabe

It’s a futile exercise in depravity. You don’t need to know which one is more sick at this point. Follow the story if you’re interested. But when a person is violated in such a vicious manner, any participation, regardless of excuse, makes you morally culpable. The varying level and surrounding situation may make you understandable, even forgivable…but you will always be morally culpable.

I think you’re confusing rape with sex, and that’s why you’re having a hard time getting your head around it. This was not about sex for either man, it was about violence. Both men committed a violent act against a women. Rape has more to do with power, control and domination than with sex. One held her down (dominating and controlling her); the other raped her (dominating and controlling her).

@GladysMensch Thanks for putting the guy holding her down in context for me.I understand the violence thing for the rapist, I just couldn’t frame it for the guy holding her down. I think I understand, but that doesn’t make it easier to stomach. He didn’t have to rape her because he probably got the same thing out of the attack. What an awful thing to do to someone. And now they probably put the woman through hell again. The arrest just occurred, the attack occurred Sept 11 2009.